Equality at home - Can this really be achieved?

[marga73]

There is an issue I've been wanting to discuss for a long time. It's the issue of equality inside the house.

Even though women now work and are able to gain respectable positions in the workplace, and we can say that some level of equality has been attained, it seems to me that once they have children, women lose more than men in terms of work opportunities and financial independence. And all because the house and the children still seem to be a "woman's job".

It's all great to find women who are happy being the SAHP, but don't these women feel sometimes that being 100% financially dependent on their husbands is frustrating? Doesn't this situation make them feel trapped and powerless? Is it OK for women to sacrifice their independence for the sake of their children and the house keeping?

I work part-time, and have two small children, and still feel trapped sometimes. I'm grateful in many ways that my husband earns enough so we don't have to worry about paying for mortgage, food, childcare etc - and I contribute to this too - but I feel it's far beyond from the ideal I had when I was young and it really annoys me. If I'm honest, it makes me very angry.

I would like a society where men and women work part time, share domestic tasks 50/50, and look after their children part time, and therefore pay for everything on equal terms. Is this too much to ask in the fierce capitalist society we live today? Am I naive to think that should be the case?

I do know parents that both work part time and look after children, but it takes a huge toll on their lives as partners as it's almost like hotbedding. They pass each other with a kiss and a hug with notes left on the fridge.
Yes, they share household tasks and childcare and bills, but it seems more like an endurance marathon than an easy lifestyle choice. It ought to be possible, it seems so logical.

My husband and I work full time and share household chores and child rearing equally. The children are at nursery during the day, whilst we're both at work. Working opposing shifts is not something I can imagine would really work in the long term.

I feel we have full equality at home, but agree that this is harder if not impossible to achieve if one partner is going part time or gives up work. The times when I was on maternity leave certainly felt less equal and it was harder to really distribute chores fairly. Going back full time certainly improved things for all of us.

It's a no-brainer that your career suffers if you go part time for whatever reason. Not every job can be done part time, and the higher you get up the food chain the less likely it is that it works part time.

DH and I have an arrangement broadly like what you describe as the ideal, OP; in fact I earn more than him and work longer hours, and he shoulders a slightly greater proportion of the childcare responsibilities than I do. What is quite interesting is the pressure exerted from outside, by assumptions that the primary household and child-rearing role is mine. Schools, nannies, other external parties all automatically I assume I am the gatekeeper of all matters child-related. And to an extent one adapts to this, because it's easiest. it's very annoying.

I go out to work 5 days a week. DH stays at home looking after DS 3 days a week and works from home 2 days a week. DS is in childcare 3 days a week. I do all the housework and manage the finances.

I wouldn't say we have equality (as I do all the housework) but in other ways maybe it evens out as I have full control over all the finances and DH does more "childcare" (if you can call it that for your own child) than me.

nowhere near equality is it? he has one day in the week child free and two working, you have 5 days working and do all the housework. given he has the full day without work or childcare why isn't he doing the housework then?

What is he doing on his day off?

Sorry I have that the wrong way round - DH works from home the 3 days when DS is in childcare and looks after him the other two.

But still, when it comes to housework he is a lazy fecker

Point out it isn't fair and ask him which of the many areas he'd like to be responsible for. My OH does laundry and ironing, DS does hoovering and gardening.
Unless you want your DS to assume that males are exempt from housework.
Makes them a PITA as housemates as DD found in her first year at uni. That was a shock to her!

My DH and I are pretty equal - I work 4.5 days a week, he works 4 days a week but one of these is always a weekend day, so he has 2 days solo childcare, I have 1.5 days solo childcare and we have 1 day a week of shared childcare 'family day'. DS in nursery 2.5 days a week. Household tasks are split evenly (though he probably does a bit more than me tbh as he does most of the laundry and stacking and unstacking dishwasher type things and does more cleaning, but I do most financial stuff). It is possible, but I know my DH is fairly unusual.

Do you know Dust, I have always been pretty resigned to this and laid back, but you have just made me think about the example to DS.

