Check out this for a checklist for misogyny

[LadyBlaBlah]

I never read the Express however happened upon this article today while out for lunch.

what a total cock

I was astounded by the level of ignorance and prejudice. It is worse than anything I have ever seen in The Sun.

The Express is evil.

my otherwise kind and loving parents read it makes me very sad that this is where they get their news about the world :(

I know this is a big ask, but it would be great if Dittany or someone could come and give us a point by point rebuttal of everything that's wrong with this article. It's an absolute classic of its kind, and to someone like me (who instinctively believes in the feminist cause but can't always express the specifics in response to arguments like these) it would be a really handy ready reckoner.

!!!!! , It's such a shame, as there is an important point within the article about meritocracy - I am uncomfortable and disagree with quotas etc, but disagree with every other single point in the article.

The express = pile of crap.

"Quite where the government picked up the idea that Britain is yearning for a feminist revolution isn?t clear."

At best he is saying feminism is dead and buried, failed and over. At worst he is ignoring the vast numbers of women who are feminists. Silent voices etc.

"Existing legislation has already created equal opportunities for men and women in the work­place. The idea that women are still being discriminated against is based on the flawed assump­tion that women have the same ambitions as men when in fact many women make a deliberate decision to balance the demands of work and home rather than seeking highly demanding executive jobs"

Existing legislation has not created equal opportunities, that is simply untrue. The entire system is geared up to make it difficult for women to achieve. He says it is a flawed assumption that women have ambition - is he serious? Again the system generally doesn't allow serious ambition to be realised for women - and thus many women are forced to admit defeat and know their place.

"It is quite obvious to every­ one except feminist campaigners and it seems members of the government that there will always be fewer women climbing the career ladder. There is nothing you can do about the fact that women have the babies. For men and women to hold equal positions in the workplace it would be necessary for the nation to cease to breed."

What an utterly ridiculous statement. He is thus stating that childcare can only be done by women. Again reinforcing the system that keeps women 'in their place'

"endlessly they bleat on about ?glass ceilings? and a supposed ?gender pay gap?, insinuating that the nation?s employers are engaged in a conspiracy to keep women in their place and poorly paid."

There is a gender pay gap, there is a glass ceiling, there is also a glass cliff. He is now dismissing these arguments as hysterical and untrue - again reinforcing the system's power over women.

"When you start comparing like for like the pay gap starts to vanish. In fact if you compare the average hourly wage of part-­time employees women earn two per cent more than men."

Bad Science incorporated. This may be true, but probably only true because many highly paid women go part time and thus skew the figures and allow this representation of them. The true story would be that as soon as those women are forced to work part time then their promotion prospects disappear and they are generally treated with disdain (no commitment etc) by their employers.

"David Cameron notably has not him­self felt obliged to appoint a Cabinet of 40 per cent women.

He knows that if he did so he would quickly find himself scraping the barrel for available talent."

Righto, so all women would mean scraping the bottom of the barrel. Incredible.

"The inevitable result is that, with less competition, token women would be catapulted up the career ladder with negative consequences for those firms."

And not only would they have to scrape the bottom of the barrel, they would then start to literally wreck companies

"Clearly some women have chosen to embark on top-­flight careers and good luck to them. But a good many women have realised that it is impossible to combine the role of FTSe 100 chairman with being a full-­time mother and have chosen not to seek the top jobs. The govern­ment should respect that choice and stop trying to treat us all like closet sexists."

He is not even a closet sexist - he is out and proud. He is very dangerously parroting the ultimate misogynist message that it is impossible for women to combine the role of mother and FTSE 100 chairman.

The key thing is he repeats every myth which keeps women in their place - responsible for all the childcare and economically reliant on a male ( or presumably the state). There is no thought about why there isn't a shake up with regards to childcare, men's child care capabilities, more flexible hours etc etc

Somebody feels threatened by women...Has Ross CLark got womb-envy or what ?

re good rebuttals to the meritocracy argument, read Malcolm Gladwell's 'Blink' which has a massive section on how someone's inbuilt cultural expectations and prejudice have been scientifically proven to override any 'meritocratic' judgements 99.9% of the time, even when the person making the judgement call is aware of and actively against those prejudices. only by using what are essentially double-blind scientific methods can you overcome this tendency to go with the cultural flow and not award roles according to inbuilt prejudices around gender, ethnicity, age ie, literally auditioning/ interviewing 'blind'.

that's not very pithy in an argument tho i'm afraid!

I have seen this new phrase bandied about a few times recently: Equality of opportunity not equality of outcomes.

It's a posh-sounding way of saying "women shut the fuck up" isn't it. Basically it says, well we're educating you now, and allowing you to work, and we've even put some laws in saying you have to be treated properly (even though they're often ignored) - so everything is fine. If you aren't going on to earn as much as men/have a good career/whatever it must be an innate problem with you / active choice that you've made. Nothing to do with anything else.

I don't like it. It is a catchy soundbite that has come from somewhere and it's being propogated. It sounds so reasonable and it just isn't.

i find it absolutely infuriating to be told what i want as a woman. To be told that if we are not achieving equality in the workplace it basically our own fault / choice because we have had the opportunity to do (kindly given to us by men). so we are just different from men are we? less ambitious, less able, content to keep the home-fires burning. What an utter crock of shite.

i do wonder what this writer thinks feminism is actually about. Clearly they see it at some sort of extremist mystical movement capable of casting a spell over David Cameron, who clearly should know better

Radio I enjoyed the anger in your post there.

You are completely right.

thanks, it's good to share

ISNT - I think the debate about equality of opportunity vs equality of outcome is ages old, it's just being abused by some to make a point.

For example equality of opportunity could be extended to more jobs by making them suitable for part time/flexible working etc.

Thanks prinnie. I have not heard it before, and seen it about 3 times this week, each time used to expain how actually what women want is to have low paid jobs and spend their years doing unpaid caring etc etc etc

Daily Express??

It's for people too stupid to read the Mail

^^ Agreed

It's quite good that this article exists though isn't it?

The guy is worried about feminism.

5 years ago, he wouldn't have been.

That's good.

How could he possibly argue with the idea that women should not be earning less than men? How would keeping women earning less be a good thing for any family?

I suppose it is HerB. I love that Gandhi quote:

?First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.?