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Discuss horse riding and ownership on our Horse forum.

Original poster

adjusting saddle?

36 replies

mysterymoniker · 12/01/2009 19:27

we have a new (to us) saddle, much better fit than the old one which had to be used with a riser pad thing

all has been lovely for a few months but now it seems to be touching his withers - the chief riding instructor said 'you need to adjust it' but when I asked how she said she didn't know

I asked about whether I should just get a new saddle and she didn't think that was necessary (phew) so does anyone know how to make these adjustments? it's a Thorowgood synthetic general purpose high wither job

OP posts:
snorris · 12/01/2009 19:46

TBH you probably need to get a saddle fitter out to have a look. It may be that the saddle needs reflocking but could it possibly be too wide for your horse- he/she may have lost a bit of weight over the winter?

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 12/01/2009 19:50

yes either he's lost a little bit of weight or, new thought, it is not so much the saddle as the new rugs (apparently he got very very sore earlier in life) - am leaving the stable rug off except when it is very very sub zero

would it be easier to trade him in for a lower-withered model?

wonder how much it will cost for the saddle man to come and have a look gloom

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snorris · 12/01/2009 19:54

Just thought- is it the old style Thorowgood or the new type that you can put the inserts to adjust it? Saddle fitting guide here too.

snorris · 12/01/2009 19:56

Low-withered models are not easy to fit either! Plus there's nothing to stop your saddle slipping round .

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 12/01/2009 19:58

old style I think, we inherited it from his best friend who died last year - it was a big improvement on the one he came with

thanks for link, no, don't think it does have those

despair

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snorris · 12/01/2009 20:05

Is there anybody else on your yard who might need a saddle fitter too. I don't think they charge a lot for coming to check a saddle (confession time- I've never used one ). Personal recommendation is usually best but The Society of Master Saddlers will help find one in your area.

Nekabu · 12/01/2009 20:10

If it's touching his withers then you ought not to ride in it without a front riser (which will lift it away from them) as a temporary measure whilst you get a saddler out to have a look. Do you keep him at a riding stables? If so, they may have a saddler out on a regular basis or may have one that they can recommend.

You say he was very sore earlier in life. Was that caused by a saddle? And do you know if he was treated for the soreness?

When you say it may be the rug. Do you mean you think his rug is rubbing his withers and it may not be the saddle at all? When you are sitting in the saddle, can you fit your fingers beneath the pommel or is it snug to his withers?

LadyOfWaffle · 12/01/2009 20:12

Definatly get a saddler to have a look, it'll cost more in the long run if the saddle is doing any damage. They shouldn't charge much...

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 08:44

I think he ended up on IV antibiotics before, it was poorly fitted rugs and poorly fitted saddle I think. There are a lot of white hairs in that area so it must have been pretty bad. He went to Newmarket anyway and they said to use a riser pad and the owners stopped putting rugs on, and then shortly after I took him on trial loan we got the new saddle and it was great, and of course I've just kitted him out with lovely new rugs

because I wasn't riding him myself yesterday I'm not sure if it's 100% a case of the saddle not clearing the withers, or if the seam of the stable rug has been putting pressure on there - all I know is his ears are suddenly going back at the sight of tack, and the instructor seemed concerned yesterday

anyway, better go and camp outside the saddlery until it opens

OP posts:
Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 08:46

(just seems a bit of a coincidence that he got a new stable rug last week and is only now showing signs of not being very happy about his saddle)

I wish I knew what I was doing!

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Nekabu · 13/01/2009 08:59

I think you're best off having a saddler looking at your saddle. When did you last ride him?

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 11:10

saddler can't come out until next Weds (£36, could be worse) but I got a prolite adjustable pad thing (you put in/take out foam things until it's right, will probably come in handy the older he gets as his shape is unlikely to improve vastly with age is it?)

it's not his actual wither area, it's a tiny bit further along his back - his ears go right back when you touch it, right where the seam of the stable rug ends

the pad lifts it clear of that bit so it's ok for now, but the saddle itself is looking slightly flat so I'll take it into the saddlery this pm and get it looked at, maybe save myself the call out charge for Weds

god I sound obsessed and neurotic

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Nekabu · 13/01/2009 12:33

You don't sound even slightly obsessed or neurotic!

There's very little point you taking the saddle to the saddlery as it needs to fit your horse and if your horse isn't there, the saddler can't tell!

So what is the bit you touch? Is it ruffled hair? A bald bit? A sore?

Also, his shape will not change with age (until he gets old when he may have a sunken back as quite a lot of oldsters do) but will change with what weight he is and whether he is building up muscle along his back (topline) which is related to how he is being worked.

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 12:44

it's just a bony bit, no ruffled hair or anything - I'm taking the saddle in because the previous owner is adamant that it's adjustable, if it is and we can adjust it then all will be well and I can cancel the call out thing

if not, no harm done

except I seem to be stuck here at the computer instead of out there in the real world . . .

(when I examined it this morning though it did look a bit flat - do synthetic saddles have a proper tree in them? it might even be damaged)

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Nekabu · 13/01/2009 12:51

You mean his spine? Is the bit you're talking about noticably raised from the rest of his spine? Is it near his withers or in the middle of his back?

The previous owner will be talking about the tree and that is not the only thing that will make a saddle fit or not. For example, if the gusset is too narrow then it will rest on the spine and all the adjusting of trees in the world won't fix that. If the tree can be adjusted and it is the tree that needs altering, then it will need someone experienced to do that and, from what you've said, I suspect a saddler will be needed.

