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The Secret Commonwealth - spoilers

33 replies

Loopytiles · 06/10/2019 21:01

Had been looking forward to this, but disappointed. Started well, but was just so bleak, a drab world, way too much content about the politics, clunky philosophising and too obvious parallels to some of today’s current affairs and problems.

OP posts:
Original poster
Loopytiles · 06/10/2019 21:03

Had quite liked Belle Sauvage.

Particularly disliked the teacher being “in love with” the pupil being presented as fine because she was no longer his pupil, especially with the age gap.

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CalmConfident · 06/10/2019 21:33

I did not like the Mal in love with Lyra theme either...bit icky Confused

One thing I noticed...lots of going on about Wills ability to “go invisible”. This dovetails with my theory that his mum is a proper witch stranded in our world...and that witches daemons can still separate but are all cats. His cat tripping up the man, that random cat showing the way to cittogazze (and getting hounded by children there later), Jon parry refusing the witch who eventually kills him (already committed/married to a witch ) and of course then wills invisible act and cat daemon. Just needed to get that out my system!!!

Also, the steam ship schedule for the levant is in the Lyras oxford book as well as their encounter with the oxford alchemist..

CalmConfident · 06/10/2019 21:34

But yes...felt a bit laboured...need the next book!!!

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Loopytiles · 06/10/2019 21:45

Interesting theory, CalmConfident.

I did really want Will, or his daemon to appear.

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CalmConfident · 06/10/2019 22:11

Me too..I like Will more than Lyra 😁

LaBelleSauvage123 · 06/10/2019 22:27

I haven’t quite finished - loved the first part, but agree that once Lyra, Malcolm and Pan go on their separate journeys it gets a bit laboured. Too plot and theme driven for me - not enough character and relationships.

Juliecloud · 07/10/2019 19:45

I did like it but I’m a bit disappointed by all the loose ends. I’m sure Philip Pullman will bring it altogether in the next one but I wish I didn’t have to wait for it (another 2 years?)

I felt so sad for Lyra and Pan and their broken relationship. Oh and when Lyra thought she saw Will, but it was Olivier 😭😭😭😭

Could Will’s daemon be stranded in Lyra’s world? That’s what I thought when Lyra was dreaming about seeing Will’s daemon (or was that when she was using the alethiometer, I can’t remember).

Pantalaimon88 · 08/10/2019 16:39

Just finished!

I agree with Loopy that it was much bleaker and darker than HDM and LBS, and doesn’t have the same sense of magic. But I wonder if that’s because in those books, the protagonists are all children, and in TSC they are all adults. Maybe that was deliberate, and similar to the Harry Potter books, the tone shifts and changes as the characters get older?

It did seem very seeped in politics which I found quite difficult to follow in places. I’m hoping this will all be tied up in the final book.

I like Malcolm’s character a lot, I’d be happy if he ended up with Lyra. I really hope we see Will again though in the final book, even if we just see his daemon. I was really saddened by Lyra and Pan’s estrangement Sad

Also, I’m quite pleased with myself as whilst reading LBS I hazarded a guess that Alice was the housekeeper in Jordan who raised Lyra! I doubted myself though due to the different last name and the fact I’d imagined the housekeeper to be much older. But I’m pleased I was right about that!

LaBelleSauvage123 · 09/10/2019 07:57

Finished too. On reflection I think that it was less satisfying because of the separate journey structure - Lyra, Pan and Malcolm meet other characters fleetingly along the way but there’s no time to build relationships that engage us. Whereas in the original trilogy one of the most compelling aspects for me was the relationships with people Lyra met on her journey - Iorek, Sarafina, Lee Scoresby etc - who were all fully fleshed characters.

slipperyeel · 14/10/2019 20:42

Just finished it, what a cliffhanger!
I loved being back in that world, so immersive, so finely drawn.
I’m going to have to let it settle but my first reaction is that I loved it.

milienhaus · 15/10/2019 10:16

I liked the beginning and the end but felt it got a bit lost in the middle with all the philosophy - can’t wait for book 3 though after that cliffhanger!

QuaterMiss · 16/10/2019 22:17

Mmm ... ‘Laboured’ is apt. But ‘immersive’ also.

I never like this separate journeys structure and here it seemed forced, even artificial. Maybe because I just didn’t believe the initial premise. If my daemon had left me I wouldn’t immediately assume he was travelling to a hideous place halfway across the world - and that I must follow him there.

And too much of it was essentially Bourne - inescapably visual and filmic, rather than, as in earlier books, challenging one’s imagination to conjure up a primarily psychological trauma.

The train assault was brutally horrific though.

Not sure, overall. Was hard going, but as always I feel somewhat bereft once I step out if that world. And I longed for Will ...

