You shouldn't take weight loss drugs. Learn about healthy eating, eat less and exercise more.

[GapTshirtsAreShitQualityTheseDays]

This is like telling an insomniac "don't take tablets, just get more sleep"

I'm 41.
I have tried.

I KNOW all about healthy eating. Probably more than most slim people.
I don't have an emotional/binge eating disorder, I just have a bigger appetite than most people. I can only control it so long via willpower or low-carb diets. The drive to eat is the most powerful instinct known to man (except maybe breathing)

It's the weight loss medication that takes the edge of said appetite and ALLOWS me the space to make sensible decisions on food.

I've gone from 15 stone to 9 stone (I'm short). If these drugs had been invented 20 years ago, my life would have been much better.

And no, I didn't steal the drugs off a diabetic. I got private prescriptions for Wegovy and then Mounjaro which are only marketed for weightloss.

And yes I am quite prepared to take the drug forever if necessary.

And no, I don't care about the "potential unknown long term side effects" because they can hardly be worse than what I was facing with obesity.

And although exercise is beneficial for many reasons, it is a fairly trivial factor in weightloss.

I see there's a lengthy thread about the cost of WL injections in AIBU. Strange that the thread police have let that stand instead of being shunted off into this forum.

Out of interest, what nutritional support are people given along with this drug to make it safer?

I keep reading about people eating protein powder but no one is talking about electrolyte levels or sufficient vitamin and mineral intake. It is not physically possible to meet your nutritional needs on less than 800 calories a day.

People on New You, VLCD, etc are on it for a very short time and have special dietary plans and supplements to ensure they do not die of heart failure due to lack of essential minerals. They are also medically supervised.

@Frequency during this past year I have eaten about 1200-1500 cals of nutritious food every day. Leading to a healthy 1.5lb loss per week (on average). I'll be increasing that to about 1700 cals as I home in on goal weight. The only supplement I take is vitamin D which almost all adults in the UK should take as it's practically impossible to get enough from food/sunlight.

You will find it's often the obese who have nutritional deficiencies.

@Frequency I'm not eating less than 800 calories a day. I'm with Asda, I have communication with the prescribing doctor as and when I need it. I have a comprehensive support document with all the nutritional advice you'd expect. Also access to an online hub of information. And so on. I'm very well aware of what I need to be eating.

People who are obese are not typically deficient in magensium, selenium, zinc and the other minerals responsible for heart health because they are found, primarily, in fats and protiens eg burgers, cheese, chicken nuggets etc. They might be deficient in vitamins typically found in fresh fruits and veg.

I'm relieved some people appear to be eating a decent amount and have support. I still believe there needs to be direct medical supervision to intervene in cases where this isn't happening.

@SilenceInside although if you're anything like me, as a seasoned dieter, you could WRITE the book on nutritional advice!

It's all bullshit anyway. It wasn't that long ago that GPs and Boots the Chemist were peddling the Food Pyramid (remember to fill up on carbs, everyone and avoid olive oil!).

Is there direct medical supervision for everyone who doesn’t eat the recommended serves of fruit and veg a day, who doesn’t exercise till they can’t talk for 30 mins a day, who drinks more than 5 drinks a week, who has poor mental health… the list goes on and on. What is it about this new medical option that is so threatening to people?

Carbs aren't bad, though, refined carbs are but I don't think the NHS has ever told people to fill their plates with refined carbs.

The Mediterranean diet is widely believed to be the healthiest in the world and it is 50-60% carbs. Oils and fats should be limited, even the good ones can cause damage if they are eaten in excess.

New medical options are not always proven to be good. There is a reason dieters are no longer prescribed amphetamines, ephedrine, phentermine, and other stimulants. Turns out, they were killing people.

Depends where you get it from.

Personally, I see my doctor fairly often due to other health issues. So I opted for one without the additional advice. Many places do offer it and it’s up to the person.

I don’t know about on MN but electrolytes and vitamins and minerals are talked about extensively anywhere else that people are discussing it with other people. That all part of my welcome email as well.

