BBC Sports Personality of the year - the shortlist

[NorthernLurker]

Announced yesterday - 10 men, 2 women. Now is it me or is that a woefully poor number of women on the shortlist? Last year there were 5. In 2011 there was a fuss about the all male list and a BBC statement said "The current system was introduced in 2006 and at least two women have always previously been shortlisted for the main award" So the system was changed and this year, the second year it's been in operation two women have been shortlisted.....is that the minimum they reckon they can get away with

From memort I think the women's cricket team had a successful ashes too - but no nomination for one of the team there. Who would you want to have see nominated?

[Panzee]

I think racing is cruel but that's not my issue with it.
There is no league, knockout comp etc. it's all about betting. If it wasn't for the gamblers we wouldn't hear about it.

[Metebelis3]

slim with respect, the people who don't agree, while entitled to be wrong, are, nonetheless, wrong.

[Metebelis3]

ivy exactly. It's almost as if the people in this thread don't know much about sport, isn't it? (Although at least that's something they have in common with the people who selected the shortlist).

[Metebelis3]

Panzee Yep. It's just a gambling facilitator, but even if it wasn't, it's not competitive, it's not international, it's not representative. And the horses do all the work. Darts and snooker are both more of a sport than racing. Show jumping (also cruel) is more of a sport than racing.

[Slimchance]

With respect, that's still your opinion Metelis!

And Panzee racing is not all about betting (and there is lots of money flowing around in other sports too which doesn't seem to invalidate their legitimacy).

Very busy today so sadly signing off this thread now. Just hope AP wins! I'm a huge fan. Not many athletes break virtually every bone in their body and are still at the top of their game at 39 yrs old.

[Slimchance]

It's not competitive? It's not international?

There are highly competitive races all over the world: Europe, Australia, America, the Middle East.

Signing off now in despair!

[ivykaty44]

Mete - its amazing at the end of that clip of racing how close they were to the Canadian team.

The scratch race where Laura attacks and goes off the front to make sure she won gold in the ominum was fab

[Panzee]

Come on England in the Horse World Cup...

[ivykaty44]

two woman won gold and silver in the ITU world championships

have you heard of Rachael Yankey? The Queen has
bet you haven't!

[sashh]

where have you been

Watching the BBC probably

[ivykaty44]

well you weren't watching the bbc on 1 November or the 3 november then where you

[Metebelis3]

slim I think we could all tell you are a huge fan of McCoy.

He's not the athlete. The horses are. He's a passenger. HTH.

[Metebelis3]

Ivy again - exactly. Cycling is an international sport, not a domestic entertainment - and of course, the women and men who compete are representing their countries not financial interests. But apparently sitting on a horse makes you an athlete

[Metebelis3]

Ivy I'm not a huge fan of Rachel because of REASONS (#COYS ) but her achievements (and before her, Marianne Spacey's acheivements) cannot be denied despite that whole spawn of the devil faustian pact they signed.

I'm generally not wildly supportive of footballers being nominated for SPOTY though, tbh.

[Metebelis3]

Sashh I don't watch sport on the BBC a whole lot (I watch in person, often) but I listen to sport all the time on, primarily, 5Live, and womens' sport is certainly represented. And has been for decades.

[ivykaty44]

and of course, the women and men who compete are representing their countries not financial interests

not true Katie Archibold represented a trade team at the world cup in manchester for example and the Australian team raced against their own country men who were in a trade team

[Metebelis3]

Ivy and the road-racing is all financially motivated too, yes. But the World and Eurropean champs are properly representational. There is nothing in horse racing to compare.

[CuntyBunty]

Am I being thick? There is now a guest blog about SPOTY. What is the point of that when we have this thread? I know there aren't any rules about duplicating threads, but why does an unoriginal guest blog get pride of place up at the top?

