You shouldn't take weight loss drugs. Learn about healthy eating, eat less and exercise more.

[GapTshirtsAreShitQualityTheseDays]

This is like telling an insomniac "don't take tablets, just get more sleep"

I'm 41.
I have tried.

I KNOW all about healthy eating. Probably more than most slim people.
I don't have an emotional/binge eating disorder, I just have a bigger appetite than most people. I can only control it so long via willpower or low-carb diets. The drive to eat is the most powerful instinct known to man (except maybe breathing)

It's the weight loss medication that takes the edge of said appetite and ALLOWS me the space to make sensible decisions on food.

I've gone from 15 stone to 9 stone (I'm short). If these drugs had been invented 20 years ago, my life would have been much better.

And no, I didn't steal the drugs off a diabetic. I got private prescriptions for Wegovy and then Mounjaro which are only marketed for weightloss.

And yes I am quite prepared to take the drug forever if necessary.

And no, I don't care about the "potential unknown long term side effects" because they can hardly be worse than what I was facing with obesity.

And although exercise is beneficial for many reasons, it is a fairly trivial factor in weightloss.

I think @mnhq should address this.

@untiltheend the link you posted from January this year is mainly talking about the US and it’s talking about one of the medications. And seems to be based around something that’s been rectified. And it’s been written by a trainee solicitor. Not an expert.

Not sure why you tried to post as though you were giving the heads up to Op for her own good, when it was clearly a poor attempt at a ‘haha you might not be able to take it forever’?

and which people are you talking about that don’t need something shoving down their throat? People are free to hide the thread. They can see the subject matter in the title?

I wonder what it is that makes some people just not bothered, or able to say no. So for example, when on holiday at a breakfast buffet I have a bowl of cereal, that is it. I figure that it's equivalent to what I have at home (well at home I have weetabix so museli is a treat as it is sugary) but I only have cereal as that's enough at home so that is enough on holiday. Would I like to have a cake/bread/whatever - god yes but my desire for my weight to not change overtakes my desire to eat the thing. Is it that I have an eating disorder as do people who just eat and eat just a different one? It's absolutely intriguing.

@SwiftiesVSLestat thanks, I appreciate the support. A real shame after I put such a lot of thought into my OP and answering questions to be shoved away in a cupboard at the best of an ED "worker" (unqualified by the sounds of it).

I'm not sure tagging MNHQ works. You might want to report the thread and explain your position.

I agree with you that the pp was basically saying "haha you might not be able to rely on it forever" - trying to remove the joy I have from now being able to live a healthy life - that poster wants me to live in fear that my lifeline could be taken away at any point.

You gotta wonder as well...someone who works in an ED clinic...is it like psychiatry and attracts people who are hoping to solve their own problem in that regard...?

The "but what about the anorexics" is a very convenient line being trotted out (multiple times on this thread) by those who seem to have ulterior motives. (Eg wanting everyone to do it the hard way like they've had to)

@SwiftiesVSLestat the link was an example to highlight why people getting easy access to weight loss drugs privately in the uk might not go unchecked forever. There are side effects so to promote it as a benign solution or “ cure” for obesity as the op put that is misleading .For some people the drugs are actually causing an exacerbation of their food cravings once they have come off it which is horrendous for people who do constantly have that food noise present
.The medical research is indicating so far that the majority of people regain the weight after stopping injections hence why there are deliberations about in what circumstances people are going to be allowed to stay on it and for how long. Currently that is restricted to 2 years on the NHS. I do hope eventually a better drug is created that does minimise the cravings and food noise but currently the over-promotion of weight loss drugs on the private market is dragging more people into using weight loss drugs which may ultimately cause them more problems. The op originally had a high enough BMI that would make it more understandable she chose to use it but on mumsnet I have seen people asking about using it to lose a stone or using it when they have a perfectly healthy BMI…..you surely don’t think that is all well and good ? I think it is very important that people consider an exit strategy as to how they intend to come off the drug and would welcome more posts about how people are doing this . Also the thread title clearly states “you shouldn’t take weight loss drugs “ when clearly it is a series of posts encouraging people to do so!

