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Weaning

Find weaning advice from other Mumsnetters on our Weaning forum. Use our child development calendar for more information.

Original poster

My reply to a query from Organix...

155 replies

colditz · 28/02/2006 12:37

()

Hi there *,

Thank you for your mail concerning the recommended age for weaning by
the WHO.

We do adhere to their guidelines and whilst they have said from 6
months
they have also confirmed to us that it could happen any time between 4
to 6 months so we are still allowed to say this on our foods. If you
look at competitor products like Heinz, Hipp and Cow and Gate they are
doing the same.

The reasons they have directed us to do this is because many babies are
ready to wean before 6 months of age and parents are frustrated that
they have to wait until 6 months of age to feed their hungry babies.

The coin is two-sided. We will always follow guidelines and
legislation
and have always done so. We have had it confirmed that we are able to
say in our literature that Health Professionals recommend that weaning
shouldn't take place before 6 months so if you want to start the
process
sooner than this you need to consult a Health Professional.

We are following guidelines and we have had confirmation that we can
say
this on our packaging. When and if that situation changes of course we
will change it according to what we are told and guided to do by the
government and health professionals.

We are always very open and honest within our communications and will
always adhere to rules and regulations concerning babyfoods and
otherwise.

I am sorry that you feel disappointed but I do hope this has helped
answer some of your concerns.

Kind Regards
Marie Van Hagen
Brand/Customer Service Manager

What do you all think? I think Hunker will be interested in this reply, as she is known to get rabid on the subject Wink

OP posts:
HRHQueenOfQuotes · 02/03/2006 19:19

ooo tiktok - I'm glad I read your message again - I thought your last paragraph was aimed at me and was about to launch off on a frenzy LOL.

elclose · 02/03/2006 19:28

Just read post about 'message not getting through' ,all about giving fruit shoots ect this is why there are guidlines in place! Not for the average mum.

LIZS · 02/03/2006 19:33

Apparently Which ? have criticised some organic baby foods as having too high a water content. Anyone seen the actual report ?

LucyJu · 02/03/2006 21:44

LizS, \link{http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/03/02/nfood02.xml&sSheet=/news/2006/03/02/ixhome.html\this}was in the paper today.

Kathy1972 · 03/03/2006 09:14

That's one reason why we make our own - I looked at the labels on some Heinz butternut squash and chicken my mum bought and was surprised to find something like 5% chicken. Then I looked at an organic equivalent and the ingredients were much the same! Nothing in there that's going to do them any harm, I just resented paying all that money for water!

tiktok · 03/03/2006 09:42

So as long as you don't give your baby fruit shoots, you can ignore the guidelines to wean gradually from about 6 mths, elclose?

The guidelines are there for every baby. It really has nothing to do with whether the diet later contains junk or not.

Kathy1972 · 03/03/2006 10:15

My very intelligent, well-read HV who has the research at her fingertips (just thought I'd put that as there are clearly so many HVs who are the exact opposite) said that the weaning guidelines were brought in to counteract the effects of so many mothers weaning ridiculously early on completely the wrong food (steak at 3 months etc) and that we should have no worries at all about weaning at 4 months onto baby rice.
I can see her point - if people have been regularly feeding their babies food like that then surely it's those babies that are behind the rise in allergies, not the baby-rice-at-4-months ones?
Tiktok - as I understand it (from the LLL breastfeeding book) there are 2 reasons why the WHO wants to encourage longer breastfeeding and late weaning. One is allergies. The other is that as long as they're getting breast milk you know they are getting a perfect diet. Once they're weaned they may or may not be, depending on whether the mother has the resources/knowhow to feed her baby properly or just gives them junk. So, yes actually, what you give them once they are weaned is a very relevant factor.

LIZS · 03/03/2006 10:23

kathy1972, that is all very well for your hv but she still needs to offer such advice sparingly or she'll inadvertently encourage those who might wean earlier anyway.

NotQuiteCockney · 03/03/2006 10:28

Hmm, Kathy, but that doesn't get around the possibility of gut problems in later life.

The arguments against early weaning aren't water-tight, I'd agree, but the arguments for early weaning are flimsy to non-existant.

Kathy1972 · 03/03/2006 10:30

I have no doubt she is very careful LizS.

Kathy1972 · 03/03/2006 10:36

Didn't say it did, NQC - Tiktok was saying the guidelines have 'nothing to do' with quality of diet, I was pointing out that there were 2 factors behind the WHO guidelines and quality of diet was one.

elclose · 03/03/2006 14:04

kathy 1972 that was my point you just said it much better!!

