Is there a current chalet school thread? Anyone fancy it?

[FelicityBeedle]

Was introduced to these on MN a few years ago, having a reread. Forgotten the extent to which I want to shake Mary Lou!

Sorry to hear that @PhilSwagielka

Yes I like Gipsy Carson - feels like she was off starring in her own series of books, or could have been. Also liked Grizel having her life outside the CS in Florence and wandering along with Gerry Challoner from EBD's first book.

I wish we'd seen more of Gerry. And Pauline Ozanne, and Heather Raphael, the one character who didn't make it into the CS books.

@PhilSwagielka
Oh I would have loved to see you on mastermind! I’ve often thought my subject would be discworld but it’s not an allowed one

How come? Is it overdone? I don't think you're allowed to do Harry Potter either.

I think it’s either over done or too large a topic, or maybe both? Or presumably they would let you pick a particular series with in it. I could maybe do Ken Follety’s Pillar’s of the earth series, or hamsters!

Would you have wanted to go to the Chalet School?
On balance, I don't think I would.
I used to love the idea of boarding school, but in reality I'd hate the cold baths, the religion being rammed down your throat, the endless petty rules, the lack of privacy, and the being so far from family.

I’ve always wanted to go to boring school (bit old now!). Too much Enid blyton as a kid I think. I do love the idea of being trilingual but the rules sound so petty.
I would definitely be a fatty like poor Sophie Hamel, and my asthma might mark me out as one of the frail ones. Lax sounds fun but I’m probable too uncoordinated for skiing. I would probably be a poor correspondent but my family would be pretty good, the food sounds right up my street bar the hot milk.
On balance I would try it for a year!

@Papergirl1968

Would you have wanted to go to the Chalet School? On balance, I don't think I would. I used to love the idea of boarding school, but in reality I'd hate the cold baths, the religion being rammed down your throat, the endless petty rules, the lack of privacy, and the being so far from family.

OH HELL NO. Give me Kingscote any day. The girls are bitchier and the food isn't as good but at least it's not in another country, they make allowances for Jewish girls (I'd have been buggered at the CS) and you're allowed to have some privacy and free time.

Apologies for the long post, but I wrote this on a thread about writers writing themselves into a corner. It's about the whole thing with the triplets and Switzerland and it's one thing that's nagged at me for ages.

The whole thing about the Chalet School not taking under-12s when it moves to Switzerland. Except EBD wrote herself into a corner, because:

• EBD wanted to keep Joey involved with the school, especially as Jack is head of the Swiss sanatorium, so she has to move out there anyway.

• EBD also wanted to keep the Maynard triplets involved with the main branch, rather than keeping them in England where the other branch is. However, there's a problem: the Maynard triplets are 10 during the move. Which means they're underage for the CS, but they can't go to a local school in Switzerland or stay behind in England.

• Solution: all the triplets get put with older girls. Len is in with the Upper Fourth, which in modern terms translates to Year 9 (so she's with 13-14 year olds), Con is in the Lower Fourth (approximate age range 12-13) and Margot is in the Upper Third (approximate age range 11-12), the closest form to their age, and she's treated like it's a massive disgrace for her to be with girls who aren't that much older than her and is expected to work her way up the school.

• The Swiss CS starts taking juniors and even later, Kindergarten pupils, which makes the whole thing moot anyway.

• The triplets are rapidly moving up the school despite being relatively young, so EBD creates the Inter V form to keep them in for a bit until they're older. Several girls' ages also get changed so that they're in the triplets' year.

• Boring Len ends up becoming Head Girl for several books.

The whole idea of uprooting a school and moving it to Switzerland, despite most of the staff being British, is completely batshit as well even by kids' book standards, but EBD just handwaved it. The reason is that EBD wanted to recreate the Tyrol years and the teachers keep banging on about how they mean to go back to the Tyrol one day, even though the school is settled in the UK and most of the pupils are British, but the CS couldn't have gone back to Austria because of the political situation, which EBD acknowledges, so she does the next best thing and moves the school to Switzerland, with the odd trip to the Tyrol in between. I know the CBB lot would go 'BUT IT'S FOR CHILDREN' but I'm sure even young readers might have found the whole idea a bit weird. And it happens so fast and everyone's parents are magically OK with their daughters going to school in a notoriously expensive country, and needing to fork out extra for things like skis and the new uniform, and all the staff go along with it except for one teacher who stays behind in the UK because she's got a good job offer and hates having to speak German (she joined in the war years when the trilingual policy wasn't a thing) and some of the younger teachers are really rude to her about it and treat her like she's some kind of traitor.

