Why is train travel so bloody expensive?

[icantgetnopeace]

I’m going away in a couple of weeks with some friends and nobody fancies driving into the city so we are looking at trains.
A one hour journey (return next day) is around £50 😳 It’s no bloody wonder people don’t bother. Am I missing something? Are there ways of getting discounts that I’m not aware of? I looked at a friends and family railcard to see if that would make any difference but when I added one to the potential booking it didn’t give a discount (maybe cross country don’t accept them 🤷🏼‍♀️)

This is the main issue with British trains. On a lot of routes, the only way to get it for a decent price is to travel on fixed trains, booked months in advance. So it's never going to be comparable to driving, especially if more than one person is travelling, when it's much cheaper and you have the flexibility to come and go as you please instead of having to stick to your exact plan, whether it suits or not.

That is what happened in Poland, I believe. The disused lines have been left dormant for “strategic” reasons. They have not been sold off or built over so could be reopened relatively easily and cheaply.

As others have said. Look at times and days of travel.
Use Trainline app and I also adjust my departure station to see if it’s cheaper (often is)
Putting everyone on the same booking can also make a difference

I'm just back from Japan. Even bullet trains walk up for a 2.5hr journey (4+ hours in UK money is £65. Local trains a couple of pounds, metros a pound per journey in most cities. Everything is better, cleaner and much cheaper. It is clear we have really fucked up as a country over the last 30 years or more.

It’s batshit isn’t it. Completely fed up with above inflation increases.

This is the main issue with British trains. On a lot of routes, the only way to get it for a decent price is to travel on fixed trains, booked months in advance. So it's never going to be comparable to driving

We once bought 3 advanced singles for my inlaws to travel to us from the airport as it was cheaper than a flexible ticket! And coming off a plane you never quite know how long it's going to take you to pick up luggage/get through security.

Next week I'm getting a train the night before and staying in a hotel as it's £100 cheaper including the hotel than getting a peak time train in the morning

It actually would be even more expensive if it weren’t subsidised (to some extent) by the gov. In other European countries it’s more subsidised, hence cheaper.

The Train Pal app should find you the cheapest option with split saves etc, Trainline charges commission so will be a bit more expensive, but it’s worth looking at their cheap fare finder to see if tweaking times or stations will cut the cost (www.thetrainline.com/farefinder). But some journeys are really expensive no matter what you do.

I would look at; using an app (I use TrainPal and it usually gets me a discount). Look if you can get “evening out” tickets, they tend to work after about midday here (for London I have to split the ticket midway, not sure why). Can you get a GroupSave ticket?
Also not all the cheap advance tickets come out a long time in advance, sometimes price drops as you get closer.
And finally have you factored in the cost of parking at your destination.

Yes it’s ridiculous to go to a city 1 hour away it’s £28 a seat and would be maybe £15 petrol £10 parking in car for up to 5 people. There’s no incentive to use the train from a financial perspective. More if you want to drink and it can be quicker.

I can drive to Birmingham in about an hour,
~100 miles round trip, £45 at HMRCs generous 45p a mile rate

The train journey takes 1hr 51 minutes with one change plus either a 20 minute walk to the station or paying for car parking at the station, an Anytime return is £59.90.

Work still used to make me take the latter option under their green agenda.

We are going from a manned station, unfortunately two of us are coming back on different day to the other two so probably won’t get a discount anyway 🙄

@icantgetnopeace where are you going to and from?
Us Mumsnet train nerds might be able to figure out the cheapest.

Wolverhampton to Stockport (easier pick up than Manc) but two are returning Sunday and two Monday so return group save won’t work (possibly if we got two singles?)

@icantgetnopeace are you traveling Saturday?
What time are you coming back Sunday?

@icantgetnopeace An off-peak open return (return ticket is valid for a month) is £44 with West Midlands Trains.
Those coming back Monday will have slight restrictions on travel times (usually no travel before 9.30am - they'd have to check) but Sunday travel will be any time.

Or £58 for TWO if you have a Two Together Railcard (so £29 each).
But you have to pay for the Railcard to start with and only really saves if you travel lots.

If you may do a few of these trips, this might help.

Two Together Railcard | Railcards https://share.google/m3ULU5IRPEycCDymM

I have a Friends and Family railcard (for our family of 3) and we have saved well in excess of what it costs each year.

That's appalling but doesn't surprise me unfortunately.

The trouble is some tickets aren't for a specific train so they don't know who will turn up. Sometimes that flexibility is good and sometimes not do much.

I agree with this!! Especially when you can’t get a seat and you are packed in like sardines.

But why SHOULD they be higher? Are you getting a better seat if you pay more? No, in fact you're probably getting a WORSE experience because it will probably be an overcrowded train. I HATE dynamic pricing, it's a scourge of the information age.

I don' t see why they can't sell open returns but make it mandatory to book a seat as soon as you know which train you want to try to travel on. A maximum number of "standing" reservations for each train too. When everyone has smartphones this would be really easy to do. Like online checkin when you fly.

Realistically, there are some Cross Country trains via Birmingham that are packed like sardines every day, so they DO know that those are likely to be dangerously packed.

What about group save. 3-9 Adults get 1/3 off