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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Can we talk about female violence? I need to get my response straight

357 replies

GrassIsSinging · 13/05/2014 21:53

I know this is celeb rubbish, but am finding my blood boiling over comments from FB friends and the like over the Solange Knowles -punching-Jay Z debacle.

Lots of seemingly conscious, smart, reasonable people condemning violence of any sort (great, agreed), but then saying things like 'the double standards in society sicken me...Chris brown beats Rihanna and he is a monster...Solange attacks Jay Z and people dont respond in the same way'. Others (people I thought were decent) saying 'You couldnt have blamed him for hitting back...people have a right to defend themselves' etc.

This riles me massively. Am I a freak for thinking that male violence against women IS often (not always, but very often) much more devastating than vice versa? Because men are usually physically stronger...because male violence against women is a huge problem in this world...? And that a decent man will not hit a woman, even if provoked. Is this an 'old fashioned ' view now?

Feminism doesnt mean we now have to accept men punching us, ffs!

Depressed...

OP posts:
OutsSelf · 28/05/2014 23:49

Ha ha ha, I'm gutted, obviously. Being told off for not being practical by someone who proposes

simply changing the nature of humans

and

we could develop a human hive-mind

Anarchist communities and organisations work and function now, you just fancy yourself Picard to the borg queen or something.

ignorant and over-privileged compatriots

From an American, surely the most problematically privileged people on the earth? In a country with the lowest general level of foreign policy awareness in the free world? ODFOD

OutsSelf · 28/05/2014 23:53

consensual decision making

the whole way you run and chair meetings totally changes, it doesn't go, one speaker, answer, lots of hands go up for lots of responses... there are structures around how things are answered and throughout the meeting everyone is communicating their response through agreed signals indicating consensus, dissensus, problem, etc.

OutsSelf · 28/05/2014 23:59

The basic structure of public discourse is totally changed from I speak, you argue, the most verbose or forceful argument wins to

I raise, you raise, he raises, she raises, we have xyz needs to meet around this issue, what solution for x, what solution for y, what solution for z

OutsSelf · 29/05/2014 00:01

You don't have to agree a position, but you agree on what actions you'll participate in or support and have autonomy to take actions yourself

OutsSelf · 29/05/2014 00:02

I loved the relationships in the Utopia in Woman on the Edge, but I read it in my twenties in the middle of a horrid one. Perhaps I want to go back to it...

scallopsrgreat · 29/05/2014 20:42

Sorry Outself I lost this thread today. Thats really interesting. Thank you. It's piqued my curiosity about anarchism.

Can I ask do you find it takes longer to make a decision because it's more collaborative?

OutsSelf · 30/05/2014 22:28

Right, sorry to dally on this, have been tres busy in RL

So, I'd have to say I'm not really sure about the difference in time it takes to get things organised and decided in anarchist meetings. My sense is that it is quicker but I think that is related to the way that the actual experience of anarchist meetings is they are not soul crushing exercises in putting up with the endless pontifications of some entitled fuckwit. I'm sure you know the type Wink Because when someone is speaking during one, you are during that speech making an indication of your response to it, there are agreed signals that you use (a hand nod for consensus, for example) and if you need to respond to something directly, you have a special hand signal for that, and if you have a question, you have a hand signal for that, and if you have further information, etc etc. In this sense, the discussion becomes one in which you participate all the time.

This means you don't have to go back and vote on shit that's already clearly in consensus, and the person facilitating, which is quite a skill btw, is organising the responses for efficiency and clarity. It's pretty efficient, but it might also be that time doesn't feel like it's standing still while you are still remembering that you must respond to x point made ten minutes ago, and also you want to say something about this... etc etc. Then people proposing solutions will be like, so I'm going to write this blogpost and say x on it, anyone wanting to collaborate, and someone else will say, we still need to do something about the issue y raised, and someone will offer a solution, and others interested in that action will usually say they will join in that, etc. People form themselves into teams around actions and decisions those teams take are made transparent, with the idea that if you have something to say about a decision you'll go and work with the team in order to get whatever it is you are raising met.

You've got to remember that the whole ethos of such a space is that if you see something needs doing you just do it or you raise it to get it done. You don't have to have permission to join teams or groups doing specific actions and there is real care taken when a certain action is not fully supported by everyone that people are allowed to distance themselves from actions etc.

Do you know those threads on MN when someone needs to formulate a response to a toxic relation, or a difficult work situation etc, and like a million posters come in and work on it - they nearly always end in a really simple, clear and healthy response from the OP where she's untangled her shit and is really clear about what she is or is not saying? It's a bit like that, but quicker and less placemarky.

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