School uniform rule - girls not allowed trousers

[Fisharefriendsnotfood]

I'm wondering if I can call on the collective wisdom of you good people to help me construct my argument in the best way.

Dd (5) and yr 1 attends a local R.C primary school that I am more than happy with. She suffers from recurrent thrush and this year I noticed that when she wore tights under her pinafore it seemed to exasperate the problem. I checked the school prospectus for details because I have never seen a girl in trousers at the school and it states that girls must wear a pinafore or skirt as school uniform..

I then emailed the head and explained the issue and asked for clarification on the rules and she said that the last time the issue came before the chair of governors they decided not to introduce trousers as part of the girls uniform. She was very sympathetic and pleasant and said that if I got a doctors letter perhaps she.could allow it.

Now, there is no way dd would wear trousers if no one else was and I also feel that this would high light the issue / invite questions into something that is no one else's business.

So if you are still with me, I want to get the issue raised again with the chair of governors because I cannot think of any valid reason in this day and age why girls should not wear trousers if the want to. I have to speak at a parent voice meeting and if I can muster enough support the issue will be on the agenda of the next governors meeting where I can present my argument.

Where to start? Can anyone offer pointers?

Sorry for the essay

Shocking how many people seem to support the importance of "tradition" trumping equality!

Bloomers are traditional. Let them wear bloomers.

I attended a secondary school where girls had to wear a gym skirt even in winter while the boys wore track suit bottoms!
I don't know how they get away with it tbh!

Mind you lots of boys up to the age of around 11 are forced to wear shorts all winter long (at private schools). Must be freezing. At least the girls can wear tights.

Again - all to do with parents and school wanting the children to look "traditional private school".

Just wanted to say good luck OP. I suspect dd will want to wear trousers when she starts school. Thankfully the school her older brother is at allows both sexes to wear pretty much anything if it's in the school colours and practical.

It's not dd's job to look 'sweet', she needs practical warm clothes that let her get on with learning. And I'm sure will look adorable anyway just like all the current Reception kids.

This 'they look so sweet in their pinafores' type argument is infuriating! Basically saying girls are ornamental, boys are allowed to be practical. Also, why the hell would girls have shinier trousers than boys? Ludicrous.

OP, if you're still making your list I'd add 'Hygiene' as a hint towards the thrush. Then if anyone asks you can say lots of girls are prone to it and make them uncomfortable.
I got it loads in school and we weren't allowed trousers. I can't believe gym knickers are still a thing. Such pervy items.

Suggest you include the sun issue - dresses don't cover up legs the way trousers do, and women are most prone to getting skin cancer on arms and legs.

I'm also going to mention some girls going through puberty quite young and getting their period at school, a difficult self-conscious time and they are bound to be more comfortable in trousers

I have a To Do list a mile long but I have been sucked into this thread. OMG. I simply don't understand why other parents, other WOMEN, would ponce on about "tradition". Here is what my action plan would be:

1. Start informally canvassing other parents, particularly the mothers of girls as it sounds like your school has weird boy-parents.
2. Depending on the results of Point 1 above, consider making the email you send one in the joint names of a number of other, like-minded parents.
3. Similarly, try to speak to some of the teachers, including the head, and get them to give their views. I imagine as teachers they would prefer the practical solution of girls wearing trousers. Again, if you can, add these names to your email.
4. Consider an actual presentation or formal document presenting your case. This could include a summary of the legal status or any EU/national guidelines, a scathing dismissal of the "tradition" argument by figuring out what the uniforms were for boys and girls at your school 50 years ago (or some similar example); a clear indication of the increased cost of girls needing to wear tights etc.
5. Based on your conversations in 1 and 3, prepare a FAQ to go along with your document. Provide the so-called concerns raised by others and answer each and every one with a clear and concise dismissal (often this will simply mean repeating whatever was said in your original document).
6. Request the opportunity to present your argument in case. Check the by laws of your school and under what conditions you can attend. If necessary, volunteer as a governor or other parent-volunteer to get on there.

Good luck. I think this is appalling.

Great post working, thanks

Thanks to all of you. I don't feel super confident about fighting this, but am so appalled that I will iykwim..

I have been a sahm for years now so haven't prepared any kind of formal document, articulated an argument etcetera for donkeys..

Any and all help will be gratefully appreciated desperately needed

I had a run in with the HT in my DD's school on exactly this about 5 years ago. (I recall it was discussion of the day on here!)

The head made some comment about 'If you want to dress your daughter like a boy that's up to you, but I'm not changing the whole school uniform to accommodate it' (We went to a different school in the end)

I think it is ridiculous that we try to impose this on children at that age - it only serves to reinforce that girls are there to be pretty, not practical.

Anyhow, do you think your DD would be any better with skirt and cotton leggings if you can't get the uniform change?

Personally, I would not mention the thrush, it would be very hard to ensure that this were not talked about and I am sure your dd would not want this known, and as you say, she will only wear trousers if others do.

I would ask the governors why there is this rule. My guess is that they will say they have always done it, it looks smart etc etc.

