weaning - confused!

[ladylush]

Started weaning dd last weekend (25 weeks but 15 weeks corrected). Started 1 week early because she showed interest in food and seemed less satisfied with day feeds (bm). Anyway, I mentioned to h/v that her stools were hard. She asked me what I'd been feeding dd and said I was giving her too much too soon. First day I gave her a third of a banana, then I gradually increased the amount depending on what dd seemed to want. What I don't understand is why it's ok to give a baby what they want if they are doing blw but not if they having purees. DD was opening her mouth for more and squealing with excitement, yet apparently I am supposed to just give her a few spoons of veg mixed with baby rice in the first week. HV said also I need to take it slower because dd was prem.

A bloody minefield this weaning lark isn't it. I am just starting today (dd 24 weeks today). I don't have an answer for you, just popping in to say hi and bump this for you.

Hello,

I'm not surprised your baby is excited by the banana! Lots of babies are interested in solid food well before they are ready - they are interested in a lot of things at that age, it's fun and part of normal exploration.

However I do think your HV could be right about prem - there is more risk of infection and allergies because of gut immaturity. I think you should get some advice from a paediatrician ...

Why is it ok to give a baby what she wants for BLW and not for purees? Simple really - because with BLW, a baby who is not ready for solids just won't eat them - she might be interested, but won't be physically capable of picking it up, chewing and swallowing. With purees, you can dictate whether baby eats or not, even if she is not developmentally ready for it.

Finally, you do need to know that milk is both more calorific and more easily-digested than any other food for a baby. The idea that a hungry baby under 6 months needs solids is an old chestnut - in fact, they need more milk. At this age, replacing milk with veg/baby rice is actually a backwards step in terms of nutrition.

Hope this helps - good luck!

Hi Ready Good luck with the weaning

Hi Mess LOVE George Elliot by the way! Point taken but dd was grabbing my hand to bring the spoon to her mouth/also grabbing the spoon at times. Also I haven't offered her solids instead of milk - I've been bf first (and after as well).

Btw, dd is not under a paed - she was d/c after her routine follow-up following discharge from hospital at 5 weeks. All the info I've read so far says prem babies should be weaned at 6 months as per term babies. DD was only 1 week earlier.

big difference, ime, between being interested in something and in having the capability to feed yourself.
my dd2 was 7 weeks prem, i found all the when to wean stuff completely contradictory and confusing, no one could actually explain why her gut would have developed more quickly than, say, her fingers or toes.
so i was never more glad that i was going to do blw (having done it with dd1) because i knew that she was the one who would do it when she was ready. as it was, she did it at about 22 weeks corrected as i recall, but really didn't get going until after six months corrected.

I see your point aitch. I think if dd was consistently gaining I would be happy to wait for blw but she isn't I see food as an extra (not supplementary) means of calories. I am also hoping that this period of exploration may see her learning to use a cup/being interested in other fluids as she refuses to take a bottle which means it is virtually impossible for me to go out - even for a few hours.

btw - congrats on your dd's successful weaning. Good going

thing is, if she wasn't prem you'd be expecting her to have a mega growth spurt right about now, wouldn't you? annoying about the bottles, though. i'd probably be more keen to get that sorted than give food, esp if she's getting constipated. banana's a bugger for that.

Yeah I think Aitch could be right ...

What does your HV think about her weight gain, Lady? If this is a real concern, the most effective way to address it is with more milk - solids are less calorific than milk, so it wouldn't help anyway.

Hi Ladylush, when weaning at the start it is only about giving them tastes and not actually about filling them up. The Annabel Karmel books give very good advice and are very good for weaning. They contain loads of recipes but also give advice at the back regarding how much to give. She says to give one feed(ice cube portion) per day for two weeks, two feeds per day for two weeks and then move on to three feeds.

This may seem very slow but I am sticking to it 2nd time round. I made the mistake of feeding my first baby too much because he really loved it and hated his milk. However he had real problems with constipation.

