Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Vegan

Join Mumsnet's vegan community and discuss everything related to the vegan diet.

Carbs carbs carbs

44 replies

Nouveaunew · 20/03/2022 00:37

I’m just putting on weight from all the carbs I eat! How to be a healthy (& full!) vegan? Grin

OP posts:
Nouveaunew · 21/03/2022 23:33

Thanks @ThedaBara I’ll check out that channel

Thanks @EssexLionessbi eat tofu and I like lentils. I’ve never had seitan. I’ll check it out

OP posts:
Nouveaunew · 21/03/2022 23:35

@StoryOfANewName
Thank you. I eat tofu but haven’t had tempeh. I’ll look it up. I don’t think I can eat many onions. My digestive system isn’t happy these days. I think I’ll just get a capsule probiotic until my system is back in better shape.

OP posts:
mocktail · 21/03/2022 23:36

Plan every meal around some form of protein - red lentils are an easy one as they cook quickly and can be added to lots of different things, and tinned beans are another good one. So don't have just tomato sauce and pasta, or veg curry and rice, make sure it's always tomato and lentil sauce with pasta, or veg and chickpea curry for example.

Nouveaunew · 21/03/2022 23:37

Thanks @mocktail

Silly question: can you add uncooked lentils to a pasta sauce ?

OP posts:
mocktail · 21/03/2022 23:59

Yes you can - just add them with some tinned chopped tomatoes and water, after frying the onion veg. Something like this: www.easypeasyfoodie.com/easy-lentil-bolognese/

Nouveaunew · 22/03/2022 17:27

Thanks @mocktail

OP posts:
ppeatfruit · 01/04/2022 13:23

Nouveau Hi! Cormoran is good! Whole organic rice is your friend BUT it must be cooked for a while after soaking, and after bringing to the boil cover it on a very low light. leave it till it's soft.
Veg curries are brillliant too Ypu can curry courgettes or lentils etc., with the same base of onions\garlic and the spices you like.

Nouveaunew · 23/04/2022 07:27

Thanks @ppeatfruit

OP posts:
WinterDeWinter · 03/06/2022 21:55

@Cormoran I wish you would start a thread on the science-y stuff of vegan eating. I've learnt a lot from your posts on this one - thank you - but I suspect you have more to give ;-)

Cormoran · 04/06/2022 01:42

You are right @WinterDeWinter I have plenty ! Not sure what content type you are interested in, so I will write a mix.

Nutrients are important and a lot of vegans are malnourished. I would recommend everyone , vegan or not, to do an omega 3 index test. Omegaquant is the cheapest , a finger prick for a drop of blood done at home

A nutrient on a database doesn't translate in said nutrient for you.
First the database were made decades ago when soil and agriculture were different . An apple that grows at the back of your garden that you pick in season, in September, will be very different from an apple bought at the supermarket today, in June, and that has spent more than 6 months in a fridge.
Second some nutrient are not absorbed. Take spinach, great source of calcium on paper, however because of its oxalate content, none of it will be absorbed.

Iodine is another one we need to be careful with. Nobody ever talks about it. We need to eat some seaweeds or supplement with iodine drops. Packaged food use iodine salt but if don't you eat packaged food, you need to find sources.

Genetics will influence your ability to extract nutrients from food. We are not equal.

People are seriously and excessively obsessed with proteins. If you focus on quality of diet, all macro come into place at the end of the day. Too many proteins are actually damaging .

Variety in addition to quality is so crucial. Most people eat 5-6 vegetables (carrots, cucumber, broccoli, iceberg lettuce, tomatoes, onion ) and eat those in the same way. The way you cook a vegetable and which other vegetable/plant you cook it with will result in different gut metabolites.
Asian supermarkets are a gold mine for incredible vegetables , cheap ginger and turmeric, great tofu , amazing selection of seaweeds.

