that 'chemical imbalance' myth

[Alameda]

so nice to see this notion that has been used to oppress and repress women for decades finally discussed as a dangerous myth - chemical imbalances and other black unicorns

although I despair at how sort of prevalent it is, how regressive and how effective it is at distracting women from the cultural determinants of their unhappiness

I thought it was extremely rare for an actual 'shortage of serotonin' to be implicated in manic depression (which I am supposed to have but can't take anything like an SSRI without becoming seriously unwell). obviously there are certain medications (for high blood pressure) which lower serotonin and make people depressed but that's slightly different

I was thinking more along the lines of the ways in which women were encouraged to develop dependence on benzos etc in the fifties, as a way of distracting them from the glaring inequalities that were making them unwell and of depression particularly which unsurprisingly women are encouraged to seek treatment for far more often than men

I have been told (by cpns not psychiatrists) to think of my bipolar/manic depression as a 'chemical imbalance' and countless people I have met through self help networks were similarly encouraged - yet despite all this emphasis on research into biological determinants (like it says in the blog) not one single treatment has been developed for bipolar! Not even one drug. If you put lithium to one side (as a naturally occurring element) everything else used to treat bipolar was developed for schizophrenia, epilepsy or depression - and the NICE guidelines discourage the use of antidepressants for obvious reasons (the manic switch)

but I'm straying from my original intent which was to see whether the chemical imbalance myth is particularly oppressive for women given the innately sexist history of psychiatry. It is worrying that people submit funding applications for research into the role of social support in, say, first episode psychosis and are declined while there genuinely has been research into gathering images of hedgehog brains. I think we need both but for women particularly, is it not profoundly depressing that we are still being told the problem is us and not the structural unfairness of society?

and anyway, if we MUST be so regressive then please can we get back to the days of hysteria and the prescriptions for masturbation? Treatment to which I could definitely commit.

Hmm... my understanding from speaking to various people and reading a couple of books (e.g. Richard Bentall's Madness Explained and Irving Kirsch's The Emperor's New Clothes) is that there is no real proof that a lack of seratonin causes depression. And even if there was, of course, that doesn't mean that the problem starts with the lack of seratonin - it could be that the sufferer had low seratonin as a result of life problems, rather than as a naturally occurring chemical imbalance.

Would be really interested to hear the views of any specialists on this.

Interesting post although I admit I didn't read all of the link

It's something that has been talked about on this topic a lot and I think is a really interesting issue.
How much of women's mental health problems are because well actually they are under a lot of pressure / have a shit life / have a terrible history / whatever. And actually this is never acknowledged it's all hormonal / chemical this and that.

So while I am sure there are people who have hormonal / chemical inbalances, most people with mental health problems have a reason for it in their lives. Of course giving them some pills to perk them up and keep them going is easier than anything else. And of course for many people with MH probs which are due to their situation, their situation isn't actually something that can be changed IYSWIM.

A poster on here worked in a secure mental health unit for girls and young women and she said that every single one of them had terribel stories of past sexual abuse. But that this aspect of them was not acknowledged / talked about and their behaviour was labelled disruptive / anti-social and diagnoses of BPD and similar followed. Rather than saying oh look these poor girls have been really fucked up by some right bastards now what can we do about that.

Oh god, that reminds me of the funeral of a young woman last year, she had been an inpatient in a unit for girls/young women with eating disorders and borderline personality disorder (the whole borderline thing is awful isn't it, what happened to the idea of reclassifying it as a sort of complex PTSD type thing? Was that a non starter?) and had a horrible horrible horrible life. None of which was even obliquely alluded to, it was as if this bright and happy child just quite inexplicably died tragically young instead of being abused, betrayed by the agencies who first failed to protect her then failed to respond to the disclosure and finally the mental health industry that labelled her as inherently wrong because she couldn't articulate her distress in any way other than the sort of self injurious

it's so awful, such a fucking preventable waste

Are you suggesting that someone on this sort of antidepressant doesn't need them, OP? Because that could be very dangerous.