(Btw, maybe a stupid question because I can’t recall details from earlier books, but is Olivier going to turn out to be her brother?)

QuaterMiss · 18/10/2019 14:27

Wot - only nine people in MN-land have read it???

CalmConfident · 19/10/2019 06:24

I expected more too !

ShinyMe · 23/10/2019 19:05

Well I liked it. In a frustrating way in that I wanted Pan and Lyra to find each other, and I wanted Malcolm (I love him) to find Lyra, and I want to know what happens to Alice. It's frustrating that everything is unresolved and difficult and awful, but I think that's still good.

I absolutely don't want to see Will again. I love Will, but I think it would be a cop out to somehow reunite him. They were separated for ever at the end of HDM, and they need to stay that way. He talked about 'if we marry other people we have to not compare...' etc, and I think that's important.

I also loved Nur Hada and the way she was used. She's the Grenfell Tower girl who was added to raise money for Grenfell, and I love that he made her significant and important.

The thing that stuck out for me is the comparison between the scene where Lyra feels awful at having inadvertently taken that fire guy to his death by super-energy-joining-to-his-daemon experiment with a mad scientist, to the scene where she inadvertently took Roger to his death in a super-energy-splitting-from-his-daemon with a mad scientist.

blackteaplease · 31/10/2019 22:05

Oh I was bitterly disappointed by this but mainly because I thought this was the second of a pair of books that wrapped around the trilogy.

I didn't like the shift to adult perspective, the language, Lyra's experience on the train or the reference to periods. I thought it was unnecessary.

I did like the characters we met and also the further detail on Alice and malcolm and I do wonder whether Olivier is Lyras brother.

IsolaPribby · 01/11/2019 07:40

I've just finished La Belle Sauvage and really enjoyed it. I read the original trilogy some time ago, and found the books got stranger as I went on. So I am thinking perhaps I should re read them now, to get the chronology right, or should I go straight to The Secret Commonwealth?

SurpriseSparDay · 01/11/2019 08:07

It’s interesting to realise that from now on people will be able to read the five (soon six?) books in the order of Lyra’s chronological age.

Although that would mean beginning with an issue regarding the person/daemon relationship that wasn’t a feature of the core three Northern Lights books at all. Hmm ... Also I have the feeling that PP went to the trouble of introducing daemons quite carefully in NL - whereas in La Belle Sauvage that relationship is taken for granted.

fishonabicycle · 06/11/2019 13:38

I thoroughly enjoyed the secret commonwealth - such a cliffhanger though! I might have to reread the first 3 again ....

UrsulaPandress · 06/11/2019 13:50

I am now going to have to read the first three books again.

I enjoyed it but did not feel as engrossed - maybe as I was reading on my kindle. Very disappointed when I realised I was nearly at the end. Is it shorter than the original three?

superfandango · 06/11/2019 14:02

I agree with you @SurpriseSparDay. Theoretically you could read the books in chronological order, but the human/daemon relationship isn't explained in LBS so someone new to the stories wouldn't necessarily be able to pick it up in that order.

timswifey · 09/11/2019 21:29

Finished Secret Commonwealth and really enjoyed being back in Lyra's world - although it's horrible that she's separated from Pan and I agree with those who said the whole tone of the book is pretty dark and sad.

Cannot wait for the next book! It's unlike Philip Pullman to end on such a cliffhanger. Might need to read His Dark Materials again during the break...

Supersimkin2 · 10/11/2019 15:29

Underwhelmed, me. Miles less imagination than HDM at work - no brilliant new characters or gadgets, and where the tale does lift off, we just get a rather graphic rape and some gross stuff about all-too unimaginary political problems in our world, now.

Also, cafes: about 50. Why? Was the book sponsored by Lavazza?

I suspect it was written as a film, very visual and lots of quick wins on the location front (see above).

Catmint · 10/11/2019 15:49

I struggled with the overall bleak world view, and Pan & Lyra's estrangement.

But there were some good characters in there, too. I I love Hannah, and Mal's mother and the secretary. And Alice, of course. And the woman on the boat who organised everyone.

I thought that Mal would be in love with Lyra, I felt that this was presaged very strongly in LBS. Also, we know already what he has been through for Lyra - he isnt Will, but he is a worthy partner.

seasidequayside · 11/11/2019 13:27

I have about 100 pages to go. I'm enjoying it, but like others have said, I find the separate journeys structure a bit contrived. I like Malcolm a lot and will be happy if he ends up with Lyra. I'm overwhelmed (in good and bad ways) by the complexity of the story. I like the parallels with our own political upheavals - refugee boats, etc. Overall I think around 8 out of 10 so far. Good, but not astonishingly so.