Hope this helps

Thanks Tras (and aitch and mess) Yes I am going slowly now. Dd no longer constipated. Question is: how do I get more milk in her when she has lost interest in daytime breast feeds and won't take milk in a bottle/cup?

are you using formula or expressing? it would be really strange and counter-intuitive for a baby give up on milk. if it's a milk strike then i'd say all the more argument to get that sorted and ditch weaning.

I've tried both formula and expressed milk to no avail. dd refused a bottle ever since we got bf going despite having ebm for first 10 weeks of her life. Don't think she is having a milk strike as such but she is acting as if she is hungry when bf, pulling off, then going on again, getting frustrated and crying +++ and that goes on for ages. I doubt she is taking much at all during such feeds because she is off more than she is on iyswim. It's been going on like this for 4 weeks now. I don't know why The only thing I can think of is that my supply is dropping so I am taking domperidone to see if this makes any difference (I took it from week 4 to week 16) Dd's weight gain was good until about 6 weeks ago.

i think maybe you should also pump as well, do you have one~? it's a total pita but if you think that she's not getting milk fast enough...
also have you had your latch checked by someone good, sometimes it can look okay and work okay, but a tweak here and there and the milk flows better. jack newman clips are good for this

also, do you think there's possibly any thrush going on? (i'm just guessing here, on your behalf, bfing was NOT my strong point. very impressed that you got it going with a preemie).

ladylush, do you think DD is teething? the way you describe her feeding does sound like it could be her teeth bothering her? - teething can cause havoc to BF as it can hurt some babies when they suck, so they pull off then start back up again and seem to get frustrated with the whole business. Or a growth spurt? there's a biggie round about this stage isn't there? have you looked at any of the links on kellymom? (sorry don't mean to turn this into a BF message, just remembered it's on the weaning thread!)

I think both the ideas Kate has suggested are really good - my DD acted just the same at various times and it was indeed teeth at one stage, at another she was going through a growth spurt and trying to increase my milk supply (very odd behaviour associated with the latter - pulling off and going back on again, trying to stretch my nipples - ouch!)

Are you restricting feeding at all e.g. routine, no night feeds, setting limits to how long she can feed for, that sort of thing? If so, might be worth going back to demand feeding for a bit as that would enable her to increase your milk supply (if that is the problem).

Thanks all Thing is - although this is about weaning it is very much related to bf as well.
No thrush as far as I can tell.
Teething - yes. She has a back tooth coming through. Has been teething for 4 weeks. Teething powder not working so have to give her nurofen every day which is not ideal I know but little choice cos she is in pain. Even if this is the reason, I don't know how to get round it as dd still needs to gain weight.
Feeding - bf on demand. I wake her in the day if she sleeps more than 4 hours but that's rare anyway. Fed about every 3 hours in the day, sometimes more. At night she was managing a max of 5 hours but most commonly 3. She has another cold now - last one was 4 weeks ago. So is wanting to feed constantly again, which I am of course accommodating.
Pumping - my pet hate. Have tried lately and can only get 2oz. Dd then refuses it. I offer her a feed whenever she is distressed or grisly even if she has been fed quite recently.

yes, but the pumping stimulates more milk production. it is a pita but if you think that part of this behaviour is due to her irritation at their not being enough milk. don't worry about the 2 oz, i think that's okay. most i ever got was four and i pumped for scotland...

I don't get much of a window to pump because less feeding during day also = less sleeping as she is on and off on and off.
Just back from seeing lactation consultant. If it rains it pours...........apparently dd has thrush (ok - treatable) and tongue-tie. Only she is now too old for it to be treated. So apparently I have to wait and see whether this will affect her speech and language development. I feel thoroughly miserable now

i have a couple of adult pals who can't stick their tongues out, but that's about it. doesn't seem to have affected them at all.
re the thrush, what have they given you?

Daktarin for her (mouth) and for me to apply to my nipples. Thrush was borderline for treatment apparently.
Re tongue-tie we are thinking of asking for referral for a division to avert any possible associated problems with speech and dental hygiene. May also help with feeding problems too - which would help dd and me

Hi i'm new to mumsnet and would just like some advice. My little girl is 5 and a half months and we started the baby rice a few days ago. should i wait til she is 6 months before introducing veg and fruit? Also how much of the veg or fruit should i give her to start with?