Academic attainment and feminism?

[suwoo]

I have wanted to start this thread all day but have been scared that it is stupid or I will be flamed. I want to ask if people feel there is a correlation between academic attainment and feminist principles. Is that a valid question?
I had no idea that I was a feminist. I knew I had these thoughts and principles but didn't know what they were or the significance of them until we did feminist literary theory this semester- it was like an epiphany and my whole world made sense

Had I not gone to uni at the grand old age of 35, maybe I would never had these revelations.

What do you think? Those of you that identify as a feminist, what level of education do you have?

But that's what confuses me swallowed. You reckon feminism is more at home in other disciplines, you think feminism in lit becomes 'a metaphor in a book itself to be played with semantically and enjoyed rather than a real living thing with impacts upon life and society' .... so surely lit. needs feminists to sort this out? (I think lit. has feminists doing this, btw, but needs more.)

this 'impact on real life' thing must be why Dworkin, Millet etc aren't taught in literary studies surely - because they write as if the impact of literature is important, but the current dominant view is that it is all just a big game, with perhaps a bit of scope for subversion but still basically a game.
how very unsophisticated of them.....

SAF

I really recommend Katherine Dettwyler as an inspirational academic. She has done lots of work on breastfeeding in Mali, and the positive attitudes to it there. She has used her academic expertise to support practical causes in the wider world, and she also used her expertise as US court testimony where fathers were attempting to get custody of children on the grounds that a mother breastfeeding or cosleeping with a child was abusive. There's lots of easy to read stuff about her on the internet, and her academic books are very readable too.

Yes, I think that is incredibly cynical! Also very reductive to see the 'meat and bones of life' as not including, for example, words and stories. Some would say they're what makes us human. In fact, unless you think a male animal is being sexist when holds down a female animal and penetrates her, I think you'd have to accept that sexism is a function of a culture that has a consciousness of other humans being people with their own minds - which is intrinsically narrative, isn't it?

SAF - how I so wanted to say something about mental masturbation but I chickened out.

LRD, I want to be clear that my posts earlier were not about where lit is failing because I am not qualified to do so (although dittany is winning me over, I'm afraid), but more about lit being unevenly represented in discussions on academia and feminism. I think it might be simply because lit crit devotees like writing a lot. And discussing stuff at length on forums. I don't want to discredit the existence of the work of feminist lit crit types, I would just love to see an elevated profile of self-identified feminists and their work in other fields.

So, enlighten me on Freud. In layman's terms, why is his work still referenced so much in lit crit?

I can't really articulate this well, but hopefully somebody else can. There is something about art, literature, media and so on being treated as if it isn't really representing humans and human suffering and can be talked about in some kind of amoral way that really disturbs me.

I read something a while ago by Georges Perec - The Truth of Literature - about how it is impossible to have a literary criticism of concentration camp literature, and about the difficulties of getting people to empathise through literature.

I think that applies to reading books about the torture or suffering of women. How can the initial approach to that with any student not firstly be an emotional reaction of horror and shock, and then a moral or political response? I don't see how it can be separated from politics and real human experience.

I understand, aye. I was just feeling fed up.

As to Freud - is he still referenced much in lit crit? I'm not a modernist (I imagine they must refer to him because he is after all a direct influence), but I've not seen Freud used in anything I've read since I was an undergrad. And then he was mentioned a couple of times in passing. But then, I didn't have much theory teaching so not the best person to ask.

I think the problem is what's already been said: Freud gets treated with respect as a massively influential, though somewhat discredited influence on culture and literature. That's fair enough because lots of 20th century thought is consciously based on his ideas.

Dworkin doesn't. Lots of people (arguably more importantly), don't seem to know she might have had some influence on culture and literature. They don't bother arguing (as lots of people arguing with Freud), they just ignore her.

I'd rather argue Dworkin should be more visible, than that Freud shouldn't be, if that makes sense?

Milly - exactly! It makes me so angry when people say it's somehow ok not to be shocked by violence against women when it's fictional - but people do say it.

swallowed - I'm sorry you feel it was 'wanky'. I don't know if you mean my post or not? I didn't mention a metaphor at all?

swallowed, if you disagree, say why. Don't tell me it's trite.

I don't see how you could argue that the capability to think of other people as having their own conscious mind, which is not yours, could be anything other than narrative? How is that not true?

If you know someone else has a mind and experiences different from yours, you have to make some kind of imaginative, narrative leap, to do that. Most of us do it quite naturally. As I understand it, some autistic children really struggle and can't understand another person might feel differently from them, or might not know exactly what they know.

I remember saying "yes" I was a feminist, aged about ten, when asked by one of my mother's friends - a charming but pretty traditional old boyfriend of hers, married to one of her good friends (after my Mum introduced them). I think he asked in response to some observations and comments I was making, though I don't remember what they were.
Anyway, what I'm thinking is the interest in being a feminist, thinking I was equal to any boy, of course, why not ? went alongside the idea of learning being an interesting thing to do.
I have a science degree, a nursing qualification, and a teaching qualification. I'd be interested to learn more about counseling too. So, like my Mum who did an MA in her 70's, I probably haven't finished learning yet !