@GapTshirtsAreShitQualityTheseDays its not purely about my thoughts where this thread should be….those on the weight loss forum requested a specific section from mumsnet as they were getting overrun by weight loss injection threads. I’m amazed you think I would want to remove your “joy” but people never consider the exit strategies…what is worse, me getting you to think about an exit strategy or you having to come off it for whatever reason and regaining all the weight?

What if your eating disorder makes you eat too much?

@CeruleanBelt then people should talk to their GP as to the best solution for them.

This thread is not primarily about how to lose weight which is why I didn't post it in the weight loss section. It's about the judgemental attitude that people using weight loss injections get from others.

Not to mention the patronising attitude which you have so clearly just demonstrated. Do you think I haven't thought about what would happen if I had to come off the injections? Do you think I need some unqualified random on the internet to "make me think about it"?

It's pretty clear you have your own issues with food and/or some twisted agenda or an axe to grind. Maybe you are upset that drug companies have succeeded where you "eating disorder workers" have failed.

It’s not going unchecked. Your link didn’t prove anything for the reasons above.

Yes there are side effects. Which are clearly communicated. Most medications have side effects.

It doesn’t work for some people? Yes everyone is aware that not all medications work for everyone.

Most people aren’t getting it on the NHS, the NHS restricts it to 2 years for lots of reasons including cost. Since most are paying for it themselves that doesn’t apply.

yes people regain weight. Like they generally tend to do whatever way they lose weight.

Of course people misusing a medication isn’t ok. Doesn’t mean that everyone using (or even most) are misusing it. Those so desperate to misuse it, will still get hold of it (or similar) through dodgy sources. That’s not helpful to anyone. Least of all those with an ED, who are likely to be the ones so desperate.

The thread is not encouraging people to take weight loss medication. It’s discussing it. Are you suggesting anything that’s discussed on this forum is encouraging people to take part in the behaviour being discussed? But if you are going to be trigged by people talking about weight loss medication or weight loss in general you could just not click it. If that was you issue why not ask MN to simply change the title?

I do think people should think about an exit plan. I do. However, I also think knowing you need to stay on it is a perfectly valid choice that impacts no one but the person making it.

Weird that everyone is all of sudden worried about people with anorexia misusing medication, when the medication is helping obese people. Of all the things that are damaging to people with anorexia it’s amazing that this is such a concern. I wonder why?

As I said before obese people die from disordered eating.

Far less people with anorexia die from disordered eating.

But let’s focus and hope that obese people have a harder time of getting medication that helps because some people with anorexia lie to get the medication.

Odd that an ED counsellor prioritises one type of ED above another.

Ah yes because GPs are known to excellent at dealing with Eating Disorders! Oh wait! That’s not right is it.

I would have thought an ED counsellor knows that?

and women are always taken seriously at the doctors. Especially over weight women….oh wait! Nope that not a right either is it!

@GapTshirtsAreShitQualityTheseDays @SwiftiesVSLestat I’m not quite sure why you are both so focussed on people with anorexia getting hold of the drug, it’s nothing to do with that. You can be obese and still using methods that abuse your body to attempt to lose weight, do you not see that taking any sort of wonder drug that can increase people’s cravings when they come off it could be an issue for people who (like the OP) struggle with satiety? Do you not see that people going off their own backs to use these drugs without any other support or input could possibly be a problem? Do you never wish that someone had stopped you getting on the weight loss- weight gain roller coaster to begin with? You are both welcome to insult me as much as you like but you are acting like I want to come and wrestle the drugs off you. I just dislike the promoting of injections as a cure when it can be anything but ,hence why people requested discussion about weight loss jabs be restricted to a certain part of mumsnet, so feel free to argue that point with the people who requested that in the first place! and ps, yes ,someone struggling with an eating disorder ( which includes obesity resulting from emotional eating) should be seeing their GP in the first place not heading off to a private clinic to buy jabs. The eating disorder is still going to be there when the course of jabs is finished, in the absence of safe long term weight loss medication, something else has to change.

You’re so right. My doctor told me that I didn’t have an ED. That my bingeing wasn’t a cause for concern because I wasn’t also purging at the time. I did end up purging down the line and still wasn’t taken seriously. I had to sort my own help privately.

