The London Riots: The Elephant in the Room

[smugaboo]

I am probably being too quick off the mark in posting this as people are still digesting what is happening in London and Birmingham. I have seen references on here to police "shutting down the internet" and "shooting protesters" (rubber bullets, so that's okay). Let's hope that's the shock talking. But when the dust settles and people start analysing the root causes of the riots (i.e. social problems, poverty, unemployment, cultural concerns) one thing that will inevitably be overlooked, or at least not given enough attention, is the fact that this is gendered violence. It hardly needs to be said that very few women are involved in the actual rioting although I don't doubt that there are quite a number involved in looting. The same can be said in most similar situations anywhere in the world.

So I guess what I'm interested in exploring is whether or not this is actually gendered violence as such. Are the wives, mothers and sisters of the protestors sitting at home cheering them on? Is the only reason they don't join in fear for personal safety? Or do they feel fundamentally differently? I mean, would they ever be the ones to precipitate the violence? Do the males feel more disaffected - or are they actually more disaffected (I hardly think so!). Or, controversially, does this opportunity stir up some innate desire in males to simply be violent?

I've got to disappear but I'd love to hear what you think.

You said,

"No it wouldn't get implemented, because the majority male MPs in parliament would not vote for it. You can't blame women for every policy you don't like. The majority of MPs are men and they set policy".

I took your last sentence to mean that the policies were set by men which has led to this dumbing down/nobody loses/everyone is equal/feminisation of education but if the majority of MPs were women, it would be different.
Perhaps I misinterpreted.

'Very true Claig but many would have you believe that we are all just puppets dancing to the tune of the great god Socialisation'

But Thatcher proved the many wrong.

I'm sure you were marvellous in your hood Milly

I think these policies were introduced by men. If women were in charge, it would depend which women. It is about politics, not sex. If Thatcher and Edwina Currie and Tory women like them were in charge, then yes things would be totally different. It's about politics, not gender.

When Thatcher was first voted in, people said she wouldn't be up to it because she was a woman. But people soon changed their minds and said where is the next Thatcher.

Seems like you've got a dose of that heroine worship coursing through your veins.
You'll never see the like of her again.

I'm afraid I was guilty of making assumptions. Not used to seeing such unclouded thought in this section you see.

archieleach, the Tory party is full of women of that calibre. I was mnightily impressed by Nicola Blackwood at the parliamentary committee questioning the police. Honest, clever, smart, forthright, fantastic. That is the future, not clapped out male politicians.

Never forget Anne Widdecombe, singlehandedly better than a hundred Tory backbenchjers and ten thousand Labour backbenchers. The Tories loved her, all the constituencies wanted her to be leader, but the male cabal of Tory MPs conspired to stop her. If she had been leader, things would have changed for the better, but that's exactly the reason that the male MPs stopped her.

"heroine worship coursing through your veins" "unclouded thought"

"Poetic licence"
Are you the type to creep around in the dark stabbing people and then running away Alice?

Yeah, women would be so much better off if A Widdecombe were PM. Who needs abortion rights anyway, eh?

Anne Widdecombe wasn't right on everything, but Tories loved her, both women and men. That's politics. You either prefer Blair or Widdecombe. I prefer Widdecombe, but obviously many others will prefer Blair.

im fed up with a lot of the things ive been reading on mn this week-paticcally the single mother bashing-its offensive and wrong.
when are we going to realise that we have all been fucked over?when?
its not about single mums doing a bad job of parenting ect ect.[however this is bloody predictable isnt it-people saying this].
right across the board its a grande fuck up.yet we are are looking at just one or two groups and pointing fingers.
actually i dont even know where to start with this-but here goes.....
ok-for a start people are saying that people like me have no respect[underclass single mother]-how can i have respect when im called the underclass?how can i have respect when i sit in front of teachers wanting to get very involved with my childs school life but is pushed away cos they are busy playing social workers and ticking boxes?
how can i have respect when ss just want to tick boxes and keep theyre jobs but they dont hear?
how can i have respect when the job centre calls me up for a "why aint you got a job"interview every 3 months-even tho im life limited and have a child with sn[childcare prob]
how can i have respect when-i go there and ask them if theres anything i can do small and for a few hours-and they tell me to go away but come back to answer the same stupid questions again soon.
how can i have respect when-im bringing my child up well-but people only see that im a single parent-
how can i have respect when i see people calling me deprived all the time[and my child deprived]-have you any idea what this feels like?
have you any idea what it feels like to see youreself written off time and time again?im a good mother and a strong and proud woman-yet according to society-im a gobshite.
the other side of it is-while im getting written off[and so are my children]-you are too but you dont realise it.
you are the teachers/ss ect ect that are involved with me but you are being used and fucked over aswell.
lets stop pointing fingers at each other and disliking each other-when we do this the patriarchy is winning.
its very noticable[to me]that some are showing theyre true colors lately-but this is just vile and hate-the patriarchys winning-cant you see?
we need to stop all this-or things are never going to change.
lets look at the proper picture instead of one thats painted for us.

