Should we keep looking or use an agent to find DC's horse

[MrPickles73]

DC sold her horse of 2.5yrs a month ago. Horse was great in all ways but not 'honest' over show jumps and even more fickle over xc which led to alot of frustration for yr 11DC. We had heaps of lessons, schooling etc.. it just wasn't to be..

We have been looking for a new horse for about a month. We've tried 7 or 8 so far. The last we thought great and had her vetted but the vetting has turned into a bit of a fiasco. The seller (a dealer who imports from Ireland) lives beyond where our vet would travel to. I tried various vets and end up with one which comes highly recommended but has worked for the seller before but never seen this horse before.
Horse was vetted on Friday. I was working so my husband took DC. Despite really liking the horse both came away with a negative impression of the result of the vetting..

• horse had come over from Ireland in less than ideal condition. Seller has been feeding her up for 2-3 months so horse is improving but she is unfit, lacking muscle (age 6) and feet are not where they should be for age 6 but should improve with time
• horse has old girls injury on leg
• horse was very unhappy when vet picked out front feet and hopping all over the place. Seller had to hold the horse and practically twitch it so vet could proceed. That said horse had previously been fine with leg being held up for flexion test.. so a bit confusing

Prior to vetting vet's admin said don't buy the horse til you get the vetting report and said we do everything in writing, no phonecall after the vetting. The horse was declared sound at the end of the vetting..

Vet said they would send report first thing Saturday morning.. I received nothing so phoned and she said he'd been out all night on an emergency call so I wouldn't get it Saturday but 'over the weekend'. Vendor is asking me about 'logistics' for the horse and keen to conclude the sale. I've explained I'm in.limbo waiting for the report..

Having really liked the horse we gradually going off it. £12000 for a horse which has no track record, field injury, possibly unhappy feet and possibly a pits to pick out it's feet? We had asked to take the horse to an arena hire 20mins from the seller but this wasn't allowed.. I just feel there are too many unknowns now ..

If we don't buy this one we are back to the drawing board and summer is just around the corner.. I have all friends and pony club contacts with their ears to the ground for a new horse..

At what stage do I do what a couple of friends did and engage an agent for £500 and get them to do some of the running around and possibly organise us a tour to Ireland accompanied with a decent vet for something we like?

There’s too much at stake if you’re going into new horse ownership with lots of questions already - it doesn’t sound like you and your DC are confident this is the right horse. And to be honest, I think you’d be much better off looking for a horse that’s been there and done everything your teenager wants to do - that may mean looking at slightly older horses or ones with disclosed and manageable medical conditions.

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen teenagers move onto young, unproven horses and everything starts unraveling and that’s before you throw exam stress etc into the mix. You do have to be careful with agents as some may be working with ‘preferred’ sellers and you might not be getting genuine advice. A couple of friends have gone down the agent route but it’s cost them a lot more than £500 - it’s usually been 10% of the purchase price.

I’m not convinced going to Ireland and getting a youngster is the right route either - it’s a bit cheaper but not much when you factor importing into account. Does your dc really have the skills, experience and support to bring on a young, inexperienced horse? When we were looking for DD’s next horse when her old pony club horses needed to step down we ended up seeing at least 10 and for the first few months of owning her mare I regularly wondered what the hell we’d got ourselves into. Luckily dd started an apprenticeship on an eventing yard, taking her mare with her and with constant support she managed to turn things around and they had a wonderful partnership but if she’d been struggling on a standard livery yard it could have ended very badly.

I wouldn't take the risk with this horse.

You'd be extremely lucky to find the right horse at this time of the year. With an eleven year old you don't want that kind of palava on the ground.

I would use a trusted agent but they will have a list of people looking for the same as you. You might have to resign yourself to finding something that is going to be sold at the end of the summer.

I think you are going down completely the wrong route looking at unknown 6 year olds that have just been shipped over from Ireland. That’s all very well if you’re running several horses at a time so if one doesn’t work out it’s not the end of the world, but if this is your daughters only horse the stakes are too high. Don’t rush into buying something just because your daughter has nothing to ride for summer. Could you look into leasing to tide you over?