Controversial opinion incoming...a lot of girls who have anorexia (often high-achieving types) and get sent to "eating disorder clinics" are probably more knowledgeable (about food etc) and intelligent than some of the people who work in them.

I partially agree. I've always said if you want to know something about weight loss, nutrition, calories, etc ask an anorexic, however, anorexia is rarely about food or weight. One of the symptoms is a fear of weight gain/loss of control but that is a symptom, not an underlying cause.

They don't need support from food experts. They know their diet is damaging. They need support from mental health experts. The same applies to people who have BED.

I agree that anorexia is often about control/perfectionism rather than food. But other times I think it IS directly related to weight/food itself - eg a reaction to eg boys calling one chubby and CAN be "just a diet" taken a bit to the extreme to prove a point. (The media used to get stick for calling it "the slimmer's disease" but I don't think that was always entirely inaccurate). Ie I don't think a girl presenting very underweight is necessarily mentally ill.

Source: practically all the girls in my class at (private) school flirted with anorexia type behaviour for one reason or another.

I disagree. Anorexia or restrictive eating disorders can be triggered by diets or bullying but there is almost always an underlying mental health issue e.g addiction (to weight loss or the feeling of hunger) and they often fear loss of control.

My source is being in treatment with them. I suffered from anorexia as a young teen and was underweight until I met my ex who was a feeder when I switched to BED. I now cycle through periods of extreme restriction - which is usually triggered by a desire to lose weight or a name someone has called me, and periods of extreme overeating.

I've been in treatment for ED on and off since I was 13. I have never met a fellow sufferer who does not have an underlying mental illness. It is pretty much always addiction or fear of loss of control or both.

Where’s your evidence it increases cravings when you come off?

Is that the problem? There’s no way to measure it. Could it just be that some people have forgot what it feels like and so are over whelmed and it feels worse?

Yes people abuse their bodies in all sorts of ways. slimming world, low carb, high protein, low calorie can all be pushed to a point you are abusing your body. You can’t abuse laxatives (very common with those that have ED).

No one is obsessed with anorexia. You wer talking about problem abusing it who have a normal BMI. In which case that would take them into anorexia territory.

No one is promoting them. They are, however, a valid choice and working. Of course I wish someone had helped me. Do you think I didn’t try. I was a healthy weight my entire life. Then several life changing, horrific things happened to me. My life changed completely and I started gaining weight. As I started gaining weight my PCOS got worse. Including symptoms such as immense cravings and exhaustion. And the. My adhd got out of hand because I could do my usual coping mechanism which is exercise. Though that wasn’t diagnosed til recently.

I have been to the gp countless time. Engaged with the healthy eating course. Taught me nothing as I had been extremely fit and health most of my life. Every time I spoke to the GP, they just changed my anti depressants. They refused to treat my PCOS as I don’t want more children and trying to get help. They couldn’t treat my adhd as it wasn’t diagnosed and I was on a long waiting list. Even after diagnosis, I can’t get help.

I have had several rounds of counselling.

The GP saying ‘you just need to eat less and more’ was the most unhelpful advice. As is ‘talk to your GP’.

Now, I am waiting for the medication. Seeing changes and my brain is functioning much better. I have a clear head. I am likely to cost the NHS less as I lose weight. It’s a win win.

I am not acting as though you are trying to wrestle it off us. I am saying what I said. That it’s funny, despite there being lots of things to help people with ED, anyone opposed to it seems to think making it harder to get hold of should be a priority. Because it’s obese people that will find it more difficult so it’s fine.

There are side effects so to promote it as a benign solution or “ cure” for obesity as the op put that is misleading

There are side effects to every medicine. Taking Anadin Extra gives me a dry mouth but it definitely cures my headache.

Oh, so your justification is only that 'you strongly believe' weight loss should be a struggle and painful. Bit of a crap justification really, isn't it.

You say have battled all your life with your weight and, despite loses, you apparently still desperately wish you could shift an extra couple of stones. So, for whatever reason (assuming it's not the obvious bitterness and resentment) you are furious with those who are, currently, doing exactly what you wish you could do. And they're finding it quite easy to do so.

