"What about the men that get raped?"

[thefinerthingsinlife]

Whilst talking about Reclaim the Night to a friend, a male asked what it was about I explained, he then questioned "what about all the men that get raped and are victims of domestic violence??" I explained to him that I think that only 3% of men are victims and the stats are roughly the same for Dv (i'm not a 100% that these stats).

He then said "I thought you believed men and women are equal therefore Reclaim should be about men victims too"

I didn't really know what to say to this so can someone give me some guidence

Thanks

Would you like to evidence that LS.

HB - yes and no. I told nobody at the time and not for years after. An abusive boyfriend told my mother as an act of spite about ten years later. For some reason I have told partners but none (apart from the current one) have been able to process the information and were unable to offer any help which is probably what I was looking for when I told them.

I've just finished a year of counselling which has been amazing. Really hard but life changing. I've talked to my sisters in the last year about it all and found out that of the four of us 3 have been sexualy abused. I think that if everyone was to speak out on one day about their abuse then it would be impossible for society to refuse to see the epidemic of abuse that we are in. But I understand why victims wouldn't/ couldn't speak out publicly. My life went much the way of your friend's and thoughts of what might have been if I hadn't been raped have driven me mad tbh. There's no way of knowing.

and what posts have brought you to that conclusion lynette?

Yep.

I sometimes feel a bit bad about not speaking out about when I was raped.

But I just can't face it. Not because of the rape, I've long got over that, but I don't want to see that look of disbelief. Couldn't face it.

If all of us did, would that disbelief go?

'any bloke whose gut reaction to women organising against violence is to go on the defensive about how badly done to men are is a massive nobhead. as on the internets, so in real life. '

I find this so insensitive. How does the op know whether or not her friend has been a victim of sexual abuse or rape? Feminists on the whole know how difficult it is to report rape and why. They know the trauma which can be caused by sexual assault. And they know the trauma caused by others refusing to accept that rape and sexual assault happens. Why would this be extended to male victims just because they are male? This is exactly what it looks like to me.

But why would he being a victim of abuse, mean he would be defensive or hostile to women organising against violence directed against them Earwicga? Would he be justified in feeling aggrieved about not being invited to a march about violence against muslims, or black people?

Does anyone else remember the New Cross fire? It happened in the eighties and 14 (or was it 16?) young black people burned to death, most of them teenagers. It was massively controversial because it happened at a loud party, just at the time of the riots, the NF or BNP were active in that area at the time, all very bad. There was a massive march and I remember at the time the huge row about whether white people should go on it or not, whether they were invited, or whether this was just about black people protesting about racist violence. And if white people going along was supportive, or muscling in. Can't remember the upshot, but it seems to me to be similar. If people are marching against violence against their particular group and they don't want you there, it is unbelievably crass to believe tht you have the right to be there anyway. It doesn't mean they don't feel sorry for you when you are the victim of violence, it means they want to focus attention on the specific social systemic nature of the violence to which they are subject.

Really StayFrosty. You think that all female victims are the way you think men should be?

And fuck off with your 'genuine victim' turn of phrase. A victim is a victim.

Sorry about the 'fuck off' - I'm tired and getting pissed off.

AGhh,I,have, so,much,more,to,say,but,space,bar,is sticking!!!!!!!!!!!

agree frosty wrt the fear of rape in prison mainly affects men but i have to disagree with your likening it to warning women not to go out/be alone at night/ to get taxis etc. men (as a whole)aren't warned not to commit crimes for fear of rape in prison, men aren't being warned to limit their freedoms in order to avoid rape. once again women are being held somewhat responsible for their rape but men aren't being told that they can do something to prevent it.

In response to the original post, rape is rape and it, along with domestic violence, does not discriminate against age, sex, creed, religion or anything else.

Not read all the posts (indeed not been on MN for a while) but in response to those who feel that male victims of rape should form their own support groups, what a jolly good job no one says that to a woman who is perceived to not fit in with a demographic of a 'support' group.

Rape is rape.

mrsarchie, perhaps you should read all the posts.

BOOMyhoo - that is exactly why I haven't been on mumsnet for several months. In response to the original post am I not entitled to an opinion?

Just on an individual level about this particular man -- he obviously has some major problem with the idea that men and women are equal. To him it's just some feminist proposition. Hence the assertion that men are victims too. This is a man who feels threatened by assertive women.

Stayfrosty -- I agree with your last post.

to me the man in the OP sounds like a child whingeing "aww, but i want some!!"

wrt mrsarchie, yes of course you are entitled to an opinion based based on the OP but threads tend to move on a bit and things get discussed further. if you had read on you would see why some posters don't feel this man should be included in the march. this isn't a support group for male victims of rape the same way a support group for alcoholics wouldn't be appropriate for someone with cleptomania.

aswell as the reasons others have given. (women who have been raped having to share their personal space and their chance to take back their freedom with men. and some men who may be rapists at that. also the fact that some quite nasty men may use that as a chance to get their kicks.

Math, how can you possibly know that?

The OP started out by asking what she should say to this man's questions. They were questions, not him insisting him right to go.

Surely we should give him the benefit of the doubt, explain why his presence might upset people marching even if he thinks he has good intentions, and suggest he goes and sorts out his own men's march if he wants to do so.

I would be thoroughly supportive of men marching to raise awareness/challenge the stigma of domestic violence against men.

I don't want to get into generalising about this individual man too much. But in answer to MrsArchie - I think if I went to e.g. a support group for ethnic minority women and was turned away for being white, I would get that. I'm not sure where you get this idea that all women are welcome everywhere.

x-post with everyone. Agree with LRD.

Also - RTN is not a support group, it is both a show of strength of women walking the streets at night (something many are too scared to do usually), and a great experience for those women involved to feel the freedom and solidarity of walking with other women.