Unfortunately there are not enough. I think it is very difficult if not impossible for a conviction politician to get elected nowadays. And if you are a person of integrity then you would have to be out of your mind to want to be a politician.
I certainly noticed Nicola Blackwood and made a mental note to find out who she was, although I did think she was slightly flustered and a little wet, but I guess she is quite young.
Widdecombe is a little eccentric I think, therefore too much of a loose cannon to be "popular" Perhaps that is why she was sidelined. I never thought I would say this but there was one decent labour politician once, Mo Mowlam and she got fucked over by,"swivel-eyed Anthony Blair" (courtesy Clarissa Dickson-Wright). She'd make a good PM

good post, sparky

Did I get the hyphen in the right place, Alice?

Spot on sparky.

Excellent post sparky.

Yes, Mo Mowlam was very good, forthright and honest, and I like Clare Short too on the whole. Widdecombe was fantastic. They couldn't control her, as you say she was a loose cannon, that's why they stopped her. The Tories loved her, she was the most popular Tory by far, but the male cabal knew that she would not follow orders, she was like Thatcher, she would have done things her way, and just like they stabbed Thatcher in the back, they also set Widdecombe up and stopped her. mIt was a great shame, because she subsequently withdrew from politics. That was a great loss to the country, because politicians of integrity like her are few and far between.

It runs throughout doesn't it Sparky. Get people to bicker amongst themselves and fight for the crumbs and no-one will notice what is really going on.

Reminds me of this I was saw in the Torygraph no less.

Some of you might like to watch this video. It is long, but I watch videos by activists, scientists etc when ironing, so don't mind the length. Jensen talks about what you would say to a boy about what it means to be a man. He talks a lot about masculinity.

There is also another one somewhere on what it means to be white.

I see where you are coming from, but I just couldn't help thinking every time I saw her that she was a bit twattish, and I think a lot of other people thought the same. Although she did grow on me over time. Anyway, she lost out. I never met her in person of course. That's politics, the ceaseless sea.
Human nature is so predictable it is depressing. I find it shocking that there are large numbers of people who are "surprised" or "shocked" that these riots happened. All so very predictable. Just like those tired comments on the murderer/ess next door, "s/he was such a quiet man/woman"
And it will get far worse when the recession starts in 6 months and the depression a year later.

'I saw her that she was a bit twattish, and I think a lot of other people thought the same'

yes many people did think that because left wing comedians publicly mocked her and her looks. But they only did all that because they were frightened of her and knew the real appeal that she had. It is exactly the same as the sexist way in which they mock Sarah Palin, who is also loved by hundreds of thousands.

At the end of the day, the people don't care if a leader is twattish or old or female or male, as long as they have integrity. People can spot integrity a mile off. That's why they loved Widdecombe.

whats really pissin me off aswell is-
[i dont mean this to be unkind-and i dont]but
theres now been people volenteering to "help us"-wtf is that about?
give us the resources to help ourselves-stop seeing us as idiots that need helping-stop emancipating us[as mothers]-hear us and stand by our sides instead.
stop seeing us as below everyone else.
anyway-why the surge in volenteering?why not before and who exactly are you helping-us or you?
also-while evryone is nodding theyre heads at the fuckwittery of wanstead council[evicting people]-these people will have to live somewhere-some of these people will be single mothers-and actually-they could all end up living near you.
as i said-its time to come together not fight together.

But Palin is as thick as two short planks and loopy to boot - even worse than dubya. Surely you wouldn't want her finger on the trigger!!

Yes the talk about evicting rioters from their homes is disgraceful. I can't believe they are really going to do it, but who knows, anything is possible.