NotQuiteCockney · 04/03/2006 09:32

It's worth noting that, really, no diet you ever give your kids will be better than breast milk.

Yes, if people are going to wean early, better they give baby rice and some vegetables, than full English breakfast.

But the sooner people start giving solids, the sooner they will introduce gluten, chocolate mousse, etc.

Kathy1972 · 04/03/2006 10:18

Hey hang on, bit of an assumption there NQC?

NotQuiteCockney · 04/03/2006 10:38

Which bit, Kathy?

expatinscotland · 04/03/2006 10:43

I just don't see what the big deal is about this, but we're also parents who have done everything child-led - weaning, potty training, giving up the dummy, etc.

Back when DD1 was smaller, the guidlines were wean at 4 months. But she wasn't ready then. So we waited till she was showing interest in foods, trying to grab ours, smiling as we ate, sucking in w/her tongue, etc. Turns out she was pretty close to 6 months, but we plan on doing the same w/DD2, who comes to the table w/us when we sit down for meals, too. No, of course she is not weaned. But we include her in that time so when she's ready she'll give off signs.

tiktok · 04/03/2006 11:01

Kathy, whatever the LL answer book says, the basis for the weaning guidance comes from research into the effects on babies of weaning early/weaning late.

She is wrong to say we should have no concerns about weaning onto baby rice at 4 mths. It's probably better than coca cola and chips, I suppose, but the fact is it is not milk, and the research makes no distinction between babies weaned onto baby rice and babies weaned onto pureed MacDonalds.

We can say this confidently because we have a lot of research, from areas of the world where they do use baby rice and areas where they don't, and areas where unsuitable foods are used and areas where they aren't.

Baby rice has no real benefit for most babies of four months and it is an extra job to prepare it. Who gains from pushing baby rice at 4 mths? Why bother with it?

Stick the guidelines and most babies will benefit from doing so.

tiktok · 04/03/2006 11:02

'She' = Kathy's HV.

Twinkie1 · 04/03/2006 11:06

My son was weaned before 6 months - although still breastfed and I was glad to have the choice as to what food I wanted to buy!!

Kathy1972 · 04/03/2006 11:50

NQC - the assumption I was referring to was 'But the sooner people start giving solids, the sooner they will introduce gluten, chocolate mousse, etc.' If you mean 'there is a general tendency for this to happen', then fair enough, may be true, but we need evidence; if you mean this will always happen then, no it won't - I have a friend who waited till six months and gives her baby nothing but jars (and only the sweet ones too as she says her baby won't eat veg), whereas we weaned at 4 months and are very careful with what we give. Someone said earlier that there is a danger of people slavishly following the 6 months guideline and then not paying much attention to what they give, but got shouted down - however it does definitely happen.

Kathy1972 · 04/03/2006 11:53

Tiktok - citation for research contrasting suitable food with unsuitable please. The research I have seen doesn't make this distinction.

Kathy1972 · 04/03/2006 12:04

Sorry Tiktok if that sounds a bit peremptory! I would be genuinely interested to see the research - I took this matter very seriously and am prepared to read anything which might change my views.

LucyJu · 04/03/2006 12:05

Sometimes, I just don't get it. Why are some of you so keen on weaning early and so reluctant to accept the latest research findings? I accept that advice does change from time to time, and maybe in a few years time we'll actually find out that babies weaned at 3 weeks onto pureed Big Macs are the healthiest of the lot. In which case, I'll be there with my burger and blender. But until such evidence is found, I'll listen to the latest advice.
And if it is recommended that babies should not be weaned until six months, then common sense dictates that infant food should not be marketed to babies younger than six months. As long as labels say "suitable from 4 months", mothers are going to assume "it must be okay, otherwise they wouldn't be able to sell it". If labels were changed, people would still be able to wean early, if that's what they really want. But at least the message going out to parents would be clear.

drosophila · 04/03/2006 12:23

Why don't they say something like - 'suitable for first weaning after discussion with HV'

NotQuiteCockney · 04/03/2006 12:47

Kathy, I was making a rather simpler point. If you don't introduce solids before 6 months, you can't give gluten before 6 months. You can't give egg custard before 6 months, because, again, no solids.

There's a strong movement for baby-led weaning, where you give babies family food pretty much from six months. I've done this with DS2, but I still think he has a pretty healthy diet.