People on the New You plan are absolutely not medically supervised. There’s nothing that ensures customers are seeking medical supervision. And people on New You aren’t not on it for a short period. They do 12 weeks and then have a couple of weeks at slightly higher calories and then back on it. And yet no one has problem with them advertising everywhere.

I don’t know anyone who does VLCD that’s medically supervised. The vast majority of people just give it a go and many people stay on it for long periods.

I do agree that the ‘use my code for money off’ is a problem. It’s my personal opinion and it does mean some people will glamourise it.

Do you know clinics that do gastric bands also do the same? Give influencers surgery to then talk about how their clinic is amazing? Do you realise this happens with supplements of all kinds? Do you realise that influencers already push diets? TikTok is full of people pushing all kinds of things. And it’s been going on years. I would agree with Lee regulation of social media.

Do you know there quite a few anorexic influencers promoting anorexia?

I agree that culture is an issue. But it’s not specific to GLP1 medications. And doesn’t mean GLP1 medications are, themselves, dangerous. Any medication if it is misused, is dangerous. Any diet, taken to extreme, is dangerous.

I find some of these things unethical, which is why I don’t participate in them.

On the flip side, Do you also know there’s many influencers talking honestly about side effects? Not just influencers, normal women who use it. Who talk about getting the right nutrition? About the what you should do and what you should. Which usually include you should eat a nutritious diet? With lots of fibre, protein and vitamins and minerals? And why important.

Ones that have been on it for a good long while and are in maintenance and using their platform to help people on how to prepare to come off it based on their own experience. As well as many doctors talking about it on social media doing the same.

I have had the odd day where I don’t feel like eating much at all. But that’s not issue. On a usual day I am eating around 1600 cals. And eat better food than I did before, because I am prioritising healthy food.

I think it's interesting that the assumption is that obese people all eat burgers, cheese and chicken nuggets and never eat fruit or veg. Maybe I'm an unusual weird kind of fattie as I'm vegetarian and have never in my life eaten a chicken nugget. Love my veg though. It's this idea that all obese people are ignorant about nutrition again.

How do you suggest that happens?

Do you think the NHS is going to give everyone a full blood work panel? Every month? Every 6 months?

It would be amazing if they did. They could catch things like peri menopause.

If someone wants to abuse it and eat tiny amounts, they aren’t going to admit that to a GP so the only way would be have a lot of testing. That’s never going to happen.

OMG I just google the food pyramid and up came that old "EatWell" guide. What a blast from the past!

It literally tells people to eat raisins and includes them in the "fruit and veg" section. Raisins are about the worst thing you could eat in terms of fucking with your blood sugar as well as literally being a dentist's worst nightmare.

The amount of proper protein in there (meat and fish) is absolutely woeful. Chickpeas are NOT a substitute!

Not to mention if I ate a load of bagels and whatnot, I'd be walking around with a bloated stomach the size of a beachball.

The reason the food pyramid was like that was to keep the carby food manufacturers happy and to cover up the fact that people were too poor to afford meat and fish as often as it should be eaten. At the end of the day, cavemen didn't eat fucking cereal for breakfast.

The whole "5 a day" re fruit and veg is marketing crap as well tbh. It's just as made up as the "10k steps a day". Figures completely plucked from thin air.

What's wrong with the food pyramid? I've only ever read overweight people on here complain about it.

Pretty much nothing but social media has brainwashed us into believing carbs and natural fruit sugars are the work of the devil and are why we are all overweight.

I do disagree with the promotion of "low fat" produce but only from the standpoint that it is not as satiating and therefore people are more likely to overeat than their full-fat counterparts. Low-fat produce, in and of itself, is not harmful, nor has it led to us all being fat.

@LegoTherapy the food pyramid is very carb heavy. My weight issues involve being insulin resistant due to PCOS, therefore going low carb is better for me. If you see the diet healthcare nurse at my surgery they come up with variations on the food pyramid which DO NOT WORK for me. What’s worked for me are weigh-loss injections, it no coincidence that they are similar to what are prescribed for diabetics because they make my insulin work better. Instead of storing carbs as fat I burn them for energy but I still need to limit them

The nutritional information from my provider is not based on the food pyramid or the eat well plate.