[NorthernLurker]

I noticed that too Hey if it's worth saying, it's worth saying twice

[MillyMollyMama]

Mete...you are sadly very uninformed about what a national hunt jockey actually does and how an equine athlete can display courage, fluidity, accuracy and pure athleticism as they compete. Do you really think controlling 500kg of steeplechaser going at 30 mph over stiff birch fences about 5ft high easy? It's just sitting on a horse is it? Horses are amazing creatures. Racing bikes, cars and yachts are amazing machines. I like watching cycling from time to time and who could not have enjoyed the Olympics but why do people have to be so disparaging about sports that other people enjoy? Really, what do you get out of it?

Possibly Laura Trott should have been nominated and cycling is a justifiably popular sport right now but most people view it in Olympic years. The same applies to curling and many other sports.

Also, I do not get why people get so fussed about sport played by women against other women. We have top class women in equestrian sport competing directly against the men and being equal eg 3 day event, show jumping. I support a 2nd division football team that are pretty mediocre, I watch amateur point to point racing, I watch jump racing from October to April. I love watching great motor sport. I listen to radio 5 most days but..... Some of the women's football has been of a very low standard and it did not justify the amount of coverage it got. The England team in the Euros was a disgrace. A low skill level and too many mistakes. Also I don't feel I need to know who every single women competing in women's sport is. I will know some and not others. I have my favourite sports and other people have theirs so we can all score points about who knows who in X sport. Hardly anyone has named a raft of high achieving women this year. Given that the net now must include women and para/disability sport, there are probably loads of world champions missing from minority sports.

[Butkin]

Metebelis - what are you going on about. Racing (the 2nd most watched sport in Britain after football) is totally international. There were 4 British trained winners at the Breeders' Cup in LA earlier this month (the World Thoroughbred Championships) and we're sending 8 horses from UK to race in the Turf Championships in Hong Kong next week. Red Cadeaux, trained in Newmarket, was 2nd in the world's richest race ($10 Million Dubai World Cup - where there is no betting) and the A$6 Million Dollar Melbourne Cup. in AP McCoy (over jumps) and Ryan Moore (on the flat) we have the greatest jockeys in the world. AP is probably the finest jockey of any generation and is a total athlete!

[Metebelis3]

Horses are indeed amazing creatures, and racing is cruel. That's all there is to it. It should be banned and it will be banned within 20 years hopefully. Almost all racing is domestic, most jockeys don't race outside this country and even those that do (a tiny minority) are doing so for money not to represent their country. It's ridiculous to compare jockeys to real athletes.

The fanaticism with which racing fans seek to defend it is a bit also. When you consider the hoo hah there has been over the use of the whip in the last year or so, how can you deny there is a problem?

[MillyMollyMama]

There is currently few problems with whip abuse. The new rules were difficult to adhere to fir a while but there have been few problems recently and the rules are fair. Why do you think racing is cruel Metebelis? What would you suggest a thoroughbred does with its life? You seem to think that horses do not like racing. The vast majority love it. A horse that does not want to race, will refuse to do so. Some occasionally do just that. As the latest arrests show, betting, mostly abroad, is corrupting lower league football. You can bet on thousands of outcomes, politics, names of Royal babies etc so betting is not always corrosive.

Mete . Please do not think that spectacularly uninformed people like you will ever get rid of racing. It employs a lot of people, is enjoyed by millions and is not cruel. Horse welfare is a top priority for all in the sport. Why is sport only about representing your country? How bizarre is this notion? Does that mean we cannot enjoy Arsenal v Tottenham because the players are not all English? We enjoy the sport! There are not good sports and bad sports. Some of us love racing, some might love boxing, fencing, shooting, archery, table tennis etc. Does it matter as long as it is competitive and high quality?

[MillyMollyMama]

Panzee. I forgot to say that all horses are ranked according to ability. The top ones will compete against each other in the Championship races at the Cheltenham Festival in March . There is no knockout competition as such, but throughout the season horses are competing in races to see if they are good enough to go to Cheltenham.

In flat racing there are similar championship races both here and abroad. I still do not understand why you think racing is cruel. I assume you have never actually been? Do you think any form of equestrian sport is ok? Or should we just ban horses from any type of competition?

[Panzee]

Millollymama that's very interesting about the ranking, thank you.