Maintenance Thread - some fasting, some low-carb, some exercise

[WhatWillSantaBring]

I thought I'd start this thread for those who have reached their goal and want some support for a sensible, sustainable way of eating. It may also be useful for those who are thinking about what they'll do when they get there.

Confession: I'm a yo-yo dieter and so don't claim any expertise in this at all, but I am doing things differently this time.

As the thread title says, I'm going to try some fasting (both 16:8 and 5:2), keeping to a low(ish) carb diet, and putting in some exercise.

Hi Kimlek - need to get myself back on this thread.. keep slipping a bit! Meant to do BSD 800 cals and low carbs from Sunday. But only managed from yesterday. Continuing today and tomorrow to offset the excesses. Also joined a gym. Have pilates and kettle bell class coming up which I’m excited about. Been much better this week. Will finally weigh this Friday... if I remember batteries for my scales!

Well done to you for maintaining - you’re the maintenance guru!

Ps. Hi outwest too, well done on reaching goal! Off to read your post. And clearly great minds think alike re kettlebells!

Yes, @Justasecondnow, kettlebells can be very effective (much better than trad cardio for me) but also dangerous - that ballistic action really pulls/stretches/yanks more than you'd expect for such small weights.

If do restart, will begin with a tiny bell! 15 years ago was using 24kg... Would take me years to build back up to that level, if I ever could.

Hello! It looks like it just needed me to take a three week holiday for this thread to come to life!. It wasn't really three weeks (that would be lush) - it was one week holiday with friends, then a week home, then a long weekend away on the coast.

On my week's holiday which involved a lot of drinking, i put on a shameful 5lbs, so went back to 100% strictness for a week, and lost 3lbs. After a weekend away (not so much drinking, but a lot of cakeage) I'm still at 2lbs above where I'd got to (which is still 1lb away from goal).

So I've been following 16:8 IF this week, with two meal replacements and two normal meals, trying to slowly lose the last 3lbs but in a maintenance sort of way (so if I don't lose the weight, I won't worry).

Just checking in thanks to signpost from @Kimlek! I will read through later and post.
Just off to do the first school run since March and I'm late!!

Good to have you onboard bear!!

@Kimlek thanks.

I'll just recap my journey that's brought me here: I started BSD way back in 2016, lost about 21lbs in the 8 weeks and another 7 ish, but gradually dithered about and regained some most of it. In Jan 2018 I decided I needed 1 more proper attempt, restarted BSD and started running. I lost 3 stone fairly quickly, and caught the running bug big time. Then pretty much since August 2018 I have bounced around the same target, putting on and losing the same 5lbs and always chasing a probably unachievable target of "9 stone something". The more I run and gain muscle mass the more unachievable it was becoming. Then lock down happened and whereas before I was managing to lose any gain, gradually I was adding only a few ounces a week but they soon add up.

The problem I have with 'dieting' is that I eat a lot, and I need a lot because I burn a lot. But I was getting to a stage where unless I ate 800 cals I simply wasn't losing anything. I do think bsd screwed with my metabolism a bit and I do think it brought out binge tendencies. Something had to give. I was running loads because I was eating badly, then eating badly because I was running loads and I was just stuck in this cycle over and over.

So on July 20th this year I started whole30 and since then I have stuck 100% to it, essentially eating only meat, fish, eggs veg, olive oil, fruit. No gluten, dairy, soy, sugar (yes, absolutely zero sugar in any form except whole fruit), no additives or preservatives, and no alcohol (for the first 30 day) . It sounds hard and I guess it is, but BSD has primed me for it anyway. 3 meals, no snacks (only 1 pre-workout if necessary) and no calorie counting or tracking or (big one for me) stepping on the bathroom scales. I weighed after 30 days and I'd lost 11lbs which considering I do not have much to lose is pretty good going. I haven't weighed again. I have reintroduced wine, (occasional, red) And there is literally not a single other food I want to have. It's crazy, But I feel really good on it. As a runner I would have constant aches and pains but since this I have not taken ibuprofen once. I literally bounce out of bed at 6 as well.

I think I will have lost a couple of pounds this month, but I think then this will form the basis of my maintenance plan. Just real food, as much of it as I need, but none of the extras. I will continue to run (about 30-40km a week) and do hiit and yoga, and I imagine that I will at some point be presented with something that I cannot resist, but the longer I go on, the more special that thing is going to have to be to make it worthwhile!

