Did you read all 600+ pages of Bone Clocks?

[Whyisthekitteninsane]

And if so, what did you think? I liked the beginning with Holly so much and it promised such a big world and story. Then it was all bogged down in Baghdad and competitive bitchy writers getting drunk. I felt he had sandwiched two books together and when it came back round to Holly in the last third of the book, she might as well have been anyone, all character lost.

I'm on page 60, just getting into it. I hope this thread won't fill with spoilers soon.

Judging by Cloud Atlas, I'd guess that if the character "might as well have been anyone" by the end, that would be because David Mitchell wanted her to be. Can't say why before I finish the book, obviously

I think you'll see what I mean, CoteDAzur, when you get to the end. Would love to know your thoughts then.

I enjoyed the first four sections very much but got rather bogged down in the fifth section where it all gets rather bizarre (trying to avoid spoilers). I wasn't quite sure what it was all about in the end. I expect Cote will explain it to us when she's finished though.

Have this on order. Can't wait to read it. Also looking forward to Cote's assessment of the book & ending.

Well, I read it and it's good but it's not Cloud Atlas imho. I need to get the kids from school now but am looking forward to talk about it on here tonight.

OK, here it goes. I'll repeat the stuff I said on the 50-Book Challenge thread first:

The similarities between Cloud Atlas and The Bone Clocks are quite extensive, to the point that the latter feels like an imitation of the former:

Both books feature:

• 6 stories
• ... all of which are first-person accounts
• ... spanning decades
• ... starting in the past (1984) and extending far in the future (2043)
• ... and ending on a roll rather than winding down, as if they were cut prematurely

The themes are similar, too:

• Man's selfishness & cruelty, especially towards each other
• The yearning for safeguarding our knowledge/self/experiences for posterity
• Growing old
• Dystopian future

Cloud Atlas was original, gripping, and well... perfect First halves of the stories marched towards an inevitable conclusion, with the dystopian and post-apocalyptic two feeling incredibly real. Then came the second halves, and the reader is locked into the epic ensemble, with no escape from the author's logic as shown over and over in a variety of ways across continents and centuries. People are cruel and exploitive, we kill and enslave when we can; we have not changed, will never change, and this will be our downfall. Our technology will disappear in a single generation, just like our experiences and memories do as we grow old and die. It is a powerful blow to the gut, made all the more painful because of the hopeful note it ends with (1st story, so 1850s... but the reader already knows how the human story will end sad because the last story was laid out in full in the middle of the book).

A similar theme plays out in The Bone Clocks in a very similar format, but in a less effective way imho and for it I blame its fantastical/supernatural subplot of warring immortals.

I'm not quite sure why the author has felt the need for this subplot, especially since it takes up almost 25% of the book and imho doesn't add much to it (or maybe I haven't figured it out yet), while the other 5 narratives take up between 14%-17%.

Re fantasy subplot:

Why has David Mitchell seen the need for the whole warring immortals story? Does it really add anything to the book? (I'd be interested in your answers to this)

What I see as the main theme that this book explores is the drive for survival and the selfish/reckless/ruthless lengths to which people will go to survive:

• Holly comes from an underprivileged family and does what she can to get by on her own
• Holly's roommate tells her about all that she will have to do to survive in the world on her own.
• Hugo is a sociopath and his survival instinct has no counterweight in conscience or empathy. He also comes from a (relatively) underprivileged background and has no problems with who he hurts as he goes about manipulating people for his ends.
• Ed is an adrenaline junkie for whom survival is a game, a hobby. However, through his eyes, we see Iraqis' desolation and their very real fight for survival (which will then be repeated in future Ireland, in the last story told again by Holly)
• Crispin Hershey fights for his reputation, not his physical survival, but does it in a shockingly ruthless way. His selfishness stops him from reversing the damage.
• Marinus et al, despite their immortality through reincarnation setting them apart from mere mortals, put their very lives on the line and risk true death for innocents they don't know and will never meet.
• The other group of immortals brutally kill children to extend their own lives.
• At the end, Holly is truly fighting for survival, in a time of poverty, scarcity, and return to a medieval way of life.

The book seems to be asking "How far is it OK to go in the fight for survival?" - Is it OK to kill someone else to live longer? And if you are horrified by that, is it really different than our generation causing certain death and misery to future generations by selfishly and recklessly exploiting the world's resources?

The author has an answer to the dilemma: The best way to live forever is not through luck-of-the-draw reincarnation or exploiting others for your own selfish ends. It is living through your descendants, passing your knowledge and wisdom on to people you love and who love you, seeing your mannerisms, phrases, physical features, and memories live on in your children and grandchildren.

I have quite a few problems with this book, though, and really feel that it doesn't work as well as the perfect work of art that Cloud Atlas was.

(1) "The Script" is never explained. Is it fate? Does the soi-disant existence of the Script mean there is an Author who wrote it?