I read it as year 11 so around 16? Does dd love this horse? Sounds like a lot of negatives. How thoroughly did she try it ridden? Did she pick out feet etc on viewing? Some of these irish horses can be pretty nervous of strangers, especially men and haven’t always had the groundwork done if they have come off a hill in to sales. I know a few looking atm and the market is pretty bare. I’d definitely at least expect an negotiation on price for the undisclosed injury

yes she's 16

We left trialling it feeling confident we'd found a lovely horse that would do what she wants but the vetting has eroded that confidence and now we have serious doubts.. I honestly can't remember whether we lifted it's feet or not at the trial.. but usually it's something we do. I did ask about injuries and the seller deffo said not that I know of.

I'm still holding out for the vet's report for the final decision..

But if this doesn't work out it would be sad to go all summer with no horse having struggled through the winter.. two friends have used agents and found nice horses.. I'm not sure what our other options are tbh. I'm a bit tired of the unsuccessful trailing around..

But youre right it would be her only horse so whilst it doesn't have to be all singing all dancing this summer it can't be a total dud..

If we look for something that's older then the cost is out of budget and also we have a younger sibling.. Some of these eventing ponies / horses are £25k+ for something with a cv

Which is why you should be looking at quite a bit older - unless it’s a really top flight horse then a 15/16 year old will be a lot better value. You need to be looking for something that’s doing the job your daughter wants right now - she doesn’t need something with the potential to go 4*, she needs a horse that knows its job at grassroots level and that will help her gain experience. If a horse has been reliably competing for several years then that’s a good sign of continuing soundness.

i personally wouldn’t buy an unproven horse that’s come from Ireland for that amount of money.

I was at a yard where the owners had done similar and spent a fortune on two horses. One had horrendous behavioural issues on the ground. In the end neither could do the job they were bought for.

Also, if you were to buy a horse without the experience that you require is your daughter confident/capable of bringing it on, or do you have someone on standby?

Our horse was a shit with my daughter but behaved for a friend that was very experienced. She was sired by Fleetwater Opposition, who apparently was like marmite. After 7 long years of trying with her we threw in the towel and sold her to a very reputable dealer we knew. I didn’t want to sell her to a member of public, she needed more schooling with knowledgeable people. She was sold to us as a good all rounder, no mention of her atrocious ground manners and we needed a Monty Roberts head collar for control, she’d quite often tank off with us 🤦‍♀️

Could your daughter not loan a horse for a while? It’s so hard trying to find the right horse, I wish you all the best in your quest, 🤗

Does your dd need a potential 25k eventing pony though? Is she wanting to do BE and champs or just local level/PC. You could also as go back, re inspect the pony. Pick up all its feet etc. make sure you’ve tried it over a variety of jumps. Lots in our pony club are buying youngsters now to produce themselves as no one can afford the price tag of anything proven and they aren’t competitive enough to need to top ponies anyway. Mine was 2k and he’s perfectly respectable- jumped round and was placed at sporting festival both eventing and showjumping. Happily goes round an 80cm hunter trial. He’s worth more now obviously but still not to type of money you are talking. He’s a fun allrounder not a world beater and we are fine with that. Are you looking for too much? Does your daughter have the experience and dedication to put the work in as loads can be learned over a summer at pony club for a green horse with a nice attitude

Yes she would like to progress to the next step which is SJ etc at 1m and qualifying for champs. So the cost is high for a been there done that. If you buy an older one quite often they have issues like melanoma / sarcoids and will be too old for the sibling (currently 12).

Actually melanomas are really only a problem for older greys and sarcoids are common in younger horses - there are many young horses getting sarcoids popping up shortly after making the trip from Ireland. The most likely medical issue with an older horses is arthritis which can often be managed successfully. Does your daughter have experience with producing young sport horses? How much support does she have? If her main experience so far is jumping her previous horse then she’d get much more from an older schoolmaster. It’s very hard to teach a young horse how to SJ/XC if you’re still learning yourself.

We have top jumping ponies (two had qualified for HOYS, one was a Nations Cup pony). My daughter is 16 and we'll be looking for someone to lease (or potentially sell) at least one of the ponies to next season and at the moment we need sharers. So if you are near North London and your daughter has nothing to ride, she can try one of ours for a share. We also take some of our sharers out competing/to XC/fun rides if they are good riders. PM me if that's of any interest.

@XelaM thankyou that's a really kind offer. Unfortunately we live 3 hours from London but it sounds as though you will find some lucky sharers!

We don't want to be taking on a horse with arthritis when we buy it obviously with age if it comes on then of course we would manage it but that is different. She had the privilege to compete a friend's horse last summer so gave her a lot more experience in the competition ring.