Maintaining is so hard but I hope that I have found a way that is largely sustainable for me, but that doesn't rely on counting and tracking forever.

Off to google Whole30....

Wow!! That gets a serious pasting!! I thought it sounded quite clean and wholesome. Dieticians really don’t like it. No sugar, no gluten, no dairy. The latter is the only thing a dietician should have issue with and even then..... I know you can’t have dairy so I can see why it’d work for you bear.

It's basically paleo but without the 'natural sugars' so I can't see why dieticians would slate it really. Maybe it's the 'no cheating' mentality? It's certainly strict in terms of behaviours as well as food, although it's categorically not a weight loss diet, so I dunno? Anyway, I can't see why any dietician would say no, you must eat junk food and chemicals! As we all know, a little of what you fancy does you good makes you fat. I've often used paleo recipes while doing BSD/fast 800 and whole30 does mean you can have sweet potato and banana occasionally, dried fruit, tropical fruit etc. so weirdly I have found it less restrictive in many ways than BSD.

I will probably reintroduce a few non natural things, stock cubes for one, because making bone broth all the time is incredibly tedious and makes the house smell like a tanners yard.

It is what it is. I am from a long line of autistic folks, and while I am not autistic myself, I am certainly very rule led so it appeals to that side of my nature too I suppose and I can see why it wouldn't be viable for everyone. Next weekend I am running my first half marathon without glucose supplements jelly babies so that will be interesting!

I think a lot of dieticians etc still spout the 1980’s triangle with bread & pasta at the base!! The whole30 sounds pretty sensible. What do you have instead of the dairy? I remember from the BSD thread that it doesn’t agree with you anyway so curious if you’ve found a suitable replacement?

Well I was having soy but that's not allowed either (plus I don't think it's good for my hormones) so I've been having almond milk in coffee. Cheese is just off limits and there's no decent replacement so I've just gone without. If I want pudding /yogurt type things I'll have a chia seed pot made with coconut milk or a spoonful of the cream from a can of coconut milk with fruit.

Hi all, finally weighed today, and I have out on a lb. I’m thrilled to be honest! Thought after my holiday with a lot of treats and so on and only one extra day fast day - not the 5 days of being back on it I’d planned - I’d be looking at 5lb! Think I’m realising whilst maintenance isn’t easy it’s not as hard as actively trying to lose weight. Maybe this could work for me. Yay.

Second pilates class of the week - a record for me - and I’m up at 730 doing it! Kettle bells next week, thanks for the tips outwest I’ve never done it before, will try not be too gung ho!

... somehow managed not to post this at 730 this morning and come back to see there are lots of us now! Hi bear and santa good to hear how you are both doing!

Well, have spent several days eating good deal more than a bit - to borrow phrase from @thenewaveragebear1983 - of what I fancy, and it has made me feel outright unwell.

Sourdough toast, slow-cooked belly pork marinated in Asian sauce, a few ice creams, first packet of sweets in six months, etc. Overall seem to have kept easily within self-imposed limit of 1800 kcal (because keeping lunch small), but at the same time appear to have upset my stomach, with kind of persistent soreness or indigestion.

Noticeable that on occasions where simply ate more of what had already been eating over past few months (such as grilled chicken + salad), these problems have not arisen.

Has been entirely predictable & foreseeable response, like sailor getting blind drunk on shore leave after long sea voyage, but clearly not something that can continue, and bit of a wake-up call.

Presently pondering my options. Monday and Tuesday are 800 kcal days, so this will give me chance to think about a way forward, regain focus.

Agree with @kimlek on dieticians - too many still parroting 1970s dogma, particularly deeply questionable fat = heart disease approach. Obviously one doesn't want to throw baby out with bath water, but hard to trust anything we're told about diet given number and scale of various changes in advice over past several decades.

Do you do any fasting @outwest?

@Kimlek - yes, started doing 16:8 in 2010 (prompted by leangains.com) and have been doing it ever since.

Ah ok! I was going to suggest 16:8 rather than calorie counting but you’re on it! Like you said though, you can eat a lot of chicken and salad without issue but starting add bread, sweets, ice creams etc and..... well, surprise, surprise!

