1940s low fat high carb weight loss

[Todaypicard]

Hi everyone.
Ive been struggling with weight gain since I went back to work after maternity leave 4 years ago, and have probably gained about 10kg.
Recently was reading about 1940s diets (wartime/rationing) and that this was the healthiest period of our past in terms of diet. Obesity was negligible. Diets were full of veg, whole meal bread, potatoes, with meat/cheese/sugar all rationed and therefore eaten in very small amounts. And obviously no processed food! We were also more active. Further reading finds that the countries in the world with the lowest weights and highest health outcomes are low fat/high carb countries like Japan.
I also found a great website called 1940sexperiment where a lady shares all her wartime recipes and has lost a lot of weight in the process.
So…. I’m going to have a go at more wartime eating! It might be a bit dull, but it’s certainly nutritious and filling!
Todays menu: porridge for breakfast, carrots/broccoli/cabbage/potatoes and gravy for lunch, and some vegetable soup for dinner. If anyone would like to join me then please do so!

I’m looking at macros of particular foods and my macros in general.

Okinawan diet is very different of that of mainland Japan, so no they don’t eat plenty of fish. https://www.bluezones.com/explorations/okinawa-japan/ (scroll down for the chart)

It doesnt explain how many grams of protein they would routinely have though, per kilo of weight for example

You said that most blue zone diets are 'low' in protein so Im wondering what you mean by low?

Or did you mean low in animal proteins?

I mean low in protein in general, from all sources. There are quite a lot of studies about it and some are ongoing for over 30 years now so it’s very well documented, you don’t have to take my word for it.

These diets are all predominantly plant-based and low in calories at the same time (the average for Okinawa is about 1700 kcal) so it’s difficult to keep such a diet high in protein within a calorie limit. The staple foods such as purple potatoes or bitter melon are mainly carbs. Also pulses, although a good source of protein are twice as high in carbs.

Both high calorie and high protein diets are ageing (the latter through elevated homocysteine levels) so it’s not surprising that the opposite has a positive effect on longevity and health expectancy.

Of course it is. But so is malnutrition

Im trying to get a gauge of what that actually means in terms of grams of intake per weight of person

For example, in the UK its recommended around 1g per kg you weigh. So I try to aim for around 66g of protein. I dont always manage that. My medical advice is that I should aim for around 90g, I dont manage that

90, is what I would call high protein. 60g would just be an ok amount

I dont know what is meant by 'low' in your examples.

I have also heard about studies that show low calorie diets are healthier and associated with longer lives.

I have read the popularised account of the Okinawan Centenarian Study - the book is called The Okinawa Way - but I don’t remember exactly, I can check and report back 💪. I would assume that 1g is reasonable.
I’m trying to stay at 1.3 at most but with our rich available resources it can be hard because I’m under 50 kg.

0.8g/kg so if you are 66kg, 53g of protein is fine
If you have medical issues or doing extreme exercise you may need more.
For most of us, anything above rda does not have any extra benefit.

Isn’t this a bit like slimming world/weight watchers - low fat/low cal? I did one of these (can’t remember which now), and mostly ate pasta with tomato sauce, jacket potato and beans, toast with marmalade and no butter (saved all my treats for wine). I did lose a lot of weight, but was pretty boring as I love eating out!

Yes I think it can fluctuate .8g or 1g, depending on what you read

Yes 53/60, its ok and thats why Im interested in what is considered 'low' in those studies

I need higher for medical reasons, which is what my medical advice is.

I do between 1 to 1.6g of protein per my body weight but this is because I am actively trying to build muscle (my preference) and I’ve found it’s really good for keeping me fuller for longer and I really enjoy it. I don’t eat much whey type proteins or drink protein it’s all through foods where possible. I really notice how hungry I get if I don’t eat a protein source with my evening meal. 0.8g is a good baseline I believe so going lower than that can have its own issues such as fluid build up in your limbs and it’s good for your hair, nails and skin. Even if you are vegetarian you could still eat Greek yoghurt or other protein sources. I love vegetables but an entire diet made of them would cause my IBS to go off the scale!

This is interesting. It is like slimming world, but lean protein is free and encouraged.

So free lean protein, carbs and veg, restricted nuts and bread, fats and sugars.

With a side serving of calcium.