Beware that very expensive ponies with fantastic records usually had very very good riders riding them and they can behave completely differently (and stop performing) when ridden by someone less experienced or just a different rider. I know many examples of this. I wouldn't necessarily go for an expensive a pony with a stellar record.

Irish horses are often a bit nervy (I’ve bought two unseen fairly recently).
I think realistically you’re going to need either an absolutely massive budget, or be willing to compromise on a horse that has a quirk or is a bit older.

Id personally not bother with an agent.

Having had a browse HQ ref 408322 might fit the bill? Still a five figure horse but not £25k, looks like a nice sort for a young riders

To add there is a good BE group of Facebook called #twittereventing it might be worth posting on there for what ou are looking for

I say this kindly OP, but you’re not being realistic. You want something that is ready to have a summer of fun, not unreasonable. You want something that will give her confidence having had your previous horse. Not unreasonable. Something she can go on to do championships with - still not unreasonable. You also want said Saint to be young enough for sibling, and you don’t want something that is older as you’re worried about arthritis and the like. In which case you’re going to have to up your budget. If you can’t, you’re going to have to compromise somewhere. Either something younger and not ready to go out this summer, or something older and take a risk. My friend is selling her stunning, saintly, amazing mare. She’s a 15.3hh TBx who comfortably show jumps at 110, she’s done XC, beach rides, you could put your toddler or your gran on but she’s 18 years old and needs the extra TLC associated with that. She’s been on the market a week and has had 4 viewings this weekend and 3 made offers so said friend can be picky about which home she goes to. They’re out there but they rarely tick every box

On the agent front I’d be somewhat wary. We employed one of the “reputable” agents (that often pops up all over socials with apparently stellar testimonials) when I was looking for my last horse. He was very quick to tell me how great my budget was when he wanted the business but took umbrage when I didn’t go for the first horse he felt ticked my boxes on paper and then quickly started telling me I was unrealistic for the budget (5 figures and not looking for a world beater). The majority of horses shared with me were already on the open market/I’d already dismissed their ads. He’d regularly send me videos of horses that were not quite right, but could only suddenly see it was off when I called it out with timestamps.

My final straw was him sending me videos from a known dodgy dealer near my hometown with a horrendous track record (he wasn’t to know I’d have past knowledge as we now live several hours away). He offered every assurance under the sun about the dealer, was a personal friend so could be trusted etc etc. In the end I concluded they were a front for the dodgy dealers and praying on those with inexperience who were putting trust in the agent having their best interests at heart. Interestingly on a HHO thread about agents I found I was not alone in having this experience with said agent.

More curiously the agent in question now seems to have their own sales yard with every horse being named after a drink (or at least they were when I last looked). Perhaps it was just fluke to have found all these horses with similarly themed names, but the cynic in me found it odd that all these horses had had a rebrand as soon as they got to his yard, especially as a lot of them were apparent paragons of virtue in their teens 🤔

Our been there done everything horse is now 27! Bought at 15. If they’ve lived mostly out age is less of an issue.

@NormaNormalPants was that an agent whose first name begins with B by any chance? A friend of mine used him a couple of years ago - the horse she bought was beautiful but completely unsuitable and was sold on again a few months later - all in all not a great experience for her or the horse.

^ This. You may find a unicorn, but it is likely to take a lot more than 7 or 8 viewings, with or without an agent, unless someone you know and trust is selling.

The horse market is tough, and it is "buyer beware/only ever spend what you can afford to lose" under normal circumstances. But it is even worse at the moment. Prices are shooting up and are sustained, and to get a horse to the stage where it is safe, competitive and experienced takes hours, days, months and years of work so I can understand why. Either up your budget, or keep looking. From what you describe unless your DD loves this horse inside out, it is unlikely to be the right one. Someone once said to me - if you can only afford one horse, to only buy horses that make you smile.

Best of luck.

I agree with all of this. You would be taking a huge risk with this horse and it would be much better to keep looking for something more suitable here.

Given your limited budget, I would consider an older horse, maybe with manageable health conditions, as there are a huge number of horses that wouldn't get a completely clean vetting that can still compete at a reasonable level.

The most important factor is that you know what you're getting, and it sounds like the Irish horse has issues that have not been fully explained.

It looks like we have landed something to lease for the summer which is the perfect solution.

On the agent front another family from pony club are currently in Ireland with an agent another family has already used so fingers crossed for them. Agreed I've had enough of dealers..