January Modern Classic: In Cold Blood by Truman Capote

[mmack]

Just starting the thread so that we can sign in.

1. Truman Capote claimed that everything in the book is true. Do you believe it is or do you think that he was influenced by Perry into romanticising the middle part of the story? If you don't believe that it's all factual does it matter?

I think there's an awful lot of poetic license, particularly with regard to Perry and Dick. Presumably, most of the information about what the got up to after the murder but before the arrest came from their own accounts, which obviously can't really be trusted.

A lot of time capote talks about dick and Perry's thoughts and feelings - it is impossible to tell what he is basing this on. I think for a lot of the book, dick and Perry are far more 'fictional characters' than 'real life'. To his credit, although he has romanticised the pair to a certain extent - at points it has a 'gangster movie antihero' sort of vibe - I don't think he has over-sensationalised them to the point of obscenity.

1. The book was published soon after the executions. The existence of the book must have been very difficult for the Clutter family and their friends, particularly the surviving sisters and Bobby. Do you think it was a story that needed to be told? Do you think Capote was entitled to use a horrible crime as the basis for his book?

I do agree it just be awful for the people involved. I believe Bobby was a key source for the book though. The surviving sisters are barely mentioned, which I thought odd but presumably (and understandably) they weren't happy with the premise.

However, I do think people are entitled to write about whatever they want; I think any other way is a slippery slope into over-censorship. I do think the book itself has been fairly sensitively handled - similar modern books tend to be much more of a gore-fest, and also seem to lay at least part of the blame on the victim.

1. I thought it was very much a book of its time. I'm thinking of the 1950s and 1960s in America as a time when films like Rebel Without A Cause and The Wild One were very popular. Do you think anyone would write a book about a similar crime now? Also, do you think this book would ever have been written if Dick and Perry were black?

I think it's interesting as on a wider scale in the western world there was a bit of a 'moral panic' in general around that time - post-war prosperity, the feminist movement and the birth of rock'n'roll changed what it meant to be 'a young adult' forever and suddenly people were challenging authority. There was also a lot of paranoia about people who didn't 'toe the line'.

Capote depicts the Cutter family as the epitome of the American dream, at least on the surface. Dick and Perry, on the other hand, are very much representative of 'the underclass'; transient, uneducated but possessed of a low sort of cunning, desperate to take off hardworking folk and not caring who they hurt.

In that way, I think the book represented the feeling at the time, and I do think it would be told differently nowadays - a story of police incompetence or cover ups, perhaps.

1. Who do you think was more guilty of the crime, Dick or Perry? Would they ever have done anything so evil if they hadn't been together?

Perry is certainly painted more sympathetically than Dick; he's a wannabe intellectual with a hellish past and actually seems to have a strong moral compass - he's aghast at dicks sexual proclivities and always wants to do the 'right thing'. However, according to the book, he is the one who coldly killed them. To me, this suggests that he is a very disturbed individual and on that basis, I think he would've committed a similar act without dicks input.

Dick on the other hand, treats women like dirt, is a peadophile and much more prone to violence. He seems to be an opportunistic petty criminal who is actually something of a coward. I suspect on his own, he wouldn't have done it.

Interestingly, I believe they are still the main suspects in a similar killing in Florida in 1959.

Heck, that's a bit of an essay

Was it just the intrusion on others' private grief that made you dislike it? I avoided this book for weeks partly because I thought there might be nightmare inducing details. Once I started reading it took slightly too long to get going. And it's disturbing that his portrayal of the murderers is so much more compelling than that of the victims. But slowly, slowly I was talked round to taking an interest. And then he made me laugh. Which is bad. But the reference to Perry's Personal Dictionary (surely invented or selectively quoted) was as if the author actually winked. As if he were saying "ok I know this is cheesy, you know it's cheesy but stick with it and we'll find a way through" - or whatever.

So for me the middle section (possibly relying most on imagination) was the least un-enjoyable.

How did I miss your exemplary deconstruction CCR?

I'm very interested in what you say about how there is more victim blaming in the contemporary equivalent of this book. (I never read true crime so have nothing to compare it to.)

That's interesting about Bobby being a source for the book. I agree that the investigators came out looking very well. They seemed to have gotten the confessions very easily. Perry and Dick seem to have been treated almost too well by everyone after the arrest. It's hard to believe that no one manhandled them a bit. I read on Wikipedia that Marie Dewey was a major source and I think that shows.