Then I would write with your clear succinct arguments as to why in 21st Century Britain it is unacceptable to make girls wear skirts. I would also threaten to get OFSTED involved. I am no big fan of OFSTED but they must be good for something.

I think in this day and age to force girls to wear skirts is, at best, old fashioned and unhelpful and pretty cruel at worst. Lots of kids like to wear trousers, my DD never wears skirts.

The reasons why girls should be able to wear trousers:
*Simple equality, why should girls be forced to reveal their legs or wear long skirts which hinder walking and activities.
*Trousers are more comfortable (if they were not why would men wear them almost all the time and the majority of women wear them a lot of the time!)
*Trousers are warmer in winter
Trousers look just as smart as skirts
There is utterly no reason to Make girls wear skirts, By not allowing girls to wear trousers they are forcing girls to wear skirts and reveal their legs! (My blood is boiling)

If this falls on deaf ears I would bring out ...
*Trousers are more 'modest' in the sense that when girls run around and play and are wearing trousers other people cannot see their knickers, which in this day and age when concerns about people looking at girls etc are so rife would make it monumentally more sensible to me.

If female teachers wear trousers at the school I cannot see how they can argue girls should not.

Hope you get the right answer (I think in many places girls would have the right to wear trousers as part of religious dress)

Plus read this, I am sure the school would not want negative publicity!

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-126456/School-face-court-girls-wear-trousers.html

Also see this www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/1164501-Girls-not-allowed-to-wear-trousers-to-school-anyone-with-experience/AllOnOnePage

Let us know how you get on. Just make it clear the issue is not going away and get some friends on board, but do not mention medical or other issues as these will not be the same for other kids/mums/dads.

Good luck.

Great post WorkingBling.

I'm just horrified, I led a rebellion at my secondary in 1990 in order to have girls allowed to wear trousers to school, I am absolutely horrified 24 years on school still have this stupid and archaic rule.

Would it not come back to the question that boys are not allowed wear skirts though if you argue the gender discrimination?

But men don't wear skirts in normal everyday life and boys don't tend to wear skirts at home / out of school. Girls / women do wear trousers

True but can they not argue that they are discriminating against both genders and by doing so are being fair.

I am totally not defending it btw it is a genuine question we do not have the rule in dds school however all the girls secondary school would have no trouser rules and they are mostly single sex (not UK) so no gender policy. It has never really occurred to me to be bothered about it because of the nasty colours uniforms tend to be and how awful the trousers look on boys and girls but I am all for freedom of choice.

ANother, my argument in the 90s was based around there being nothing in the uniform rules that stated boys couldn't wear skirts.

It s'more complicated than that now obviously, as people have the legal right to choose to live as the other gender don't they?

Sorry that was not at all the correct way to put that.

Pm me if you like. I kind of do this kind of thing for a living (not uniforms but putting together this type of action plan with arguments, etc)

I am currently going through a "stand up and be counted" phase after years of not being able to say what I think publicly because of where I used to work. Would be happy to help!

Oh, and when you do the document, make it public! Then they can't dismiss you.

I agree with the modesty point - in a mixed school it means that sitting cross legged, cart-wheels etc means flashing pants, however I would be loathe to use it in your argument. When I raised the issue with the head teacher at my DD's school, she looked at me as if I was some sort of deviant looking for paedophiles on every corner.

I would be of the same view with the health and hygiene argument - whilst valid, I don't think you need to raise it.

If I was preparing a paper, I would focus on

1. gender equality / respect for diversity (to include religious beliefs). Some good stated cases and examples from other fields would help. For example, less than 20 years ago, police women were only allowed to wear trousers on night duty, and had to wear skirts during the day. Not only was it freezing, expensive in terms of tights, but it was also completely impracticable - ever tried chasing someone or climbing over a gate in a pencil skirt? But the main thing it did was to reinforce the idea that women officers were there in an ornamental and caring capacity. It was later introduced that female officers could choose trousers or skirt (almost all chose trousers) and now the police service uniform doesn't even have skirts except for ceremonial occasions (and even then it is a choice). Use of some good pictures of then and now - for example, police officers, nursing staff (50's uniform vs the scrubs style uniforms worn now), this ruling on Asianic Airlines demonstrates that even Korea is moving with the times.

1. Comfort and practicality - warmth, wearability.

I would then address possible arguments against, which are likely to be:

Trousers will look cheap and nasty - counter this by stating that there is no evidence for this - provide some good examples of smart looking trousers, both for school kids, and also in other fields - for example I think this is a great picture of Michelle Obama

Skirts are traditional - easy to counter - see arguments above

So, a text has been sent to parents asking if they have a view on children wearing trousers to contact the head directly..

I have written to my M.P and ofstead but not had a response. Need to sit down one night this week and write my argument to be presented at the meeting.

Good luck, Fisharefriends. I honestly don't believe the school can maintain this ridiculous policy.

Got a reply from Ofstead saying it's outside of their legal remit and they can't comment