I suffer depression, and last year, under my dr's supervision, I gradually reduced my dosage - and it still went very wrong, and I ended up having very dark, near-suicidal thoughts.

Had I stopped, full stop, I could have suffered even more.

Please be very careful about implying, even vaguely, that these medicines, which can be literal lifesavers, are not neccessary and are just medical professionals' way of ignoring women's real issues.

Alameda :(

There seems to be rather an unattractive right-wing agenda that favours attributing mental health problems to individual brain chemistry and pushing pills (with the concomitant profits for pharma companies), rather than looking at peoples' lives and the role of wider society.

Having said that I do know various people who feel they have really benefited from anti-depressants.

I'm saying it is very important to look at everything that contributes to mental illness, and if the research and current emphasis on biological bases comes at the expense of analysing and addressing serious spine qualities (for women particularly, I put this in feminism because of psychiatry's long history of pathologising what it is to be female in a patriarchal society rather than, say, mental health) then obviously that is not helpful.

Hopefully it is possible to question and discuss myths like 'chemical imbalances' without throwing the baby out with the bath water, to look at things like the nocebo effect and so on without anyone assuming that nobody should take any psychiatric medication.

I'm pretty sure I mean social inequalities not spine qualities - thanks iPad

I thought that the OP was saying the the underlying reasons that so many people have MH problems should be looked at. Rather than just treating the symptoms.

At a societal level if for eg it turns out that a large proportion of first time mothers end up with MH problems in the mid/long term - then this is useful information isn't it. And the causes could be looked at and solutions sought.

I didn't take it that she was saying they didn't work / don't take them.

If the reason that so many young women are self-harming / have eating disorders etc correlate with sexual abuse then that is worth knowing.

At the moment these issues seem to be buried as they are too tricky in terms of palatability and financial cost to face up to as a society. yes - OP - "pathologising what it is to be female in a patriarchal society" - this

yes and have very much in mind the awfulness that was generally straying from social norms, in a way that was unique to women and girls, such as lifetime incarceration for premarital sex - have met actual people in the same hospital that I've been in that this happened to, who were still there, in the 'lifers' unit

when I say 'actual people' I mean older women, so not people in the everyday sense of the word

however I am realising you can NEVER discuss these things (see also: counselling and its under measured capacity to harm) without people saying 'how DARE you, it has saved my life' etc

So my view is not welcome, despite my relevant experience, because I don't buy unquestioningly into the idea that mental health professionals can't be bothered to cure their patients, preferring to just medicate them.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that your view is not welcome, SDTG. But you are a sample of one and your experiences are not the be all and end all of this whole (very complex) topic.

If you have access to research about the role of seratonin and the benefits of psychiatric medicine then do post it, that would be fascinating.

I'm coming up to 20 years of recurring depression.

I always bought the chemical inbalance explanation, in a way it comforted me to think that this is not my fault.

Has anyone read Dorothy Rowe? This thread has inspired me to get Depression: The way out of your prison off the bookshelf. Sorry on phone can't do links, it's a thought-provoking read.

Interesting study here

44% of women have been prescribed antidepressant drugs by the time they are 54. That is shockingly high. Most never get as far as seeing a MH professional, they are prescribed ADs by GPs who tell them they have a chemical imbalance. It's the quick, cheap option and does absolutely nothing about root causes.

Of course we need to be careful. In some cases, ADs are literally lifesavers. I have a looong history of depression and have been on them a couple of times, but I think we are short-changing people, especially women, if this is all that is offered.

Yes, I have read some Dorothy Rowe. She's really anti the chemical imbalance explanation, isn't she? She's written some interesting stuff about depression sufferers feeling unable to live up to their own high standards and finding in depression a way of insulating themselves from the world, if I recall correctly (which I may not, it's been a while).

This is really interesting. I'm taking ads for PND and think that the societal pressures on a certain type of motherhood plus the isolation of the nuclear family are a huge part of it. But I need to be well an they are working.

I refused the drugs from my gp and am seeing a great female psych and cbt counselor too, both wonderful women - so I am being well cared for now