Miss/Mrs/Ms - We can call ourselves anything - Yes???

[scaredoflove]

Just been to sign a loan agreement, the paperwork says Ms Married Name as I'm separated, soon to be divorced, when I will revert to Ms Maiden Name. My ID says Mrs Married Name - Just been told that loan may not go through as names are different

They are not different, they have a different prefix. I'm fuming

Do these things really still make a difference today?

If they come back, I will challenge it - anyone know what to say that will make them listen and think?

I assume you can call yourself what you like. My bank details still say Miss and I am married. My grandmother is Mrs despite being a widow for 20 years. Why can't you be Mrs on your ID if you want to be?

Well, when I tried to change my title on my cash cards/credit cards my bank got into a huge confusion and I ended up with one saying Ms, one saying Mrs, and one with just a dash! So it clearly wasn't a problem with them to have different titles attached to the same name.

Not sure what you'd say to someone that said they were different names, just keep pushing through to speak to supervisors/managers until you get somebody sensible and with some authority I'd guess.

Shouldn't matter in the slightest. I'm Ms or Mrs on various official things, as the fancy takes me.

Same here. Depending on mood (and what photo ID I have with me at the time) I am one of

Miss Maidenname
Ms Maidenname
Ms Marriedname
Mrs Marriedname.

No one has ever queried it or been in the least bit bothered.

What photo ID did you use? (My passport doesn't specify Miss, Ms or Mrs but not a UK one so may not be the same for yours.)

It was my driving licence

Everything is still Mrs, the loan man wrote Ms as I'm separated. So either one man thinks I should have a certain label or the loan company does

A Mr certainly would never have this problem, would they?

Am waiting on a call back, if it isn't passed - I will have to go back and have all the forms re done to match my ID and take more time off work grr

You can call yourself what you like, as far as I know. You certainly don't have to become a 'Ms' when you're separated/divorced, unless you want to, the loan company has no business dictating that!

A bit weird that people think Ms = separated. Wasn't the whole point of it that you have a single title throughout your life, regardless of changes in marital status, just as men have with Mr?

Ephiny has it right Ms is the female equivalent of Mr. So a Ms can be married, single, divorcedanything. It has absolutely nothing to do with your marital status. That's the point of it.

If anyone tried that with me I'd make a huge fuss over the company's stupidity and sexism, and refuse to change anything.

I put Rev on all froms

Does that work, frank? :o

CRB issue has been a recurrent one for me, but that's not a name change thing. They work on the assumption that if you are "Ms", then you must have had a previous name (i.e. you are divorced), just like the OP's loan bloke did. Presumably CRB is run by some kind of Life on Mars throwbacks who haven't been out much recently. If you are "Ms" and you leave the "previous names" box blank, they flat out assume you are lying/forgetful, and bounce the application back, causing a massive delay.

A lot of MNers including me have had problems starting new jobs because the CRB has been weeks late due to this issue. Last time I complained and they blamed the police and advised me to put my current (only ever had one) name in the "previous names" box. If that doesn't make them think I am losing it, what will?

That's really bizarre - I'm an unmarried Ms and know lots of others, in fact I thought that was more usual than using 'Miss' these days (though I know a few who changed to Mrs when they got married).

I wonder if that's an official policy, or just ignorant individual staff - either way they need to sort it out!

oh wow, it is official:

"Please note if a female applicant uses the title ?Ms?, CRB assume that the applicant has been married and is currently divorced, although obviously this is not always the case.

If the female applicant has been married then they should include all names (both maiden and married) in the appropriate boxes in section C.

If the female applicant has not been married and prefers to use the title ?Ms? the applicant must provide an additional sheet stating that she has never been married and simply prefers the prefix ?Ms?."

from here: www.therfl.co.uk/clientdocs/CRB%20Guidance.pdf

That makes absolutely no sense at all. Pretty much all the professional women I know use Ms if they're unmarried, and often even if they are. It's not some weird preference that needs special justification. It has nothing to do with being divorced.

Also - what if you're married and not divorced and want to use Ms? Apparently that possibility is just so inconceivable to them that they don't even address it...

When I was a 'Miss' I called myself 'Ms' but now I find myself saying 'Mrs'...which makes me think the only reason I used to say 'Ms' was to disguise the fact I wasn't married, which I'm very surprised about.

Mmm! I'm married and use Ms and I didn't change my surname (so god knows what they thought I was!!) as I realised when I got married I didn't actually want anyone to infer my marital status from my prefix. I have also been CRB checked and didn't have to jump through any hoops and I certainly didn't fill in any separate sheet!! I am sure I used my Passport as identification and my marital status isn't on there (in fact I don't think there is any prefix is there?). I think I probably used my driving licence too and that would probably have had Ms on there though.

In fact this has really wound me up as there is absolutely no mention of a man's marital status. Surely just providing all the names you have been known by is enough. Why do they need to know you current status?

bloody hell Ephiny, I never realised they were so overt about it! Where have people got this idea that "Ms" indicates divorce? Someone needs to sit down with whichever throwback makes the rules about this. Why should I or anyone have to attach a separate sheet to state that I have never been married and I want to be called Ms, when I have already said that on the form?

I am divorced but kept my maiden name when I got married but I still have Mrs on my bank cards and I can't be bothered to change it now.

Annoys me too that I have to give my marital status to people

What about people who don't change their names when they get married? Can they say a) I am married b) call me Ms c) I have never had any previous names? Or will that cause a national paperwork freakout as well I wonder?

Exactly, or if there is some reason they need to know marital status, why not just have a question about that, for both male and female applicants, instead of tying it to the prefix for women and making weird assumptions...

Exactly: are you married? have you ever been married? are you divorced/widowed? I have done this before on other security forms, it's not hard. Better that than the guessing game fun.

Also annoying to have it implied that rather than using Ms as a choice, you are secretly divorced and the clever form has managed to catch you out.

I understand wanting to know about previous names and marital status, but only if they are unisex questions. Why do we still use 'Mrs' in this day and age?

Because you like using it Posie? :)

The last CRB forms I filled in didn't really cover my own names/titles/status etc so I just listed everything I had been known as (not a criminal honestly!) I don't understand why there isn't a blanket statement - 'please list all names and titles you have been known as with dates when you used these titles'. No married/divorced/single crap for women - it's flagrant discrimination. Maybe we should get the Fawcett Society onto this?

When I divorced in the 80s I was told the charge to change my title from 'Mrs' to 'Ms' on my car insurance was £35 (the total premium was only £55). Obviously I told them I was taking my business elsewhere.

Maybe we need to tell our dds to use Ms and NEVER change their names!!!