Zero, I also didn't like it because I thought it was boring. I agree that the middle section was the most enjoyable to read. It was a bit like Cannery Row but without the charm. The account of the trial was bone dry. I don't think true crime is genre I'll be investigating further.

To be honest, I've only read a few - for some reason our hospital waiting room is packed full of them! Very uplifting

Victim-blaming, I think I maybe used too strong a term - but the ones I've read seem a lot less sympathetic towards the victim; the onus seems to be on building sympathy and empathy toward the perpetrator or against the incompetence of the police. There is almost a voyueristic quality to them, far more so than ICB - or maybe it's because the events in ICB happened a long time ago in another country, so it just feels less so.

Capote is very much 'this is what happened'. Although Perry has undoubtedly had a troubled past, this is not used as an excuse for his actions. Capote doesn't indulge in indepth psychological analysis and is in fact quite dismissive of the psychiatric reports- for such a key part of the defence, very little is made of them in the book. The book doesn't try to answer the question 'why did it happen?' at all really.

I think a modern version would be written more along the lines of exploring the killer's mind state and motivation - and who was to 'blame' for the murders.

In this case, not the family - although I wonder if a modern audience would react to this 'perfect' family in a modern setting - might the godliness and honesty of Mr Clutter not be hiding a darker secret? Is Mrs Clutter depressed because he beats her? Etc. I don't think in a contemporary version the audience would accept the clutter family as 'real'.

The parole board and the police would get a going over too, no doubt, in a contemporary version.

And that's before you get to dick and Perry.

I read this years ago in my teens. I loved it because of his way of making you live through what was happening - that style is really common now but very uncommon when he wrote the book.

Then moved to the US, took a job and saw it in the library and read it again about 15 years later. I recognised a name/person in the book - someone who had been in the army with Perry I think and who reached out t him. Years later when I knew him he was an engineer - a very good one and a very very decent human being.

Ok. So do you think it deserves a place in a modern classics list?

CCR I absolutely don't see it as a "this is how it was" type of authorship. He was playing with us. I was bored and fearful while he described the town and the farm - but then he enticed me with the "romantic" outlaws and kept me hanging on with the growing cracks in their relationship. And the boy and his grandfather - straight out of a fairytale, straight out of Beckett, just when they were needed to add variety.

If I turn on the radio and come into the middle of a piece of music I would normally ignore, but find myself listening anyway, I always that it had been held together by one particular conductor who simply has the knack of persuading me that every note is there for a reason. I truly don't think I could have been dragged through this story (in this form) by any other writer. It was masterly. But deeply dishonest.

How on earth did you come to meet him CanYou? And do you still value Capote's version of events?

(Your name btw has pierced my heart. I read that book while going through a relationship disaster and I think I wept from start to finish.)

Do I think it's a modern classic? I'll have to weigh it up.

I think you have to admire his originality and the sheer amount of research that went into the writing of this book. I think in some parts it is very evocative of a time and place in American history. Perry, Dick and the Clutters are characters I won't ever forget.
On the other hand I was never fully engaged with the writing. The issues I mentioned in earlier post made it an uncomfortable read.

On balance I don't think I'd put it on my list of must-reads so not a classic for me.

I think that's it for me for tonight. Thanks for coming and discussing the book with me. It's been interesting and I hope this thread keeps going for a few more days.

I'm thinking of passing it on to my DM. Sweeney Todd is her favourite film and she has no morals whatsoever so won't suffer on behalf of the sufferers.

But thank you! I would never have picked this of my own volition and I'm very pleased to have read it. I might try Other Voices, Other Rooms at some stage.

(Though I can see why I would never have enjoyed an English degree. I don't care about the RL effect on people connected to the event, I don't care much about the sociological relevance. I only care about what the writer is saying to me and what might be shared between our two particular heads. I would get no marks.)

Remind me what's next ...

The Handmaid's Tale is my February book. I borrowed In Cold Blood from the library but splashed out bought this one so I hope that's a good omen.

I meant more that he doesn't spend time looking for explanations or motivations. Capote is quite subtle, especially in the context of the genre which tends to over-sensationalise.

It is masterful writing, and I agree that another writer couldn't have pulled it off.

Do I think it deserves to be a modern classic?

I'm going to say yes, for the writing an for the premise, which was pretty much unheard of at the time.