Bread is another one. Most (all?) supermarket breads are rubbish. Doing bread at home, from the dark rye to the Greek pita, is very easy. Sourdough is more challenging, but for the majority of breads, it is flour, half the flour amount of lukewarm water, fresh yeast, some salt. Experiment and combine different types of flours. If using wholemeal flours, a bit of extra virgin olive oil will make dough more elastic. Some seeds (caraway are great for dark rye) , kneading your dough , a sunny spot in the house, time and an oven at high temperature.
The same for hummus. Dead easy at home (if you boil your canned chickpea in a small pot with bicarb soda, the cellulose shells come off after 15 min, pick it up with a fork and your hummus will be super smooth) , and then experiment adding cooked beetroot, eggplant, ...

Eating plant based or plant dominant reduces our risk of cancer. A recent study looked at the mortality of animals in zoos giving such precious insight, since we can't really do that in the wild. Carnivore animals, especially if eating mammals (beed, pig, sheep, ...) were up to 40 % likely to die of cancer, whereas the herbivores were not. www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-04224-5

Carnivore animals in zoo are not given crap to eat, but big chunks of meat. Meat but also excessive proteins will activate the mTOR pathway involved in ageing and cell proliferation. Eating a polyphenols rich diet is protective phenol-explorer.eu is a great database for the polyphenol content of food and why not try some of the less known high polyphenol variety of beans, such as adzuki beans.
The most important point is that polyphenols rich food are also the most delicious, from berries, to herbs, they bring pleasure to the table.

Enough for now!

WinterDeWinter · 04/06/2022 11:41

That is amazing - thank you very much @Cormoran ! If you get a chance I would be very interested to hear how best to improve the gut microbiome on a vegan diet when you don't like sauerkraut!

"The way you cook a vegetable and which other vegetable/plant you cook it with will result in different gut metabolites.:

And also very interested to hear how you achieve the above in terms of recipes - I'm trying to build up a repertoire and have started with middle eastern, Mexican and Indian (all are -ish!)

It is pretty time-consuming at the moment because I'm literally cooking everything from scratch other than wholemeal sourdough from a proper bakers. So if you or anyone else have any useful short cuts in terms of pre-prep that would be great... for example, I have a big jar of Zaatar/lemon/garlic paste dressing pre-prepped in the fridge so making a herby salad is quicker, I have a big dish of caramelised sliced onions so I can get started more quickly with curry/chilli etc.

Cormoran · 04/06/2022 20:23

@WinterDeWinter If you had asked me the question " how to improve my gut microbiota" a year ago, I would have said, increase the variety and quantity of plant food to have variety of fibre.

We now know, this is the wrong answer. I love, Prof Christopher Gardner, and he coupled with the m most famous gut expert, Erica and Justin Sonnenburg to study exactly that . One group had to increase fibre rich food, the other had to eat 6 servings a day of fermented food,.
Each intervention had a distinct effects on the gut microbiota and host immunesystem.
The intervention that had the most impact was the fermented food. They drank the fermented shoots you now see at supermarket or the brine of picked vegetables. The article is here pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34256014/ but it has a paywall. Some extracts here :