I wonder how the series would have developed if they'd stayed in Britain. It does get a bit of a boost from the move initially, I think. You are right @PhilSwagielka about how EBD messes with her timelines by dragging the triplets to Switzerland. That's a really interesting post.

It feels toward the end of the series as if it's all frozen in time. Is that more because the triplets are hanging on perpetually in the sixth, or because EBD's Switzerland just never changes?

I wonder if she'd have stayed as popular if the books had stayed in Britain. I always thought France or Italy might have suited her better than Switzerland too. But maybe she was determined that war would never again disrupt her school

I wonder what would have happened if more of the established characters had stayed behind in Britain and we got glimpses into both schools. A few do, like the Dawbarns, but then they go to Switzerland later on.

I think part of the reason why it feels frozen in time is because the Platz is so cut off from society. In Tyrol, Armishire and even St Briavels (because of the mainland connection, the Christy family and Kester Bellever), there are local people and families who give it a sense of community: the herdsmen, local clergy, the apple seller, Herr Braun, the Temple clan, various shopkeepers and Welsh servants with weird names, the local sweet shop owner and so on. In Switzerland, they're out in bumfuck nowhere with this little community of expats, Old Girls, doctors and their families, and people like the Rutherfords who've got family at the Sanatorium. There's very few Swiss families or local people: OK, there's the families they stay with on the obligatory half-term trips but they're all in different areas and they're not part of the Platz community. And that's one reason why the setting just doesn't work. They're not as close to a town as they were in the other settings, it's no wonder they were still putting their hair up and using exactly the same expressions as they were in the '20s and '30s ('alarums and excursions', 'one so young and fair', 'my only aunt Sophonisba', various Scottish expressions from non-Scottish characters, and the classic 'work like a n***'). Occasionally you'll get new slang like 'fab' or 'smashing' but the girls' vocabulary is stuck in the past. I'm guessing it was because EBD was pretty old by then and not interacting with girls like she was earlier on.

@PhilSwagielka

I wonder what would have happened if more of the established characters had stayed behind in Britain and we got glimpses into both schools. A few do, like the Dawbarns, but then they go to Switzerland later on.

I think part of the reason why it feels frozen in time is because the Platz is so cut off from society. In Tyrol, Armishire and even St Briavels (because of the mainland connection, the Christy family and Kester Bellever), there are local people and families who give it a sense of community: the herdsmen, local clergy, the apple seller, Herr Braun, the Temple clan, various shopkeepers and Welsh servants with weird names, the local sweet shop owner and so on. In Switzerland, they're out in bumfuck nowhere with this little community of expats, Old Girls, doctors and their families, and people like the Rutherfords who've got family at the Sanatorium. There's very few Swiss families or local people: OK, there's the families they stay with on the obligatory half-term trips but they're all in different areas and they're not part of the Platz community. And that's one reason why the setting just doesn't work. They're not as close to a town as they were in the other settings, it's no wonder they were still putting their hair up and using exactly the same expressions as they were in the '20s and '30s ('alarums and excursions', 'one so young and fair', 'my only aunt Sophonisba', various Scottish expressions from non-Scottish characters, and the classic 'work like a n***'). Occasionally you'll get new slang like 'fab' or 'smashing' but the girls' vocabulary is stuck in the past. I'm guessing it was because EBD was pretty old by then and not interacting with girls like she was earlier on.

Do you know, I think you have put your finger on why I find the Swiss books are so much less enjoyable. The girls are no longer at all realistic. In the early books there is a warmth and a veracity in their doings (well I know it was unusual to sing people better but - come on - science was not as advanced as it is now!), their thoughts, speech and actions were believable in their time. But in the Swiss books the girls have not moved on at all - they still speak and act as they did 30 years ago.

Add that to the repetitive plots and the books just are not of the same quality.

And because the older books were better written, the notorious Red Sarafan moment or psychic Fiona or Karl Linders dropping a message for the school where moments where you could suspend your disbelief.

The friendship groups are a lot more identikit as well in the Swiss years, compared to the Quintette, the Quartette, Bride's group, Peggy's friendship group or Gay, Jacynth and Gillian. There are few characters who really stand out. In Bride's group you've got some very distinctive personalities, but the Gang are interchangeable except OOAO, Vi and Verity, and maybe Barbara. There are some interesting and fun new girls - Jane, Ruey, the two Sams, Nina (who is one of the best written characters of the Swiss era for me), Ros and Joan, Jo Scott - but they nearly all get assimilated into the triplets' friendship group. Jack's group are a bunch of sheep. And there's less focus on the Middles and Juniors compared to the earlier books, which had people like Evadne, Margia, Cornelia etc. or Daisy, Beth and Gwensi. Three Go is one of my favourites because EBD writes tween girls so well, and Mary-Lou is really sweet and funny and hasn't turned into an all-knowing heroine yet.

