Fallon Fox - Is This Legalised Hate Crime?

[NickAndNora]

gendertrender.wordpress.com/2014/09/18/fallon-fox-why-hormones-dont-make-a-woman/

(Warning - The link contains descriptions and images of violence inflicted upon a woman)

Is it right that a transwoman with a history of homophobia towards lesbian women is given a forum in which to inflict violence upon those women? Reading this article I am left with the following thoughts -

1 - It is never fair for a transwoman to compete against women in sport.
2 - Fallon Fox is the transactivist threat of violence towards women come to life.
3 - The law and the media are putting transwomen's rights above women's safety. Transwomen need separate rights that do not infringe upon women's safety.
4 - Nicola Adams, a fabulous role model for women and lesbian and bisexual women, manages to be a boxer and maintain a cheery and friendly disposition. Does Fallon Fox's aggressive, threatening attitude reveal male socialisation?
5 - For some men is transgenderism a refuge from their failure to succeed amongst men - beta male to alpha female?

It's the logic of the thing isn't it.

It's all fucked up.

In practice it means that you can sit there with a woman BF a newborn that she carried in her womb and tell her that based on one measurement of one hormone she's not female.

Everyone in the entire world knows the difference between male and female it's the most fundamental identifier there is, mammals, reptiles, even plants have male and female - the people who like to drown female babies in buckets or marry them off when they are 7 know damn well what the difference is between male and female.

I can only hope that this is a stage where trans people + everyone else are trying to get to grips with rights / balance / etc and the whole situation will right itself. As some of the things happening at the moment are clearly preposterous.

Annie - isn't it just as valid to say in that case whichever genitals you were born with determines your sex for sport? AIS women are women because they were born with female genitals and socialised as women, vs. transwomen who generally even went through puberty as male?

Just as fair - perhaps even fairer because it's a lottery not an adult choice?

ChunkyPickle - well, I'd go further and say that the genitals you're born with determine your sex for absolutely everything, but that sex shouldn't matter in terms of the clothes you choose to wear, the job you choose to do or the people you like to sleep with and whether your outward appearance tends more towards the "masculine" or "feminine" end of the spectrum. But we both know that it's not as simple as that and that a great many people disagree. And I'm not arrogant enough to think that my opinion matters more on the subject that theirs. (you understand I'm sure that I'm not saying that you are arrogant or believe your opinion is the right one either)

Oh absolutely - and I have no good solutions to the tricky bits of the problem at all (or, TBH, a great deal of interest in most sports).

However at the extremes I do think that opinions are clearer, and I think that both Fallon, and the Indian runner are both bad calls on the part of the governing bodies.

Lol - thinking about it, obviously I think my opinion is the right one - but I am open to good arguments to the contrary (and historically have totally changed my opinion upon new evidence)

"Either way, to use your superior strength, no matter how it was gained, to inflict brutal and unnecessary injury on another person to make a political point, even within the framework of a violent sport, is well, unsporting, and makes you a shit person no matter which gender you choose to wear."

This.

But, you don't have to threaten violence to be transphobic, only to refuse to acknowledge their perceived reality when it is in conflict with your own.

I'm sorry I find this really offensive. Because they are 100% refusing to accept my perceived reality (as someone who has actually been a woman since the day she was born) and no one is saying they are "woman phobic" (misogynist).

I agree Weasel, I find that statement very offensive. Their "perceived reality" is not in conflict with "my own" but with actual reality. Do we also have to acknowledge that a 6 stone anorexic is fat?

Agreed Weasel. If two perceived realities are in conflict why shouldn't my one win out? - Seeing as how winning out seems to be necessary.

Oh, because hierarchy, because domination of discourse, because sex. Patriarchy.

Because penis.

succinct, weasel. I like it.

But, you don't have to threaten violence to be transphobic, only to refuse to acknowledge their perceived reality when it is in conflict with your own.

So if I decided that I felt like a cat, for example, ate whiskas and stuck on a tail I could expect everyone to acknowledge I am a cat, regardless of the actual reality of the situation?

Precisely MoreCrack. As I said earlier, I could call my dog an elephant. It wouldn't make it one even if said dog had a delusion he was an elephant.

As we're coming to believe that actually there is no such thing as a male or female brain, where will that leave trans people?

We are coming to believe that weasel but then I think we always have, I'm not sure that the rest of the world generally is though

And TBH I don't really mind what trans people get up to as long as they don't muck up the rights of women born women in order to do it. And TBF most trans people aren't interested in fucking women over either it just seems to be this hateful violent minority who are making such a lot of noise.

As we're coming to believe that actually there is no such thing as a male or female brain, where will that leave trans people?

The same place it leaves women: traumatised by being brutally, forcefully shoehorned into bullshit harmful gender roles that are wholly arbitrary and unrelated to sex.

So if I decided that I felt like a cat, for example, ate whiskas and stuck on a tail I could expect everyone to acknowledge I am a cat, regardless of the actual reality of the situation?

Have you never heard of otherkin?

BTW I should warn you that comparing trans to otherkin is regarded as massively transphobic so you should probably not use the "if I say I'm a cat..." example online, ever.

Everything is massively transphobic except the complete and unquestioning capitulation to every whim expressed by a trans person.

Yes, I have heard of the kinds of people who are now calling themselves otherkin. I've even worked with one. Every single piece of training I've ever had has told me not to collude with people's delusions. So I won't. Because it is harmful to them in the long run.