I’ve lost a couple of pounds without trying. Was aiming to maintain around 10st with a couple of pounds either side. Currently 9st 10lb. Which to be honest is good as 10st is slightly on the high side. But because I’ve never really had a weight issue and this has been my first ever diet I think I have a healthy relationship with food and thus weight. I’m really not bothered about loosing/gaining 4lbs. So I’m happy being around 10st. What I’m saying is if the 9st 10lb goes up that’s fine. But I now don’t want it above 10st. So my goal post has shifted down slightly. No idea if I’m making any sense!

You do make sense @Kimlek - I'm with you on having a goal with an upper limit, so if you're a bit below that, it's still goal, but just a more comfortable place with a bit more scope for weekly fluctuations.

I was pleased with myself last week - stuck to my plans really easily, but then woke up on Saturday morning with MASSIVE sugar / carb cravings, that I gave into. I did better yesterday, though overate on roast dinner (though stuck to low/no carb rules). And then was too scared to step on the scales this morning, because I'm already/still 3lbs above the upper limit of my goal.

@outwest re: your sailor on shore leave analogy (hic!) I think the reality is that this med diet is inherently good, whole foods. So yes, sometimes we might go wild and eat a banana or a baked potato, but it's still good, whole food. All carbs are not created equal though and the tip over into delicious sourdough and Asian marinade (probably sugar, Chili, msg,..,,) means that even though our carb count and cal count is the same, or even less, the result is not. At least you enjoyed it though, and hey, it's real life isn't it? Sourdough happens....

Interesting that it caused you digestive discomfort though; since stripping all the bad stuff out I very rarely get that horrible bloated feeling now, but every now and then I do, and bizarrely I've narrowed it down to pimento/all spice?! Clearly it does not agree with my delicate constitution!

I've had a good few days. I'm not really even thinking about food right now, it's just sort of happening. I'm am basking in the glow of this 'my body is a temple' stuff and definitely feeling the benefits now. I'm Running well and I have a half marathon on Sunday. We are hosting a family party on Saturday and I fully intend to stick to my food and not drink (maybe a glass of wine if I really want to). I have figured that rather than face endless questions about why I'm not eating sandwiches or drinking alcohol I shall just give dh a mysterious/coy smile and then they will all just think I'm pregnant and leave me alone no one wants someone there spoiling the party by not eating the sandwiches and cake!
(And I'm making the cake!)

I shall just give a mysterious/coy smile and then they will all just think I'm pregnant and leave me alone

Excellent idea @thenewaveragebear1983, will practice smile in front of mirror. When wife asks where remains of apple crumble in fridge went, shall look mysterious and coy. Enough to fend off her waxing wroth? We shall see.

All carbs are not created equal though

That's become increasingly clear over course of diet. Not going to live life of complete self-denial, but going to think twice or three times about some food choices.

As someone who put on weight, then lost weight, then put it back on and lost it again. The reality is very clear to me that you need to make a really big lifestyle change to stay a healthy weight if your normal way of being makes you put on weight. There is no point in making a big effort until you reach a goal weight if the reality is that the change which made you lose weight is too hard to maintain forever. You need to change how you live in a way that you actually want to maintain for good.

I lost weight by strictly limiting processed sugar while breastfeeding and giving up processed sugar completely when I wasn't. But I was never going to give up processed sugar forever, it's just not how I want to live the rest of my life. I was extremely lucky that right as I lost the weight the second time, I found my exercise/sport. It's something I love deeply and just want to do all the time. It's what I think about when I wake up in the morning and countdown the hours to. It's become a major facet of who I am and one of the first things I'd describe myself as. I can eat whatever I want and I eat sugary foods again when I feel like them but I don't feel like them that much as my activity is my treat. So I don't have to think about what I'm eating or how much exercise I do, because I'm so fit and active now that it would actually be very difficult to put on weight during my normal life, though I am increasingly muscular.

I was sick for months in the spring/summer and I put on weight again through a mixture of near complete lack of physical activity/boredom eating/thyroid issues. So I know for sure that if I didn't have a lifestyle that means I am super active because I just love doing my hobby, I'd either be looking at either yo-yoing weight for the rest of my life or eventually just giving up and increasing my weight slowly but surely.

