How women make career choices

[fishwithoutabicycle]

Hi- this is my first post in feminism, but I'm a long time lurker. I've recently been making some career decisions of my own after leaving teacher training. The thread about women's confidence in the workplace has also got me thinking about this. I've been wondering whether women should take the likelihood of discrimination due to gender/having kids into account when choosing a career. Or whether we should just pick what we enjoy and think we would be good at and work as hard as we can to succeed?

I don't like the idea that we should have to make decisions about our careers due to our gender, but equally if we pursue a career we really want and then hit the glass ceiling very quickly then we aren't likely to feel happy with our careers either.

I had been thinking about a career in academia, but have now pretty much decided against it (due to a number of different reasons). I had been really concerned that I might invest lots of years (masters +phd+ short term contracts) and then never be able to get a permanent post. I know this issue isn't exclusive to women in academia, but from what I've read it can be more difficult for women (I'm thinking about things I've read on here and also things like this article www.guardian.co.uk/higher-education-network/blog/2012/may/24/why-women-leave-academia

I've now decided on a career in a different area ,which is quite male dominated (mainly at the top-I can't seem to find any that aren't!) , but where after a few years experience there are lots of options- the possibility of self employment or moving sideways into another professional role. I've just been wondering whether I am being sensible and realistic in my decisions or whether this is just another example of how women often have less confidence in their abilities? Would I have signed straight up for a masters/phd and just assumed I would have a successful academic career if I had been male?

I'd be really interested to see what people think as I know there are lots of women in this section who are further into their careers and will have had more experience of these types of issues.

I have a PhD, did a postdoc, then decided to move into a new career path which used more of my skills. I enjoyed the PhD and the opportunity it gave me to learn various transferable skills, but I am glad I moved away from academia - it was the right decision for me. It was a hard decision, because I did feel a pressure to be one of the few women continuing (it was in a male-dominated subject), but I decided that my happiness was more important than proving a theoretical point!

I think you sound sensible and realistic. If you are genuinely interested in a particular subject, how about doing a part-time masters or PhD at some point?

From the most recent statistics I looked at, about 1 in 7 PhD students in the UK will get a lecturer position (this varies over time), compared to 40-50% entering PhD who envisage a career in academia. I don't think there is much of a gender difference in motivation - the more significant differences arise from subject or age variance. Establishing an academic career is certainly about hard work and having good mentors, but also can require frequent relocations, and this is tough for many people.

I have several friends in their early 30s grappling with the problems of short-term contracts, maternity leave and being in different countries from their partners. It is hard for men as well as women, and many people move out of academia or cannot find permanent jobs. I would always recommend that PhD students should have a serious Plan B, even if they are willing to be on short-term contracts until 35-40 years old. Academia is becoming more flexible, but it demands long hours and high levels of commitment. If you can imagine happily doing something outside of academia, it may well be worth pursuing that from the start.

I think 'women' is too big a generalization. What works for one person won't work for another.

I don't think the choice is only between looking at the likelihood of discrimination and avoiding those careers, or picking what we enjoy/are good at and working hard ... I think there's also things like getting informed about what rights we have, or even campaigning for more, or picking workplaces that have a good rep with women, that sort of thing.

I am even less far on that you, but what I'm noticing is that experiences vary hugely from place to place - if you're looking at academia, one university might be very different from another. Some have brilliant creche facilities, others almost none; some have faculties of people who're supportive of women, others have faculties of sexist twits.

I would guess it's similar in different workplaces across the same industry or business sector?

I'm in a technical field where women are desperately underrepresented. After graduating, I envisaged that I would be working for some small, geeky style company where I'd be surrounded by like-minded people.

What actually happened was that, in spite of a great degree and some further highly marketable skills, I ended up working for a corporate big shot - I suspect because they make an active effort to recruit women into technical roles, whereas every other interviewer I saw just eyed me with a slightly puzzled look on his face.

My current company employs 20% women among their technical staff. They're tremendously proud of this because it's a 75% increase over the last five years - thanks to a deliberate policy.

While getting more women into my field is something I feel passionate about, I couldn't possibly blame a young woman for not wanting to work in my area. Our HR office is great, but the amount of shit we put up with on a daily basis is simply mind boggling; it ranges from being the default coffee carrier for the whole team over 'enlightened' managers raving about how having a woman on the team immediately changes interpersonal dynamics to downright verbal harrassment. 'Networking', though often recommended to me, tends to result in being propositioned. My male co-workers think I'm a complete bitch - and I'm immeasurably proud that they do; at least I'm not a doormat.

I love what I do but despise the corporate world. Had I known that working for a global corporation would probably be my only shot at landing a technical role in my field as an UG student, I might have done something completely different.

That having been said: it is IMO inevitable that some of us have to bite the bullet in order for these types of jobs to become more accessible to women. I could not unreservedly recommend a career in my field to a young girl, but I'm incredibly proud every time one of them chooses this path nevertheless.