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Original poster

Social Services punish mothers for DV

340 replies

SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 00:18

Why do they do this?
Why is it that no-one is under any obligation to keep the abuser away from the mother, and yet the mother has a responsibility to keep her children away from the abuser?
The very fact that the authorities need the mother to "prove" she is taking steps to keep the children save show that they believe the husband is abusive/violent. ANd yet it's not him who is hounded or punished.
I'm so Angry at hearing women whose partners are given bail after committing some atrocity against their wife or children, only to do it again as soon as they get back home, and for the mother to be told she is endangering her children.
The law is so backward Sad
Surely if the man is known to be abusive, you take steps to remove him from the home????

OP posts:
Saltatrix · 21/12/2010 01:11

SS don't have power over adults, they only see a situation where a child/children are in danger and must be kept safe (of course this process sometimes goes wrong)

The point here is that if someone is in an abusive relationship and they have children it is their duty as parents to keep their children safe from the abusive one if that means calling the police or getting out of there then so be it.

SS focus is on the children

Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:12

So it all comes down to the fact that nobody believes women, just like in rape cases.
SHe has to be half-dead before any action will be taken

OP posts:
ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 21/12/2010 01:13

santasackura, if a women wont press cahrges then tehre is no case to investigate.

WhyHavePets · 21/12/2010 01:14

Because the onus of proof is different. The amount of evidence required to convict someone and remove them from their (own) home is huge. A large amount of evidence built up over a long time.

However it is enough for a family court or a care review to have the abused's say so. If a parent admits they are being abused and gives details of this affecting the dc then SS have enough evidence to try and protect the dc whereas a lot more is needed to take somene away from a home - that they may even own!

The fact is that the law is set up to protect dc with a lot less evidence than is required to protect an adult. Strange as it may seem this is right.

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 21/12/2010 01:14

woman.

sorry for my shitty typing tonight.

Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:14

In the thread I read, the woman had called the police more than once on her partner and he was bailed immediately, only to beat her up again.
The police and SS came to her house and saw the bruises on her face
How is it possible that she is responsible for the children's welfare and he isn't??

OP posts:
Dansmommy · 21/12/2010 01:16

"SantasSackura Tue 21-Dec-10 01:09:37
I think SS should be given power to collaborate with the police in order to remove the abuser from the home."

I do agree with this. Though I think in practice it would be tricky.

I think the problem here is that lots of different points have been lumped together.

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 21/12/2010 01:16

they are both responsible santa, but as he is teh abuser, he cannot leave with teh children and SS have no authority to make him leave his home.

Goblinchild · 21/12/2010 01:16

Many people don't believe an abused child, including the mother. Either through stupidity or wilful refusal to see what is happening in their own home, and with members of their own family.
Often the child feels that it is their fault that they are physically, emotionally or/and sexually abused because the adults in their lives are either the abusers or the deniers.

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 21/12/2010 01:17

believe me, if he is tehre when SS arrive. he will be told that if he is violent again his children will be removed.

WhyHavePets · 21/12/2010 01:17

It is nothing to do with believeing the woman at all. There is far more to making a DV case than there is to making a child welfare case - and rightly so, if someone screams abuse they can take it back for themselves, for a variety of reasons - and that is their right. However they cannot take it back for the dc - because it is the right of the dc to be protected, regardless of any sweet-talk or promises or anything else that may happen in a dv case!

Dansmommy · 21/12/2010 01:18

But why was she still living there santas?

Saltatrix · 21/12/2010 01:20

He is seen as responsible hence why he is on bail and not released. I don't know the details of the thread however so correct me if I am wrong.

The SS are only looking at the potential for harm to the children they are not trying to punish people they are trying to protect. Obviously there is a loose cannon abuser around and that's not safe for the children. Better safe than sorry.

Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:21

Dansmommy lots of women are frightened to leave the abuser. It's a fact that most women are murdered as they try to leave their abuser, [two women a week are murdered]

I don't see what the harm would be in giving SS more power to focus on the behaviour of the abuser rather than the mother, in a case like this

OP posts:
Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:22

two women a week are murdered by their spouse

OP posts:
ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 21/12/2010 01:24

santa, they focus on teh children's safety. if both parents are tehre tehy will speak to them both, as i explained, most abusers wont stick around to be told they are an abuser, it would make it too real for them, tehy would be forced to admit their behaviour to a professional and that is not what they want to do, tehy want to be able to keep on abusing. so that is why most warnings are adressed to teh mother.

how do you not get this?

Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:28

I don't get that the mother is in a position where she is punished for the DV, and the abuser is not. NO I don't get it

OP posts:
Dansmommy · 21/12/2010 01:29

Firstly, you can't say that 'It's a fact that most women are murdered as they try to leave their abuser'. That's ridiculous. Many, many more that 2 per week leave safely.

Secondly, I don't care how scared you are. When you have children, you have a responsibility to protect them. I'd jump off a building for mine.

Thirdly, if someone is genuinely powerless to leave, then surely it is best that SS remove the children. Would you suggest they leave them there so as not to punish the mother?

Goblinchild · 21/12/2010 01:29

One child a week is murdered by their carer, and in over 50% of DV cases, the child/ren was also a victim of abuse. 90% of cases, the children were in the same house whilst the abuse was being carried out.
(I'm using stats from the Refuge website)
An adult can leave, the younger the child, the less chance that they can escape. That's one of the reasons that the stats for teenage runaways is so high, they leave when they have a chance.

WhyHavePets · 21/12/2010 01:31

They are not focusing on the mother, they are focusing on the child. If the abused returns to the abuser and puts the child in danger then the child requires extra protection. Fact.

I do understand your point, I do see where you are coming from but the fact is that SS is about dc. Anything else is down to the police and that is where it all seems to be getting confused here.

Goblinchild · 21/12/2010 01:33

'When you have children, you have a responsibility to protect them. I'd jump off a building for mine. '

I'd shove an abuser off a building for mine, and work it so that I didn't get caught. Grin

Original poster
SantasSackura · 21/12/2010 01:33

DansMommy No you've misunderstood. MAny women leave safely, but of the women who are murdered , the murders happen when the violent spouse realises she's going to leave him

OP posts:
WhyHavePets · 21/12/2010 01:34

Santas, when SS say "you need to take steps to protect your child..." they are not punishing the mother, they are protecting the dc.

The fact that the abuser is not punished is down to the police and that is totally different.

Dansmommy · 21/12/2010 01:35

Well yeah, I'm not saying me jumping is a good plan. I'm not batman. Grin

Goblinchild · 21/12/2010 01:38

In my job, I get to see the consequences of abuse for the children.
So I'm not exactly posting from an unbiased point of view.