Philippa Gregory. Trashy or not?

[MaryMotherOfCheeses]

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I have liked some of PG's historical stuff but hated Wideacre. Try The Little House but the DVD has little in common with the book. Double twist at the end.

The 'Zelda ......whatever is just crap.

I've read a couple of the not-based-on-true ones (am not really interested in historical royal scandals) and quite enjoyed them.

The Wildacre trilogy was my first foray. I found them really good reads but beware, they're quite umm... how do I say this without spoilering? They're more deviant from the norm than I expect most bodice-rippers to be. Don't read if you're easily offended/against reading fairly explicit material. If, however, you're harder to shock then I'd recommend them.

The other one I read is Fallen Skies, which was also quite good. Took, IMO, a while to get going and the ending happened all in a rush, but it has been about 2 years since reading, so I might have a slightly off memory.

ellodarlin, do you mean the Boleyn inheritance? i really enjoyed that. i also enjoyed the other boleyn girl. I have read the virgin queen (i think thats what its called) but i cant really remember much about it so couldn't have had much impact. I have quite a few of her others but haven't got round to reading them yet

Alison Weir - i love her books. i have read a non-fiction book of hers about Henry VIIIs wives which i thought would be hard going as it was thick and tiny text but i thought it was so interesting.

i also loved 'Innocent Traitor' about lady Jane Grey - ive read it twice now. I would definately recommend her books.

I also wrote to her once - and she sent me a card back

She's brilliant! I love her books. I must read the red queen and the white queen.

"juicychops" I also love Alison Weir's books and have been looking out for the one about Henry VIIIs wives. Can recommend her book on Eleanor of Aquitaine-fascinating.

gailforce, i have that one at home all ready to be read. and the Kathryn Swynford (sp?) one too

A friend has read the Kathryn Swinford book and would also recommend (I have it on my "to read" list). I hope AW is busy writing her next book!!

Trashy. The White Queen was laughable - calling someone a "numpty" in the text? Crying "Oh My God!" as if they were a C21st lottery winner? arguing that Richard of Gloucester was marching faster than Anthony Woodville from Ludlow when historically the opposite was true. That the younger prince had a jaw infection when it was possibly the older prince (if you believe in the bones). Really useless historical fiction.

I don't rate Alison Weir any higher either.
The Anya Seton book is just out for the romance.

Sharon Penman is okay.
The Fifth Queen by Ford Madox Ford is a very detailed and heavy-going novel about Katharine Howard. That was impressive.

I was totally put off Philippa Gregory after reading The Wise Woman. I thought it was creepy and warped, and it made me feel sick! Haven't dared pick up anything of hers since.

Yes, the "numpty" comment in the White Queen was particularly teeth itching. And the first few chapters especially, the "love at first sight" business, were nonsense.

Got into it though after that. But definitely one of the trashier books of hers.

Love, love, love Dorothy Dunnet and Patrick O'Brien and have just been assigned PG's White Queen for a new book club. Am now v worried after seeing Checkmate's comments, as I may be ruined for other historical fiction. (Thus far I haven't read anything that even comes close.) Plus, trashy isn't really my thing and decent grammar is. Hmm. Must choose comments carefully.

I couldnt put down Alison Weirs 'Six wives of Henry Viii'

Fascinating. Just started reading 'Children of England'- also by Alison Weir- its about Prince Edward, Mary, Elizabeth and lady Jane grey- her research is fantastic.

Have some others by her aswell (and most og P gregorys- just no time to read them!"!)

I read "The Other Boleyn Girl" years ago and really thought it well written. Have read a few others or, nearly read them and given up because her style of writing is exactly the same. The one about Mary Queen of Scots drove me mad - flitting between two queens like an unfinished conversation.

I think she had a good formulae with Boleyn Girl and stuck to it then, with every other "romantic" heroine.

Not for me.

PG is on a par with Sophie Kinsella, Kate Atkinson etc, which means I think she's rubbish.

Daughter of Time is a great book, read it first when I was about 13 and have reread it many times since.

I do wonder how quite a lot ofsome people ever get published.

Phillipa Gregory I would say is a cut above your Georgette Heyers. Very well researched books that bring alive the historical characters and create a real sense of the times. Her ongoing theme in all her books seems to be that monsters (not literal but metaphorical) are created by other humans. I liked Other Boleyn Girl, Boleyn inheritance, and the two books about the Tradescant family, Earthly Pleasures and another one whose name I forget. I thought the Zelda's cut was weird but interesting and a departure for her. One of my faVe historical novels is Forever Amber by Kathleen Winsor. A desert island book. As for historical fiction for kids -well there's a Traveller in Time by Rosemary Sutcliffe, Eagle of the Ninth, A tIme for Treason, Geoffrey Trease, and of course Terry Deary's Tudor terror. reading I Coriander at the moment by Sally Gardner. Historical fiction should be for everyone of all ages and it's good for kids as it interests them in the subject.

I read 'The White Queen' last year and I have to say that I thought it was pretty trashy. It may be well researched, but all the stuff about the mermaid ancestor was annoying and I found the style rather low-brow and bodice-ripper-ish.

No!! I like history, and have read various female texts (Jean Plaidy as a teenager, (Ohh Bloss! Soooooo romantic), and Antonia Fraser (probably historically accurate, but dry as dust). The reason I like Phillipa Gregory's historical novels, is because she tries to inject some humanity into the characters, (and daft as it seems), it can explain some of the biggest decisions that people made; however irrational they may seem to us now.

Historians never look at contextual cues, but like to follow a simplistic version of why people make the decisions that they do. What Phillipa Gregory does, is look at things in a holistic way; what else was happening to these women at this time; how could that have resulted in the documented things; and how they may have felt about it.

I must admit I am waiting for the last of the trilogy and won't even wait until it comes down in price beore I buy it!

High praise indeed from a canny Celtic Cabler!

I'l give another nod to alison weir.

Ghastly, and I'm sick of her representing herself as an historian when her degree is in English literature. She makes much of her exhaustive research but then ignores it. In The White Princess she turns Henry VII into a simpleton and a rapist, Elizabeth of York into an idiot who knows nothing about anything at all except that she lurved her uncle RIchard (and slept with him) and Margaret Beaufort into a raving loony.

Oh, and really - rape and incest seem to be her thing. Ugh.

Not A Phiippa Gregory fan -but
yy to Sharon Penman and Dorothy Dunnett - ( I fell in love with Francis Lymond !)
and I have read a few by Anne Easter Smith which I've enjoyed

GetOrf: "I read the first page of one of them (Other Boleyn Girl iirc) and it read like one of my gran's Silhouette Historical Romances."

Same here. I got to the end of chapter one of the Other Boleyn Girl, and it was awful.

MrsEyre1 I looked this up after being corrected on another thread and it seems her first degree was indeed History at Sussex, then her PhD was English.

I do agree she does research and then ignores it - she seems to go for the juiciest theory and then find a way to make the reader buy into it by building the characterisation around it. But I do find her rather good on details of everyday life and how it might have felt to live then (eg there's a lovely passage about the young Margaret Beaufort living in a castle full of men who keep banging on about boring details of bow design).

trashy - agree that there is lots of transposing a 21st mindset onto historical characters
I still love them though, for a daft, escapist easy read.