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Tutoring

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Finding tutors who are accountable to results?

89 replies

Jwrkt66 · 25/10/2021 17:45

Am trying to find a 11+ tutor for my younger yr 5 DD to focus on English comprehension and Maths. I went through 3 tutors (2 were from agencies/websites recommended on other threads here) for my elder DS 2 yrs ago but stopped because although I could see improved knowledge, ISEB scores were not improving much. I concluded its hard to hold tutors accountable to results. But my DD really needs tutoring. Does anyone have recommendations?.

OP posts:
LorenzoVonMatterhorn · 27/10/2021 10:36

I’d be very wary of a company saying they can guarantee a result. The result depends on the child.

alicesfavouritepen · 27/10/2021 10:37

🚩 🚩🚩🚩🚩

LolaSmiles · 27/10/2021 15:19

.I have dealt with many parents like you in my years of teaching, and the pressure you put on the child and the tutor will not in anyway improve the situation, you are just causing stress all round. The point of the exams, as pp have said, is to find the right school for the child, not to force the children of status driven parents into schools that they will struggle in
You've hit the nail on the head here.

Threads like this make me very glad I'm not in an 11+ area.

It's bad enough getting parents like the OP for GCSE. Sometimes I think they don't understand that their child is the one sitting the exam, so telling me very forcefully (bordering on nasty middle class aggressively) what grades their child 'needs' isn't going to change my teaching.

Tillymintpolo · 27/10/2021 15:21

No one can guarantee anything, it completely depends on your child on the day

KaptainKaveman · 28/10/2021 08:27

There is a significant number of parents who believe that if they chuck enough money at an issue it will be resolved. Education does not work like that though.

MargosKaftan · 28/10/2021 08:48

If it helps OP, I live in an 11+ area and everyone uses tutors. Different tutor styles suit different children. The big issue here is children drilled to get in the "right" school as far as their parents are concerned, then scrambling for a year 8 place in the summer term elsewhere because their son/daughter has had a miserable year 7 being the bottom of the class and unable to keep up with the work. If you have to heavily tutor to get in a school, its the wrong school for your child and they will need heavy tutoring for the next 5 years to keep up.

That said, the exam structure should be tutored and practiced- ds did very well in his 11+, but on one paper ran out of time and just guessed at the last 7 questions (multiple choice), he didn't really know what 30 seconds per question felt like so didn't work fast enough. (He got such a good score that at least half of those questions he must have guessed right - lot to be said for being lucky!) So doing past / practice papers to time, being familiar with the way the answer sheets are set out, knowing to skip a question if you can't answer it (many primary schools teach kids to keep at a difficult question, not move on, you need to teach them not to waste 5 minutes on one problem and come back to it at the end if they've got time).

itsgettingwierd · 28/10/2021 08:55

Agree with others.

A good tutor can help a child understand and learn.

But ultimately you cannot change a child's inate ability or aptitude or attitude.

My ds had years and years of intensive support via his EHCP for literacy. Spelling and grammar type help. He just fell further behind in terms of the gap between attainment and age expectations even though he made progress.

No tutor can rewire the part of his brain that just doesn't manage to grasp this!

shreddednips · 28/10/2021 09:12

I'm an ex 11+ tutor and used to get pretty good results, but I can't imagine how anyone could guarantee a pass. I suspect the ones who offer this type of thing are inexperienced or absolutely ruthless with turning down or stopping working with children who aren't a pretty much certain pass anyway. I used to often accept children who had been turned down by other tutors or been told they weren't suitable candidates by their previous tutor.

I honestly think the best way to approach tutoring is to see it as developing the child's intellect as much as possible, alongside building up their confidence and helping nervous or disheartened children see themselves as capable learners with potential. If it gets them through the 11+ then great, but it's not good for children (especially young ones) to measure the sum of their educational achievement in test results. Expecting a tutor to guarantee results would, I imagine, lead to hugely pressured teaching that could really spoil a young child's experience of and relationship with education.

Asdf12345 · 28/10/2021 09:40

To be fair a partial refund in the case of a fail might make reasonable business sense if when paired with a higher basic charge in order to offset cost plus some extra profit it would drive up profitability overall.

Namenic · 28/10/2021 09:51

Don’t think it’s v constructive to have an attitude that wants a guaranteed pass. Not fair on child, tutor or parent. Child may feel ill on the day or maybe the competition this year is stronger than normal.

Life is unpredictable. 11+ is not the end of the world, nor are gcses, a levels or uni. Step back and take a wider perspective.

languagelover96 · 28/10/2021 10:09

Chiming in again. You can order Bond materials etc from their website and chill. Find a good tutor that can wholly make a difference overall in ability. Do lots of practice questions often if possible and also consider weaknesses too. Reflect on what works and what does not. Teach strategies and techniques and methods that work. Set homework accordingly.

IAAP · 28/10/2021 10:55

@Namenic

Don’t think it’s v constructive to have an attitude that wants a guaranteed pass. Not fair on child, tutor or parent. Child may feel ill on the day or maybe the competition this year is stronger than normal.