Yes, agree about Nina. And I wonder if it helps that she has that "genius" tag - the book is never going to be about how she settles down as a member of the 'Gang' or Jack's circle or ... the triplets' friendship group doesn't even have a name, does it? I can think of reasons for that. It's about her and she's a great fresh character.

Oh gosh PhilSwagielka you’ve put your finger on something there - in the earlier settings the school settled in an existing community and integrated (to a certain extent) with where they were living.

In the Swiss books it’s basically a closed community - a sort of stateless Chalet School and San enclave in a seemingly unpeopled bit of the Alps. When they go on excursions they’re still doing so like they’re foreign tourists. Which probably explains some of the problems with sense of place in the Swiss books. It’s basically England with different food and weather and some good day trips.

I think that might be why the trip to Tiernsee in COA struck me so much - the contrast with how they were part of the community there and still remembered and welcomed warmly 15-odd years later….

It's a shame Joey was so obnoxious and obsessed over getting her holiday home, because the return to Tyrol had the potential to be great (and it meant a lot to Sybil because she was born there). As you say, the fact people in the Tiernsee area still remember her and the other Quartette members shows what a huge part of the community the CS was.

It would have been nice if EBD had added a few locals, maybe shopkeepers or whoever, to add some flavour to the Platz and make it feel more like a real home. (And I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds it IMMENSELY annoying that all the girls and mistresses use exactly the same expressions from Tyrol to Switzerland - it's almost like the CS has its own dialect!)

Got my copy of Princess today! Elisaveta is wonderful and I love her. And Nina K Brisley's art is gorgeous.

Actually, I've remembered ANOTHER thing I hate about the CS and that's the obsession with policing the girls' language. I kind of get the slang ban because there are a lot of girls in the Tyrol who aren't native English speakers and might find slang hard to understand (and it's not correct English), but there's things like Miss Annersley having a go at Len for overusing the word 'marvellous'. Or the teachers constantly picking the girls up on things like grammar when they speak. It would drive me up the wall.

I love Princess! Elisaveta is such a well drawn character despite the very far-fetched scenario.

I don't mind the language stuff so much but I think it gels with my own experience more! I went to a boarding and day school in Australia (not like the Chalet School) but I do remember English teachers imploring us to be less boring and repetitious in the language we used - though they were less strict about slang.

And they were fucking nuts about good grammar. May/can and I/me were absolutely drummed into us from the junior school. Let alone the idea that if someone asked you how you were, you would dare to answer 'I'm good, thanks'. You'd get a sarcastic 'That may or may not be the case, and we can debate it later, but I was asking if you were well.'

Actually maybe it was a little bit like the CS. Less snow though.

Veta and Nina are my two favourite characters by far. They just seem the most real to me. Finished Sams but not managed to pluck up the effort to start Anthea, hiding myself in the St Mary’s books in the meantime

@FelicityBeedle

Veta and Nina are my two favourite characters by far. They just seem the most real to me. Finished Sams but not managed to pluck up the effort to start Anthea, hiding myself in the St Mary’s books in the meantime

Never thought of that, but they are lovely and have a bit of a similar vibe - two strong-minded girls brought up by loving fathers. Are they the only two in the series? There are girls brought up by dysfunctional fathers ( Ruey, Ricky) and nice but absent fathers (Annis, Robin) but I think Veta and Nina are two of their own kind?

@FelicityBeedle

Veta and Nina are my two favourite characters by far. They just seem the most real to me. Finished Sams but not managed to pluck up the effort to start Anthea, hiding myself in the St Mary’s books in the meantime

If they are your two favourites, have you read EBD's School by the River? It's the nearest thing you could get to a Genius / Princess crossover - features schoolgirl musicians in Belsornia's neighbouring ?Mirania.

To me it seems the closest non-chalet book EBD wrote to the CS series - has quite a Tyrol days feel to it. And available on Kindle

Apparently this is the window of my local Oxfam bookshop today - I'm off to have a look later, see how much is left...

www.instagram.com/p/CQtdlNLH4K1/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

[quote JassyRadlett]Apparently this is the window of my local Oxfam bookshop today - I'm off to have a look later, see how much is left...

www.instagram.com/p/CQtdlNLH4K1/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link[/quote]
Wow! What a beautiful display too.

Did you buy anything - was it still intact?

I didn’t make it! Unexpected meetings. Tomorrow lunchtime - if anything is left!!

Oooh, nice. Hope you manage to snap up some of those books!