Fiber-rich foods contain an abundance of MACs, which provide a fermentable carbon source for the micro- biota. Despite sustained high levels of diverse plant-derived die- tary fiber in these participants over 6 weeks, we did not observe a cohort-wide microbiota diversity increase in the high-fiber-diet arm. It is possible that the relatively short duration of the study was not sufficient to allow for the recruitment of new taxa to the microbiota, which could be an indication that exposure to new microbes was limited within the environment of participants. Environmentally constrained diversity is consistent with (1) high levels of sanitation in industrialized populations leading to less sharing of microbes between individuals (Martı ́nez et al., 2015), (2) the necessity of dietary fiber plus administered microbes to restore diversity to the gut microbiota in a mouse model (Son- nenburg et al., 2016), and (3) the loss of strains and their associ- ated glycan-degrading capacity observed in US immigrants (Vangay et al., 2018). The detection of plant-glycan-derived car- bohydrates in the stool of the high-fiber-diet participants is consistent with incomplete microbiota fermentation that might be expected in an industrialized microbiota.
The increased microbiota diversity observed in the fermented- food-diet arm was coincident with decreases in numerous markers of inflammation, measured with distinct technologies. These correlated changes are consistent with a broad range of studies demonstrating a link between declining microbiota diver- sity and increased NCCD prevalence (reviewed in Mosca et al., 2016). Notably, the new taxa contributing to the increased diver- sity were largely not from the fermented foods themselves, indi- cating an indirect effect of their consumption on remodeling the microbiota. It is unclear whether these ‘‘new’’ taxa were newly recruited to the microbiota from the environment or were already present but undetected and increased in relative abundance to detectable levels during the intervention. The slow trajectory of diversity increase resulted in the greatest microbiota diversity observed during the choice phase, where fermented food intake was higher than at baseline, but lower than during the mainte- nance period. The slow and steadily increasing diversity sug- gests a time element for remodeling of the microbiome compo- sition through diet, consistent with the relative recalcitrance of the human microbiota to rapid diet-induced remodeling (Wu et al., 2011). Fiber-induced microbiota diversity increases may be a slower process requiring longer than the 6 weeks of sus- tained high consumption achieved in this study. Importantly, high-fiber consumption did appear to increase stool microbial protein density, carbohydrate-degrading capacity, and altered SCFA production, indicating that microbiome remodeling was occurring within the study time frame, just not through an in- crease in total species. Given the distinct responses of partici- pants to these two diets, whether a diet composed of both high-fiber and fermented foods could synergize to influence the host microbiota and immune system is an exciting possibility that remains to be determined.
The malleability of the human microbiome, its integration into the immune system, and its responsiveness to diet make it a highly attractive target for therapeutic intervention. Knowledge of how specific dietary interventions impact the microbiota could be leveraged to develop effective diets that improve human health.

You don't like sauerkraut. Did you make your know? WIth water or just by squeezing? I don't like pickled vegetables (water) but I do enjoy my own saurkraut, and happy to share recipes . Miso, tempeh , kefir water , sourdough are the non-vegetables options for Vegans. Kombucha is a weird one and there is little evidence it changes the gut, but if you like it.

Prep time

In my fridge , I always have container with quinoa, black/red/brown rice , shredded cabbage . I cook a lot of soups. I love soups . From the sweet pumpkin to the exotic dhals. I also roast a lot. Thinly slice lengthwise zucchinis, brush with olive oil, sprinkle salt, on a tray, very hot oven (220) keeping an eye until they brown lightly but not burn. Roasted onion. Boil the peeled whole onions for 15-20, let them cool, cut in half, put on oven dish, cut half up, make a mixture with break crumbs, herbs, whatever and roast in oven.
The green bits of the leeks, are my absolute favourite. Wash and dry and cut in half so they lay flat. Rub with a mixture of olive oil, salt and smoked paprika, put on oven tray, one next to the other and fan + top/grill hot oven.

I use canned pulses. Chickpeas, lentils, spagna beans, adzuki... I am quite fond of red kidney beans.
I tend to eat, a raw salad - open a packet of rocket, slice half a pear, some pine nuts or slice crazy thinly a celery and squeeze an orange, than oil, salt, parsley and some cooked vegetable - and a cooked one. Some cooked take time (roasted), others are ready, cauliflower , or recently I started using frozen kale or spinach. A few times, I even just put frozen Brussels spouts in a dish in the oven. After 20 min , I cut them in half now that they are soft, and put herbs and spices, a table spoon go oil, slalt and pepper , my own vegan parmesan (1 cup of cashew, 2 table spoons nutritional yeast, onion powder, garlic powder , salt and blend) and back in oven
Then I have edamame, or a marinated tofu. I like hard tofu .

In my freezer I have fresh chopped herbs, a ton of berries of all sorts, and cherries.
When your veggies are becoming sad and old, cut them all in small cubes, sautéed in a pan, and have them with couscous. Very quick.
Some days, I do fancy dishes which take time, other I just take out containers and make a bowl call it poke bowl, Buddha bowl, ...