Pixel · 13/01/2009 14:45

If it's 'adjustable' in the same way as my Wintec (another synthetic) you will be able to adjust the tree by buying a different-sized plate to go inside it. This is one reason we went for the Wintec for our youngster as the fitter (master saddler of many years experience) said at the rate he was growing, a leather saddle would have to be replaced in 6 months. We have replaced the first plate for a wider one already, cost £15 so won't break the bank!
Personally, In your shoes I'd still get the saddler to look at the horse to be on the safe side, especially if he has a history of problems, and then if it's just a case of changing the plate they can probably do it for you there and then. Make sure it's a good one though. A girl at our field has been having problems with her first pony and our instructor didn't think the saddle looked right. The girl thought it should be fine because she had had it fitted by a local 'tack shop' but that maybe the stuffing had got a bit flat so got it checked by an expert. Surprise, master saddler says the saddle has never fitted the pony!

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 16:30

I'm really confused (not by you lot, by my self) saddle has already been adjusted as far as possible according to bloke in shop (who is a master saddler)

they'll check it out on him and see whether a bit of reflocking or something will help

but have horrible feeling am going to need a new saddle which absolutely can't afford immediately

and have not helped myself by agreeing to a time when I can't actually be there

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Nekabu · 13/01/2009 17:01

Sorry to keep asking questions but when you say the saddle's been adjusted as far as possible, do you mean you took it in today and the saddler said that? If so, it could be that your horse doesn't need it at that far end adjustment but somewhere in between. You're not really going to know until the saddler has seen it on your horse. If you can't be there when he/she comes over to check your saddle, do you have someone you can trust to be there for you? The saddler will want to see the saddle on your horse and for him to be ridden in it (unless it is obvious it doesn't fit).

If you do have to have a new saddle it need not be all doom and gloom. a) it's a hell of a lot cheaper than trying to sort out a horse with a bad back and pain related/remembered issues and b) you can sell your existing one on Ebay or see if you can do a trade in with the saddler. Also, if you can ask the saddler which saddle should fit your horse (and he should have a selection with him that you can try) then you can try to go for another synthetic which are usually cheaper than leather.

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 13/01/2009 21:40

no no I really appreciate your thoughts and help with this!

I'd better rearrange the appointment for when I can be there, it's adjusted as far as possible as in the insert things (it did take them after all) are all already in (to narrow the gullet if I'm making sense) - the prolite thing is working a treat though, rode him again tonight for an hour's lesson and he was very happy.

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Nekabu · 13/01/2009 21:47

Good luck with the saddler. It may be that the saddle (with the gullet on the narrowest fitting) is too narrow for him and he needs it wider but with the riser to lift it away from the withers. But then again, he may not so it's just as well you have the saddler coming out as it could be anything or (with a bit of luck!) nothing! That's good news that the prolite riser is working so you can ride him whilst waiting to find out about the saddle! How long have you had him and what type is he?

KingCanuteIAm · 13/01/2009 21:52

It is odd that it is sitting on a bony bit further back - usually it would sit on the withers or (if in extreme need of re-flocking) the spine either 1/3 or 2/3s of the way along the saddle length. It sounds like you are sure it is not his spine that it is sitting on...

Could it be that the flocking has bunched or gone hard in a spot that is impacting on his muscles to each side of his spine?

If that is the case then he could be arching his back to try to relieve it. This would cause him to strain his muscles along his topline and could pull his spine out of alingment (like we do if we sit drop shouldered all the time).

It could also be the the rug is putting pressure on the area making it sore then you take the rug off and he has an "oh thank goodness for that" moment - then you come at him with a saddle.. it may be just that he associates the pain with the saddle (from past experience) and has not worked out that it is the rug causing it this time...

Can you see clearly through the gunnel of the saddle when it is fitted with a tightened girth? What happens when someone mounts? Look through from the front and the back.

When his rug is on does it crease slightly across the shoulder (from the neck)? This is a sign of it being too tight. Do you use an elasticated surcingle? These can cause pressure points.

Wish I had my copies of Horse Sense handy

KingCanuteIAm · 13/01/2009 21:54

That should be "does the rug crease (from the neck towards the thigh)..."

Loshad · 13/01/2009 22:49

If you've any chance I'd change the time to when you can be there. Does the fitter coming out carry S/hand ones as well? I am currently using s/hand dressage and jumping saddles on my mare as she muscled up and changed shape when i was very short of spare cash. Just took a few phone calls to various saddlers to see if they kept plenty of s/hand stock - got them from two different sadlers and took her over to them for fitting. Apologies if you've already done this but would also suggest visit from an equine physio or similar if you think the saddle hasn't been fitting properly - your lad may have been able to compensate for it not fitting well until his new rug was causing additional pressure.

Original poster
mysterymoniker · 14/01/2009 08:06

"It could also be the the rug is putting pressure on the area making it sore then you take the rug off and he has an "oh thank goodness for that" moment - then you come at him with a saddle.. it may be just that he associates the pain with the saddle (from past experience) and has not worked out that it is the rug causing it this time..."

that's what I wonder! it's such a coincidence otherwise.

I've asked them to bring some secondhand ones - you know I just assumed the one he came with was the right stuff for him, now it seems a bit stupid to have thought that. Maybe it's never really fitted him properly. Do want the back man to have a look at him anyway, next time there's a few others needing him, he seems to come quite often.

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Original poster
mysterymoniker · 16/01/2009 19:41

woohoo!

we are reflocked and clearing the spine fully - my position is about 873 million times better already, what a difference (and only £61)

the only downside is that I put the red fish things in my pocket and I keep 'answering' them every time my phone rings . . .

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