Life is unpredictable. 11+ is not the end of the world, nor are gcses, a levels or uni. Step back and take a wider perspective.

Having been through this process, I can give you my personal take.

Eldest was academically very very bright - read books at a young age, never needed to read spellings more than once to remember them, she ate homework and loved learning. For preparation for the 11 plus we got 3 of the 11+ bonds papers on verbal and non verbal reasoning papers to have a go at. The first trial one she got all the questions correct but only answered about 65% of the questions. So I emphasised time and speed. Second paper 85% and three paper higher still up to 95%. She sat the exam for the grammar and passed with flying colours - the highest mark in the year group - full marks followed on the Year 6 SATs. She did some GCSEs early in year 9 gaining level 9 and now doing a level with Head of Maths 1-2-1. To her credit she seems happy and well adjusted - my worry was always the expectations of the school as level 9 for everything means she can only fail or reach her expectations. So my role is making her see she is a massive success no matter what she does.

My nephew went to an outstanding school. In year 4 His mum started thinking about the 11 plus and consulted a tutor. He was meeting ‘expectations’ at school but to her horror this was well below what he needed for grammar. She then embarked on a ridiculous programme of tutoring. Tutor x3 a week. 3 hours every night with her. Tutoring every day in the summer holiday and Easter etc he passed the 11 plus. She then was irate with a fury that he didn’t get into grammar as the intake was such that nephew was too far out of catchment. Then he had the sit the exam for private grammar and that’s where he goes. She hams up his achievements and pays for a tutor x2 week to continue to support him. He’s enjoying school but he will forever be a ‘failure’ in his mother’s eyes despite what she crows about his achievements - he seems frightened of his own shadow. His tutor helps with homework and watches the grades and assessments and tutor targets it - he can not fail. Can you imagine the mental health pressure?

Best friends daughter same age as mine. Again excessive tutoring and mum even held her back a year to ensure entry and see goes to the school you mentioned. She is struggling and has gone off the rails big time - drinking, smoking and suicidal and she can’t cope academically or socially.

My son was seriously behind ‘not meeting expectations’ in reception and year 1. He has an EHCP. He has special needs and his weakness is English. During lockdown we did intensive English daily which we have carried on I was working from home and able to do it with him. So we did 4 hours a day 7 days a week. Following a return to school - - -at home We do 4 pages in CGP books most days rotating around spelling, punctuation and comprehension etc it is a huge almighty struggle. It is exceptionally draining but a 2 year gap has become 4 month gap - because where as he made progress , other regressed. If I can help to support him reach expected level in year 6 - I feel that will give him the best possible start at secondary. He is ahead in maths but English. But often I worry that I’m doing the ‘wrong’ thing as we don’t spent time on the subjects he is ahead on and enjoys but relentless English etc I’m trying really hard to find a balance but I’m trying my best to find a way to support him little and often without overwhelming him. It’s just bloody hard. We have an outstanding state school local and he will get in because of his EHCP - grammar school would not be the right place for him. I went to the grammar school and it’s a hot house.

My point is 4 different kids - 4 different ways. The outcome is dependent on you as a parent, them and their raw ability, the extra effort they put in, illness, teachers in school, tutors etc

I do believe that in private schools in year 5 they tutor to the exam.

Please don’t tutor to pass an exam. Tutor to work on weaknesses and to improve confidence in that area.

What does your child’s class teacher think - where are your child’s specific weaknesses eg punctuation - concentrate on that and to love learning. With mine I told her she was sitting the exam and it didn’t matter on the result as she didn’t need to pass it. My sister went all out - anything less than a pass was unacceptable. That only leads to stress and disappointment.

There will be plenty on here that disagree with the structure I put in place for me son and say an 1 hour a day (usually 30 mins) on top of school work is too pressured. Equally there are some that do more or would do more. I have to try and find my own level that meets our needs.

KaycePollard · 28/10/2021 11:55

The big issue here is children drilled to get in the "right" school as far as their parents are concerned, then scrambling for a year 8 place in the summer term elsewhere because their son/daughter has had a miserable year 7 being the bottom of the class and unable to keep up with the work. If you have to heavily tutor to get in a school, its the wrong school for your child and they will need heavy tutoring for the next 5 years to keep up.

This is so true at all levels of education @MargosKaftan. And also worth remembering that it’s the “right” school at the “right” time for each child. It’s such a pity we have such an all-or-nothing education system right through to university. It would be great to have options to leave- for a different kind of education, through work, or volunteer activity, or intensive physical education (I’m thinking ballet, gymnastics etc at the highest levels when the body won’t wait).

By the way @margoskaftan there’s a fab programme on BBC Sounds about “What’s So Funny about The Good Life” with fFelicity Kendall. Lots about Margo!

Fozzleyplum · 28/10/2021 12:12

OP, "accountable" doesn't mean anything unless you say what you would expect if your child, despite being tutored, failed the 11+.

So what consequence would you require if that happened?

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