I use nutritional yeast for dressing. An empty jam jar. Olive oil , salt, dijon mustard. Put lid, close well and shake. Open and add a table spoon of yeast and vinegar, and if you fancy them, cappers, sun dried tomatoes, parsley, ..... Close and shake again. It is lovely on green bean, artichokes , cauliflower , ...

Enough!

Cormoran · 04/06/2022 20:24

The paper I linked in the open forum is locked. Here is the unlocked full text sci-hub.se/doi.org/10.1016/j.cell.2021.06.019 click on save or read on screen

WinterDeWinter · 04/06/2022 21:15

That is so kind of you @Cormoran, thank you very very much for taking the time to pass it all on. Much to think about! I can't get the full text of the paper to load but I think it's perhaps a problem with the site, will try again later. I will definitely give homemade sauerkraut a go, I see from the recipes that it doesn't have to be totally sour if you stop steeping it after a week or so rather than the full 5 weeks! I'll explore other fermented possibilities too - I am a bit of a wuss with it, not sure why.

The prep tips - fantastically useful. I will get those things organised. I've already discovered that the key is having things available and to hand - WFH lunches for example were a testing point at the beginning! Having roasted stuff ready to go is such a good idea. On which note - I can highly recommend Waitrose Essentials frozen grilled veg as a time-saver base for lots of things.

Thanks again, I really do appreciate it!

Cormoran · 04/06/2022 22:07

My sauerkraut isn't sour. Shred your cabbage, I usually do half a cabbage . Put it in your biggest salad bowl, add a heaped teaspoon of salt, pull of your sleeves, put a 30 min show because for 20 min, you are going to massage, squeeze, and break your cabbage. Excellent workout for forearms! You squeeze, turn, squeeze , turn, try to break the fibre with your hands. Slowly, liquid will form. After 15 min, your cabbage is crying out of pain. You lift it from the bowl, liquid is pouring. If you don't have liquid, you are not squeezing hard enough. It takes a good 20 min to have the right amount of liquid. Put in a jar, fill with the cabbage liquid. Push hard. So that cabbage stays submerged, I put an egg holder , push it down and then place lid. A dark tea towel on top, and two weeks in a corner.
I add dill to mine, and some mustard seeds. It will ferment, but it is absolutely not sour or bitter. I make a red one and a green one. Red will make less liquid than green . If I combine red+green, it doesn't take and I have to bin the lot . I might do something wrong or they hate each other. So I will have a red jar and a green jar. It is usually gone in a matter of days. My DH loves it and adds spoonfuls to his plate.

Let me know if you like this one!

For the full paper, click on save and it will open as a pdf. Erica Sonnenburg, Susan Lynch and Christopher Gardner from Stanford and other universities have several presentations on YouTube done at conferences , webinars, ...

I am in Sydney, Australia, no waitrose here! and fruits and vegetable cost a fortune!

vincettenoir · 09/06/2022 19:10

I had exactly this problem. I swapped chia seed puddings instead of porridge for my weekday breakfast and it keeps me full. I also try to mainly have high protein, low carb lunches like leftover chilli with salad or tofu scrambles with tomatoes. I pretty much always have carbs at dinner.

For me, focussing on upping my protein is what helped me reduce the carbs. You’re right, you can’t fill up on vegetables. But you can fill up on protein.

Nouveaunew · 11/06/2022 07:50

@vincettenoir
Thank you so much. Chia seed pudding for breakfast is a great idea!

OP posts:
WinterDeWinter · 11/06/2022 13:14

@Cormoran I missed your sauerkraut post - thanks so much. It does sound doable and a lot less, erm, aggressive than the ones I've tasted before 😁I will definitely give it a go. DH will be pleased! And I will Google the papers.

Cormoran · 12/06/2022 20:54

@WinterDeWinter interesting article on diet and microbiome from Cell, major medical journal www.cell.com/cell-host-microbe/fulltext/S1931-3128(22)00222-0
It is an open access article.
I hope you will find it interesting too @Nouveaunew , as there is a distinction to be made between refined carbs and natural unprocessed carbs

New posts on this thread. Refresh page