I feel quite ill if I dont have high fat and higher protein

I've been thinking about this for the last few days as I'm reading How Not to Diet. Not finished yet but it's definitely stating that a high fibre, low saturated fat diet is the way to go, so I think you are on the right track OP.
Fill up on veg and fruit, cut down on animal derived protein, and you can't go far wrong.
I've been avoiding carbs for a long time but gradually gaining weight so I'm flipping it. Going mainly plant based, low upf, low saturated fats. Talking a b12 supplement as that's the one thing I will lack by removing meat from my diet.

I eat a lot of plants and a great variety (counted 18 today) and very little dairy: I had goat milk today with my coffee, 50g of onaka with my overnight oats and 25g of pecorino sardo and this was a high dairy day for me. Also meat only two-three times a week. Despite this I find it difficult to keep proteins to 1g. I’m trying but it’s difficult without cutting calories further and that combined with eating mainly plants means that I keep losing weight.

I don’t feel hungry after a meal that’s mainly vegetables, a fistful of brown rice and 100g of tofu, but I mainly eat dense, leafy veg like cabbage, cavolo nero, brussel sprouts or kale and they are only briefly processed, so stir-fried or steamed for a couple of minutes to keep the GI low.

I honestly don’t know how the Blue Zones folk do this. I’m small but probably higher than average for Japanese standards and also lean. If I ate 1700 kcal a day and 0.8g protein, so mainly purple potatoes with a bit of tofu and seaweed for company I would disappear. They must be much more efficient at processing their food, maybe that’s why they are so unbelievably healthy?

I love that website. Too many fussy eaters here for me to try most recipes but I thought the Oslo Meal was an interesting aside, and sometimes have that for my lunch https://the1940sexperiment.com/2009/08/27/the-oslo-meal/ I expect it’s a better lunch than most kids eat (my own fussy one included so no judgement implied!)

@soupfiend the figures for macros I found in the book are: 54% to 80% carbohydrates, 24% fats (out of which only 7% saturated).
I didn’t remember protein because they didn’t say!

The main source of fat used for cooking was rapeseed oil which is higher in unsaturated fats than olive oil (at least that’s what they drill into us in Sweden)

They did recommend eating between 10% to 20% of total calories in protein and give some figures in pounds, like the weight in pounds x 0.36 gives the recommended protein intake. I can’t count in pounds without a converter but it seems very low to me!

Oh absolutely read that thread that @CheeseSandwichRiskAssessment mentioned, it was a brilliant read.

It's easy to apply rose-tinted glassed to the struggles people had then, but it does do to apply the sound nutritional sense at the bottom of it.

Lots of in season plants, minimal meats used to flavour large amounts of more unprocessed carb sources and vegetables, less processed snacks and drinks.

Im not good at maths, I make that for me, at 146lbs, to eat 52lbs of protein in a day!!!!

Is it something to do with the decimal point? Would it be 5.2lbs of protein a day, that doesnt doesnt make sense!!!

https://www.bluezones.com/2020/07/blue-zones-diet-food-secrets-of-the-worlds-longest-lived-people/

This recommends 46 to 56g a day or protein although doesnt specify the size of the person

It also says that olive oil is very recommended?

My apologies! Of course the multiplication will give you the amount in grams not pounds.

I assumed it was obvious because I don’t count anything in pounds 😅. Sorry.

Yes olive oil is great and two of the blue zones are in the Mediterranean region so obviously this would be the oil of choice. I was specifically referring to and giving you figures from the book about the Okinawan Centenarian Study so it’s the Okinawans who eat canola/rapeseed. I don’t think olive trees grow in Asia and they also don’t grow in Northern Europe whereas rapeseed has been grown in Northern Europe and Asia for several thousand years.

Good point about olives

I dont have anything against rapeseed oil, I just cant stand it. I cant stand the flavour whereas others say it doesnt have a flavour.

The good one is the cold pressed one. It should have a very pleasant but strong nutty flavour and all the talk about “bad vegetable oils because they are produced with heat” doesn’t apply. Rapeseed oil apparently has a higher burning point than olive oil so retains more of the good stuff when used for frying.

It's not just the diet that was different in the war, though. People were much more active generally, walked everywhere, did more by hand, and would never have just sat down all evening.

Everything has changed since then. Eating a ration diet sounds grim.

Ive tried the cold pressed, it ruins everything. I might give it another go seeing as olive oil is now so expensive but Im not holding out for liking it