It suggests 1/2 plate of non-starchy vegetables, 1/4 plate of low fat protein and 1/4 plate of complex carbohydrates. Plus a "dressing" of a small amount of healthy fats, or seeds or bits of around 2 tablespoons.

Is that all bad advice, I wonder?

@SilenceInside everyone's different and it depends on the size of the plate but I would prefer more protein and more fat.

I have wondered about the low fat things myself. I'm sure they won't kill you but it does feel like the diet industry peddles a lot of unsatisfying replacement meals. I couldn't eat those low calorie yogurts, horrid low calorie bread, and weight watchers ready meals without getting hungry afterwards.

I eat proper butter, add as much oil as I like when I'm cooking, and I have full sugar options as much as I can. I like things that are tasty, filling, and will make me feel satisfied afterwards. It doesn't make sense to eat miserably.

It's not really in their interests to have people losing weight, so I'm very suspicious of it.

A chickpea is a perfectly valid source of protein. They are my main source of protein at the moment due to my love of red pepper hummus and bread sticks lunch. I've been known to have the same for dinner if I'm not having a halloumi wrap.

There are so many factors at play here:

Ultra processed foods are abundant and are eaten to an excess that isn't seen in healthy foods. Since cutting out ultra processed stuff my weight is between stable and going down a bit. Chocolate is pretty much my only UPF item.

People tend to always be in a hurry and drive everywhere. Lifestyles are one long list of events that necessitate getting in and out of the car. People look at me like I've got two heads when I say I walk my child to school because it's over a mile and involves big hills. The car is king and it's to the detriment of our health.

Meals are often eaten in front of a screen. Mindless eating whilst watching tv. I used to do it with chocolate every night, or popcorn, or lentil chips.

Food is quick to prepare and eat and there is little occasion to a meal now.

No one seems to have a lunch hour anymore. A quick sandwich at your desk whilst reading emails. No stroll around the nearest park and eat your packed lunch on a bench and watch the world go by.

Life is just endless task after task where no one shuts off after work or for lunch or takes time to have breakfast as a family.

I wonder what countries have the best work life balance and what their obesity rates are.

Have you seen the studies on Blue Zones?

Their diets are all very low in processed foods and, as a population, they tend to have a high level of NEET compared to western zones.

Other than that they all have very different diets and lifestyles. I think UPF has a lot to answer for, not because I think they are poison or are doing anything to us on a biological level to make us fat but they are unsatisfying, calorie-dense, low in nutrients, and literally designed to make us want to keep eating them and to eat them in excess.

I have no fucking clue what McDonald's do to their burgers but I could easily polish off a large Big Mac meal and still want more. When I make burgers at home I can only eat one. I don't understand why, given that they claim their burgers are only meat and salt, I suspect it is something to do with the size of the actual beef patty and I suspect it is deliberate to get us all to buy a second burger or a McFlurry.

Chickpeas are not a complete protein. They are lacking in 2 of the amino acids.

Not to mention they can be very irritating to anyone with digestive sensitivities.

@Arctangent the low fat thing was resolved years ago. Food manufacturers replaced fat with sugar so yes, they are worse for you, you get hungry quicker and often they are not even lower in calories anyway.

In a pinch, eg when travelling, I will do the old Atkins trick of going into McDonalds, ordering 2 burgers and eating them minus the buns. Keeps me full for ages.

McDonald's never touches the sides for me. I enjoy it, I eat it (very occasionally/never atm because my old ED behavior is back with a vengeance) but it doesn't do anything to fill me. Nor does Nandos even though their food is much closer to what I actually eat/make at home. A chicken kebab from the local takeaway minus the naan, fills me just fine.

Maybe it's in my head.

Hummus is a complete protein though and that's how I eat chick peas.

Have you looked at the ingredients in a McDonald's burger bun or cheese? It's scary.