@alittleprivacy I agree on the most part with your post there. However, for me, the biggest lifestyle change to make while losing weight/getting to goal is an emotional one, with ideally The end result being that actually I don't even want the sugar in the first place. It's a really tough process with a lot of soul searching and like you I don't think I'll ever be 100% sugar free as forever is a long time. But on the whole I can resist sugar/processed food (at the moment, who know how long this will last) because I actually don't want it. I found even with my fitness/activity levels I couldn't eat whatever I wanted when what I wanted was chocolate or cheese.

A big thing for me is separating the conditioning that X event is not possible without X food/drink. Cannot possibly have a party without having the cake, cannot possibly go out with friends without drinking etc.

Hi all, maintenance week 3 going ok I think. Low carb but more calorie day yesterday - had nuts and berries as a snack, veggie omelette for lunch, and a Beef curry/stew thing with veg for tea and today’s fast day had a few nuts, olives and some cheese in the afternoon & salmon with veg for tea. So not wildly different but bigger portions on Monday.

Big difference this week has been exercise. I’ve ran 7k, had an hour p/t session at gym and just done a kettlebells class (also OMG outwest kettlebells with 25kg weight, I was struggling away with my 3kg one!) and got 2 pilates classes to go this week.

So hopefully going welll; eating this way in week doesn’t feel restrictive compared to weeks of low carb and 800 cals. And I really do loosen up on weekends (huge roast dinners and apple crumble etc.) which I don’t mind as long as it’s not mindless/sad/stressed eating, as in it’s a good thing I’m enjoying not a means to change my mood/alleviate boredom etc.

Still nervous about weigh in on Friday. Feel happy with balance at mo so hope it’s going as well as I think it is...

@thenewaveragebear1983 However, for me, the biggest lifestyle change to make while losing weight/getting to goal is an emotional one, with ideally The end result being that actually I don't even want the sugar in the first place. It's a really tough process with a lot of soul searching and like you I don't think I'll ever be 100% sugar free as forever is a long time. But on the whole I can resist sugar/processed food (at the moment, who know how long this will last) because I actually don't want it. I found even with my fitness/activity levels I couldn't eat whatever I wanted when what I wanted was chocolate or cheese.

That's kind of my point though. I was lucky enough to chance upon something that completely changed my life right at the point where I'd already lost weight through sacrificing processed sugar for 7 months. If I hadn't found that change, I can guarantee that within another few months I'd have started eating sugar again. And sugar being highly addictive, within the next year or so I'd have just piled on the weight again. I don't think you can really live your life in a constant state of sacrifice. The trick is to find a regular 'treat' or 'reward' that is actually really, really good for you.

I didn't really start with exercise. Instead 4, 5 or 6 times a week I literally go out playing with my friends and in the process use up a 1000+ calories, build muscle and get extremely fit. Now I do add strength training and strength building yoga/flexibility and some gymnastics to my week. Not for my fitness/health/looks but because I want to get better at my hobby, the fitness/health/looks are a bonus but not the goal. If they were the goal I wouldn't keep it up but the thought of getting better at the thing I love and being able to eventually do things that always felt like a complete fantasy is extremely motivating.

I can eat pretty much whatever I want now because I use up so many calories day to day. However, I don't really eat very much sugar anymore. Usually I was most prone to eating sugar in bed at night. But now I come home at night with my brain absolutely buzzing with norepinephrine, dopamine, serotonin and endorphins. The very last thing in the world I want is chocolate or any other type of sugar that will add to that. I prefer a protein boost and sleepy tea or maybe a calming yoga session so I can actually sleep.

So really the key isn't to find a way to sacrifice. But to change your life in a way that it is healthy without sacrifice. Where the thing that you love the most, the thing that fills you with near constant pleasure, is good for you. I constantly crave something that makes my body better. And I don't really want the crap anymore but if I do feel like it, or have a slice of cake at a birthday party, it doesn't really matter.

The end result being that actually I don't even want the sugar in the first place.

Holy Grail.

So really the key isn't to find a way to sacrifice. But to change your life in a way that it is healthy without sacrifice.

Agreed. Think Blood Sugar Diet already achieves this to large extent & has worked precisely because many people find food very palatable, and so not a significant sacrifice.