I do not wish to raise a son who thinks that getting the hoover out requires ovaries.

Previously I have thought "ah well, there are more important things to get worked up about and everthing else is rosy" but I am really uncomfortable with the idea of that attitude rubbing off on DS. He is 4.5 months old at the moment so we have a little time to resolve this but that really has changed the way I think.

yeah in 2 days where he's at home full time with ds he could easily get some of the housework done - may be time to have a talk. some recommend listing all that needs doing in the house and then saying right which are we going to do? i'd say ok lets work out which can be done on the two days you are at home and then the ones left over we'll divide between us to be done in the evening or at weekends. that would be fair.

I've always thought both working part-time would be ideal. For a long time dp worked weekends and had days off in the week ,whilst I worked Monday - Friday. The advantages were that things were more equal and we only paid for one day a week of nursery. Dp also did do housework on the days he was at home. The disadvantages were that we hardly saw each other and had no family time - I was on my own with the kids at the weekends.

Now dp works Monday - Friday and I work Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, Friday. Things are much easier and relaxed and we have more family time but I do feel like I do much more housework. Not just on my day off but at the weekend too. We also have less money as our child care costs have doubles despite being on the same income.

x posted - yep it's important. do you really want to inflict a lazy partner on another woman down the line? i actually think a big part of ethical sisterhood is raising our sons to be decent future partners.

hypothetically i think both working 3 days a week (in the week) would be good - you each get two days childcare and three days work and housework etc can be done by each when doing the childcare days. the child/ren get one day a week in nursery which can be really positive for them imo and weekends are genuinely free for family time as you can get all the housework inc shopping etc done in the week.

Naive, no. Wrong, yes.

I do not wish to work part time thank you. I love being at home with the children. I love my husband and don't resent him at all. It was a choice on my part to stop paid work out of the home. It suits me and my family. I would resent an arrangement imposed on me by OP that I must work part time, that DH must work part time all in the name of 'equal financial contributions'.

I'm glad. My DS is a foot taller than me now, it would be very hard to persuade him not to be an idle swine if I'd left it until now. OH and I lived in a shared student house for a couple of years, we all pulled our weight and when we moved in together, we continued to divide things equally.
DD was in shock at the sexism of a couple of the lads in the flat, and that two of the other girls didn't see it as a problem that they saw housework as a female thing.
Never has theoretical feminism converted to action so quickly!

it's also quite a nice pace imo - two days at home being a parent and pottering doing what needs doing and adding a bit of social time (meeting up with other parents who aren't working etc). sounds pretty ideal. and the child gets to see both parents parent independently and doing both 'roles' re: wahm, sahp. everyone gets a work/life balance and parenting is shared and you have some proper family time at weekends.

shame there aren't more well paid part time jobs.

It is the finances that are the killer.

I should add that I stipulated that I was giving up work to raise DC not to be a cleaner. DH and I share household upkeep. When DCs are older they will do household tasks in return for pocket money penis or no penis.

yes and that part time tends to equal no bloody employment rights, sick pay, holiday pay etc. it is the working world that really needs shaking up and changing if equality in real terms is to move forward. it has to become more combinable with home commitments rather than being reliant on sexist divisions of labour.

I don't see why paid employment is the 'be all and end all' of equality. DH does a lot in the house-all the ironing for example-but I feel really lucky to get the child care-way more interesting than any paid work. I am not trapped-you can do OU, have hobbies, do voluntary work etc.

Thanks Dust and Swallowed. I will sort this out. For DSs sake more than anything.

When I met DH at uni he was very handy with the housework - and he was a contract cleaner as a pt job so he knows what to do!

I like the idea of assinging certain tasks to him. That would probably work best for us.

I have also always done part time-I would hate to have to do full time. I don't think that anyone gets to the end of life saying 'I wish I had spent more time at work'-by that time they have worked out what really matters in life.In my xase I work to live and would go into deep depression if I was living to work.

case

DP and I both work part time, use some paid child-care, split the housework 50/50. He works and earns a little more than me and I do a little more child-care, but we have equal free time and spending money.