Full Livery Turnout

[Moaning5]

I have a horse on full livery and this has been our first winter at this yard. They only do full livery.
In early summer she was out 24/7 until Nov once the fields got muddy, then in 24/7.
From this Feb due to the unseasonably dry weather, they’re back out 24/7 and that’s what it’s looking like now for the next 7 months.

I’ve always had mine in at night except the height of summer. I’ve always thought full livery (no riding) was to include bringing in/putting out & muck out daily. I would prefer her in at night but I’m never asked.

Should I be grateful I’m on a yard that maximises turnout in this way ?

It doesn't sound great, I wouldn't like the being in 24/7 in winter (seriously no turnout at all for 3-4 months and potentially longer if a wet winter? Do they walk the horses or do anything to exercise them or do they stand in a box for 23 hours a day and only out to be ridden?). Even if then out 24/7 the rest of the time I still wouldn't like it, it must stress the horses out and they aren't to know summer is around the corner. I'd rather they were in overnight for longer but still get at least some daytime turnout in the winter months. Our grazing is pretty poor around here and they are in overnight in winter but aside from really extreme weather they do get at least a few hours out a day, and that's the bare minimum for me...

The in 24/7 would really bother me which is why I can't find a good livery yard!

Being in 24/7 for 4 months is a welfare issue as far as I’m concerned. I’d be looking to move asap

Why do you want her in at night?

When they’re in they get time on the Walker in the morning, and I either ride or lunge every day.
It wasn’t 4 months solid they had no turnout - there were a few days when the fields were frosty when they were turned out, but it was just the odd half day.
I didn’t like it but she did settle into the routine as she does like being in.

I like her in at night especially when it’s muddy, I don’t like them standing in mud, plus she’s fully clipped.

The yard sounds a bit lazy. I’d not want my clipped horse out yet. But it’s great that they get plenty of turn out in general. What are you paying for this full service?

It’s expensive for the area as it has nice facilities. I suppose it bothers me because I’m paying for Full, when it’s clear I could do it myself DIY if she’s going to be out 24/7 most of the year.

Horses prefer to be out I think with good facilities. Question is how well are they set up for being out - shelter/ stoned areas etc...

Issues around the winter turnout aside, many yards have a 'rule' that if you want full livery in winter you have to pay full livery costs all year around, even if they are out 24/7 in summer and in overnight in winter and so you are getting 'more for your money' in winter with mucking out, bringing out and in and so on plus bedding, hay and feed - otherwise many people would swap between DIY/grass livery in summer and full in winter (although it's not no work at all when they're out at grass, the fields still need weeding, poo picking, fences maintained and so on, water needs to be topped up and sometimes hay brought in, horses need checking twice daily for injuries and so on). But even though there's less work to do in summer they still need to pay their staff wages, business rates and so on so costs don't go down all that much. Or other yards allow you to switch between the two but full livery is usually then more expensive to compensate compared to if in effect the full year's costs are averaged out across the whole year. This might be the system your yard is running OP, or can you check with them if you are allowed to swap to DIY for the summer only, in which case if you can manage on this it would probably be worth doing? Or does your yard only offer full?

Sorry, you do say in your first post they only do full. That is a bit annoying TBH and since it's your horse and you are paying full livery year round I don't think it's unreasonable to ask if she can come in overnight - although by summer time the fields should be perfectly dry so nicer for her to be out 24/7 then?

It’s the staying in part that would bother me most as IMO they need to be out as much as possible . We have a pony on full livery , but have before they passed away , had 3 horses on full at a variety of yards and the variation in standards was mind boggling . Our pony is out during the day all year and in at night all year , which suits her well . What are you paying when the horse is out 24/7 and what do you get for the money .

I agree with maximum turnout where possible - 24/7 in summer and as much of Spring and autumn too. I just feel like 24/7 up to November and then again from Feb is pushing it.
I would prefer what I’ve had on other yards - out in day 8 until 4ish and rest the field at night. When it’s been this arrangement, the horses at least have some turnout every day even in deepest winter.

Wouldn’t that look after the fields better and be better for the horses ?

Horses being stabled with no turnout in winter is a welfare issue.
It is so cruel to lock sociable athletic herd animals, that naturally walk for miles daily, up in small individual stalls.
All horses should have daily turnout and 24/7 in a suitable environment with friends, forage and shelter is by far the best for them mentally and physically.

Interesting I find that out 24 hrs doesn't wreck fields as much as I thought when they have optional shelter and stoned hay areas. I realise not all yards will offer this but the ritual of bringing in and turning out and the exciting nature of being turned out mean there is much more running around generally than in a settled turned out herd. For instance, as is common when I am, keeping them in for weeks and field recovers but they go absolutely bonkers when out again. I do think that long term t/o needs proper facilities to work well though like stoned trough areas / shelter etc and needs investment to work well. If the yard offers this then the t/o those months is fine IMO. If fields are poo picked/ harrowed/ rotated/ horses checked then its still work which it is reasonable to charge for. So Q is how well is yard investing in their t/o, very few do in though my experience which leads to the trashed fields, not the fact that horses are on them.

This.

I know it's the gold standard of natural horse care and not readily available when land is expensive or scarce but 24/7/365 on a track system with open shelter - manmade or from dense trees - is fantastic for the horses. Not always for the humans!!

@Eyesopenwideawake I have so many questions about track systems - mainly, why are they so different to fields that have similar elements in ?
All our fields are too wet in winter for 24/7 turnout. Even with hard standing near gates and troughs they end up knee deep in mud and looking miserable !

@CountryCob Good point about hareing round when first turned out, especially if they’ve been in for a bit.

@Moaning5 - they don't have to be complicated. Imagine a square field. All you have to do to create an environment where horses will move naturally is to put a smaller square within the larger one and dot hay around the track between the two fences. That's what we started with, we've been able to expand it over the last few years but the principle is the same - allow the horses to forage bits of food and keep them moving.