I wish it worked that way for me but it doesn't. I can eat an honest 1500 cals of low carb meals, walk 10 km, and do half an hour of body weight exercises daily for a month and lose sweet FA. Or I can do exactly the same along with Ozempic and lose 1 pound a week.
I don't enjoy being on medication but it seems that my insulin resistance is so extreme that GLP-1's are the only things that can make a difference.

@SwiftiesVSLestat this article has a good explanation of the effects of Semaglutide and potential downsides….addiction services are interested in this class of meds because as well as removing food noise it can also remove cravings for other addictions. It is interesting that you mention ADHD seeing as people with ADHD have an increased risk of alcohol or substance abuse….alcohol abuse also being something that I note the op has struggled with . If you have PCOS, then both yourself and @BitterArrowsmith with insulin resistance have conditions where using weight loss drugs under medical supervision may well be more beneficial than harmful…..for people with eating disorders however , to go from a period of craving suppression to those feelings coming back may be more harmful than helpful. The Nhs is in agreement that there are certain people with obesity that will benefit from treatment in conjunction with other support….whether those treatment categories will be widened in future,who knows, the long term research still has to be explored. But for you ,obviously the adhd also needs addressing….my family member on adhd drugs talks about how quiet their mind is when they are on their medication ( although we also see the rebound effect when the meds wear off, hence the need to learn other strategies to cope) and I imagine this is how people on injections feel….hence why I want people to have access to other help to learn strategies whilst they have some head space ,so they cope when those meds finish, https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240521-what-happens-when-you-stop-taking-ozempic

Obesity is not like an infection where you take antibiotics and you're done," says Rubino, sighing. "It's not any different than hypertension or diabetes or the many other chronic illnesses that we deal with, where you have to use chronic medication."

The article says this right at the top. So being on it permanently is a valid choice for some people.

I kept my adhd under control for years. Along with my PCOS. My exit plan is to return to that. I can address my PCOS and ADHD all at once now.

I would rather be on this forever than adhd meds. Your cousin may do great on them. I am doing great on this.

Going back to cravings maybe more harmful than helpful for SOME people. Yes. Same as any diet or even weight loss surgery can end up turning out worse for SOME people. Again, there’s actually not definitive research saying cravings come back ‘worse’.

You asked why people don’t just see their GP. You said the best place to start, is a conversation with their GP. But it’s not. Because the help isn’t there. It’s not just a lack of knowledge. It’s a lack of interest.

Many people have that same experience. Especially women.

As I said. It’s win win. GPs don’t have to sit there while I talk and then spout the same advice that’s not helped before and ignore all my points. They don’t have to explain why they won’t treat my PCOS. I don’t have to waste my time explaining it all again, for them to give me a leaflet in healthy eating and corn away feeling even more dejected. I am paying for it out of my own pocket. Less pressure on the NHS.

I don’t agree that we should put more pressure on the NHS, because a small amount of people will mis-use them. Instead of looking to make it harder to get this medication. Maybe the NHS should tackle the problems patients have with their GPs and the actual support available. That would do more for people with EDs.

You can't continue to keep seeing something as the solution when it has been proven not to work.
Your logic is that it would work if people stuck to it, but they can't for various reasons so therefore it's not the solution.

It's not the solution if the success rate is terrible (which it is).

I do agree with you however that I don't think it should be used by people who just have a small amount to lose.

That's not true. The chemical imbalance theory has been debunked.

To answer your question about hormones, I know that microplastics act as a phyto-oestrogen so we do potentially have more hormonal imbalances than in the 60s.

I personally agree with you that 99.9% of people would lose weight in the controlled environment you mention, but I think you're being wilfully ignorant about the difficulties some people have with appetite, cravings, feeling full, etc. We don't live in a controlled environment and it is much harder for some people to have that control over their food intake, for various reasons.

Some people need medication to keep them off the booze, others need it to keep them off the food. We live in a miserable world that is not conducive to health and happiness at all! I'm sure you have your vices, too. Often we need them to survive.

And I would agree with you. What I find a bit concerning is these drugs becoming mainstream and people using them who don’t need to- who would rather pop a pill than eat healthily or even try to. I mean, I could be wrong, if these drugs are completely harmless both short term and longer term and when you take them you suddenly eat mainly unprocessed foods then that’s amazing. But currently I don’t believe that will be the case.