The Feminist Pub is Open - Chat, Rant, or pull up a chair here!

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

This thread started when we all decided to imagine what the perfect local for feminists would be like. So far, it has taps with plenty of good real ale, and some decent non-alcoholic alternatives too. There are comfy chairs and there's a feminist film night, as well as lots of nice feminist-friendly books on the shelves and space to curl up and read. The open-mic nights are attracting feminist singers and comedians, and we're just sorting out the feminist creche.

Please come along, draw up a stool, and have a good chat about whatever you fancy - as serious or as trivial as you like.

For starters, I have a half-pint of lemonade. What can I get anyone?

Go ahead and ask Gnawer. Just don't assume we will know the answers!

I actually really like theory, although I still have a lot to learn.

Mignotte - In reply to you upthread, I agree with what you said. And your thoughts do not appear unscattered or unformed at all.

I find with new feminist ideas, I usually have to read about them in a few different ways/articles, before I really get it.

That was definitely the idea of this thread, shrieking. Please do ask.

...a safe place to be a bit crap.

:o I know how you feel. It's why I mostly lurk, I've found it's the way I learn best, by listening and asking questions where necessary.

Ok first question. Rather a boring one. What one book would you recommend I read?

Well that's a safe question! People on here queue up to recommend Cordelia Fine's book, and also Moran's.

I enjoyed reading Cordelia Fine. She has a lot to say about how what we're told is 'science' in the media is actually more complex. Stuff like, that the media will report 'amazing story, girls and boys are totally different!' and you'll find the research said more like 'um, well ... we actually assumed boys and girls would be different, so, uh ... well, we think we didn't fiddle the results, honest ...'.

For hard theory, the thing I found easiest was Shiela Jeffries' 'The Beauty Myth'. Some of it is hard going - partly because it was written in a different climate and I find some of the things she's sure of hard to agree with. But most of it I found really thought-provoking and interesting.

Andrea Dworkin is good to read, but I find her easiest in small quantities.

Oh! And Gail Dines' Pornland - I've not read all of it or even most of it, but it is really punchy. It comes with a 'this can be quite upsetting' warning, though.

And if you want something fun, read 'Letters of a Fainthearted Feminist'. Brilliant.

Of course! I forgot that one but kim is spot on as usual.

YY, I agree. I am not a great reader of texts, but often I've nerved myself up to read something theoretical and complex, and I have realized that the ideas don't seem new and radical - because someone here has already used them without even making me realize it was a theoretical framework they were using.

I feel the same. I am just so fed up that it seems as if MN may be changing quite a lot, and while that's the decision of MNHQ, it is sad for those of us who benefitted and valued it.

Yes LRD I agree. And I think that is why there was such an outcry about AF. That is what those bemused couldn't understand, and it seemed to take MNHQ by total surprise.

Absolutely.

radfem.org/

This link takes you to various free feminist books that can be downloaded. I haven't read them all. But personally I love Catherine MacKinnon's Only Words. John Stoltenberg's Refusing to be a Man is aimed at men.

I think different people take to different authors though.

I personally can't stand the f word blog.

I'm not familiar with it, but I think what is nice is a load of recommendations so you can find your own way.

I will now be going into what I call a reading coma. It makes me oblivious to everything around me. I bought 3 of the recommended books. Have read Caitlin Moran and Wifework. Liked one lots, hated the other and it made me very cross!

Really struggling to find something for DD to read without it containing chapters on how to shave your legs.

I didn't realise for a long time that facebook has lots of feminist facebooks of all different kinds of hues of feminism.

Me either. For a very long time I thought I was doing it all wrong, then I realize is it perfectly normal to find your own niche.

shriek - go into that reading coma! Which did you hate?!

Catherine MacKinnon's Sexual Politics is fab - especially if you start with the last section, which dissects willy-waving authors like DH Lawrence to hilarious effect.

I heard Gail Dines speak about porn last year - what she had to say was so grim (but powerful) I actually thought I might be sick, or cry.