(2) Dystopian future feels forced rather than real. OK, I get the oil shortage, but a nuclear disaster and economic meltdown at the same time? In Cloud Atlas, the dystopian and post-apocalyptic futures felt real in a way that they just don't in The Bone Clocks, imho.

(3) The explanation for how the Acolytes achieve immortality is rather shabby. Their whole story, from the chapel in the air to the demigod in an icon, the Dusk, the march of the souls etc is clumsy, full of holes, and made me want to go .

That's a pretty good analysis, Cote. I am mystified by the warring immortals subplot as it read to me like pastiche. I kept being reminded of the last series of Torchwood where the aliens were killing human children to survive.

Just finished this book. My very quick review (can't do a Cote!):

Fifteen year old Holly runs away from home, a privileged Cambridge undergraduate leads a double life, a war correspondent is torn between family and work, an author is determined to take revenge on his harshest critic, a battle erupts between two species of immortals, a seventy-five year old Holly lives with her two orphaned grandchildren in a world devastated by climate change and human greed... Interweaving each story is a fantasy sub-plot (involving those immortals) that connects the characters together. The narrative stretches from 1984 to 2043 and travels between Britain, South & North America, Iceland, Australia, Shanghai, Ireland and Iraq.

This was an exquisite, quite emotional read. Mitchell is a terrific storyteller and his prose is so detailed and well-written, you want to wallow in it. I was so deflated when the book ended as I wanted it to go on with more stories.

Didn't mind the warring immortals subplot, which is interesting as I rarely read fantasy or sci-fi. I was actually absorbed by it even though I didn't take it seriously.

I absolutely loved this book. I've read all his books and apart from Black Swan Green they are usually epic in scale. So I was prepared for a huge cast, many decades and countries to feature.

I like your analysis Cote though I wouldn't say Hugo was from an underprivileged back ground. Grammar school and Cambridge and the descriptions of home, wine sounded firmly upper middle class to me.

Agreed with point 3. Philip Pullman does this much better in the Dark Materials trilogy.

This is not the type of book I would normally go for but I'm listening to it as I got it cheap on audible! Really love it so far,though I only at the stage where holly is at the fruit picking place

Skater - When I said Hugo was "from a (relatively) underprivileged background" I was referring to his relative lack of means compared to his Oxbridge classmates, which was why he was constantly scamming, talking his way into bars, etc.

I read it all and I liked it a lot.

Whyisthekitten... I was hugely disappointed, the start as you say yourself, had such amazing promise and then it never really recovered, or reached that level of ingenuity and imagination again. I did get to the end but I have to admit there were pages (of bitchy journos) which I sort of skimmed through, desperate to get away from it.

fizzy - Read Cloud Atlas. It is everything (and more) that The Bone Clocks promises to be.

Know what you mean Cote - a bit like Cameron and the other old Etonians calling George Osbourne "oik" because he 'only' went to St Paul's.

I really liked Ed Brubecker. He was the best of Holly's loves.

I wondered if Mitchell just felt like writing a sci fi story and so crow barred the warring immortals plot in there. This is still a powerful, beautifully written book though. Started Cloud Atlas years ago but gave up on it. Going to give it another go now. Think my favourite of his is Jacob de Zoet, followed by No. 9 Dream.

Cloud Atlas is also a sci-fi story. A much better one, on pretty much exactly the same themes.

Love pretty much everything by David Mitchell. Enjoyed The Bone Clocks hugely.

Just finished this and feel a bit .

Loved Cloud Atlas and Jacob de Zoet but this just didn't hang together properly imo.

I started off really enjoying the Holly Sykes and then Hugo Lamb characters and was excited as to where it was going, enjoyed the reappearance of Ed but oh god Crispin Hershey just left me cold.

The immortals fighting? Just why and where did that come from?

The dystopian bit in Ireland was just grim. All that dialogue for absolutely no reason? I kept scanning the pages to see if I could skip it as there seemed to be no discernible reason to include it.

I love the way he writes but just felt that he was trying to recreate Cloud Atlas and failed.

The best bit about it is the beautiful cover!

I can see exactly what everyone is saying but I disagree. I loved this book, and think it is one of my favourite books ever. I actually preferred it to Cloud Atlas - although I really enjoyed that to (as I have all of his books). I am astonished by Mitchell's ability to draw together such (apparently) disparate stories. It's definitely worth the effort. I might have to go back and re read it now!

In which way do you feel The Bone Clocks was better than Cloud Atlas?

Oops, sorry for the delay Cote. I thought the story was more cohesive, I found that Cloud Atlas felt more like a series of separate stories. I still loved it but I was blown away by Bone Clocks. As I said I've enjoyed all of Mitchell's books, I really enjoyed Black Swan Green too, which was totally different again. A very clever man!