Bullying instructor or am I too sensitive? adult new rider

Agree with others that this doesn't sound good, you must change instructors, whether or not it's bullying is almost by the bye, lessons are meant to be enjoyable and if you don't feel happy or like you are progressing with this instructor then it just isn't working for you, no further justification (to yourself or others) needed.

Sadly there is a lot of really poor customer service out there amongst riding schools (a lot seem to think of it as them giving a privilege to their oh-so-lucky clients to kindly 'allow' them to shell out £££ to ride their horses, rather than it being the clients that enable them to keep those horses in the first place) plus some really poor teaching practice, not just from older/'old school' teachers but youngsters that have recently been through their PTT so should in theory know better (but I guess are largely guided by what they see around them). I think part of the problem is that a lot of instructors are very good riders who teach to fund or enable their other riding endeavours, rather than really wanting to/enjoying teaching per se, hence the attitude that clients are an irritating but necessary inconvenience that a lot have. And if you are yourself an excellent rider, particularly one who has been riding since a tot and so can't really remember what it's like to be a beginner, it can actually hamper your ability to teach the basics unless you really put the effort in to learning how to do it well. But on the plus side there are also very many excellent instructors who really see teaching well as a skill or art in itself, you just sometimes have to seek these ones out and trial and error several different people until you find 'the one' that you really click with, what works for some in terms of style and manner doesn't work for everyone so you need to get over any awkwardness of rejecting the ones you don't like until you find the one you do (bit like dating really!).

Contrary to many I do think group classes can work well for novices but only if the group is a good fit and the teacher able to adapt the pace to differing abilities and confidence levels within the group. Plus I do think at some schools group lessons seem to be treated as less of a priority than privates (possibly because they are less profitable for the school or maybe they are harder work for the teacher so less popular with the more experienced/in demand staff) and so they don't always get the best teachers and horses and access to space and so on. So you may find it better to book privates at least at first, and then when you find a good instructor you can ask if they run any suitable groups at a time that suits you rather than starting with the group. A share horse is also a good goal to work towards although you do probably need a few more lessons first, even with a very quiet horse than just potters around I would personally like you to be fully confident in walk, trot and canter with a good independent seat, just because even the most bombproof novice-friendly horse can on occasion do an accidental canter (as you've found!) or a little spook or sudden 'emergency stop' particularly when adjusting to a new rider whose aids may not be 100% what they're used to, and obviously with a share you'll be riding on your own without a teacher there to help so you'd need to confident how to deal with these things and not panic or fall off! Good luck!

Agree with everything said above. And I think age doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the quality of the instructor. At my daughter's riding school the most amazing instructor is middle-aged and quite a few of the younger instructors are shouty. It's more of a personal preference which stule of teaching you click with.

I'd say its very important to learn to balance correctly, how to use your seat and grip with lower legs instead of thighs

You shouldn’t be “gripping” with the leg at all, they should be long and relaxed. Think about it- if you grip with the lower leg the horse is going to interpret that as the signal to go forward- you should only be applying pressure with the lower leg when you want the horse to do something.

[quote ElectraBlue]@JustWonderingIfYou I have been happy in the walk without stirrups and have done it many times.

The problem was that we have never even really gone through the basic of sitting trot in the lessons before, so to suddenly decide to do it without stirrups seemed a bit odd to me.

I only learned to do rising trot correctly about two months ago and can now do it with ease but we have hardly spent any time at all on sitting trot, I just picked up what assumed was a sitting trot but I probably don't do it correctly...

To me the logical thing would be to spend at least one group lesson going through sitting trot for everyone with the stirrups on so we know what the correct technique and position are and then start experimenting with no stirrups the following weeks. :)

Then the instructor initially said 'hold on to the saddle if you are slipping' only to tell me that I should not be holding to the saddle 1o minutes later...I am not going to take an unnecessary fall if I can void it.

Anyway I will make sure that in my next one to one lesson I spend time getting the sitting trot technique right.[/quote]
In a weird way though, taking away your stirrups does help with the sitting trot so although your instructor was certainly lacking in her technique/explanation I can see why she did that (although to acknowledge LastQueen's point earlier in the thread it's also not the kindest on the horses' backs and mouthes so that's another point against it).

To get sitting trot right you need to deepen your seat, stop any gripping with the knees or swinging of the lower leg or clutching of the hand, whatever you are doing to balance yourself (although this is easier said that done when you feel wobbly and as though you are going to be bounced off so it takes a bit of letting go of what your brain is desperately telling you to do ) and really 'feel' the movement of the horse and move 'as one' with it. You sort of need to turn into a very relaxed almost jelly like state where you absorb the motion of the horses back going up and down rather than bracing against it and letting it bounce you around. Many people find it's actually easier to find the 'feel' of this when you aren't balancing yourself using the stirrups, and also when you first practice sitting trot a lot of people draw their heels up, this means they inevitably lose one or both stirrups, often panic and block the horses movement or swing their legs around trying to get it back so taking away the stirrups altogether is not the worst thing in that its then one less thing to worry about (for this reason personally I would teach sitting trot on a lunge line as then the rider doesn't have to worry about keeping the horse going or what their reins are doing or anything, but obviously that's not possible in a group format. Certainly I'd say it's fine to hold the saddle or a neckstrap until you feel balanced unless the horse is veering off path and you need the reins to steer, ask your new teacher but I would start holding on with both hands, then take one hand off and hold it out to the side or on top of your head whilst maintaining the sitting trot, then swap it for the other hand, then take both hands off - although don't drop the reins and put both hands on your head unless someone else has hold of your horse ).

But I do 100% agree that sitting trot with or without stirrups is a hard thing to learn and needs proper explanation/demonstration not just an 'off you go', in short some proper teaching which this instructor certainly seemed to lack!

Your instructor sounds awful and reminds me of one who worked in the riding school where my DD learned.

She used to shout and bellow. And if the child couldn’t get the pony to trot within 6 seconds they had to stand in the middle.

I was once offering encouragement to the pony from the seating area and she bloody well shouted at me 😱

Last time she tried that.

There are ways of improving beginners positions without a technique that 99/100 Times sees them hanging off their horses face for balance. I think while I can help riders (though for most I think just gets them to tense up) I think it’s often really unfair on the horses.

If we really want to be fair to the horses, we ought to be teaching people to sit in trot and ride without stirrups on simulators first.

I'm a big fan of no stirrups work, provided the horse is strong, smooth and balanced and the rider is ready and capable of it. And, of course, as with everything, it should be introduced gradually, with appropriate help (holding saddles / neckstraps) and begun in short bursts. I learned to ride bareback mostly, in the good old days before health and safety

I'm surprised people are so against no stirrup work for beginners. I know a girl who learned to ride abroad and all children are made to ride without stirrups for a long time before they get to ride with stirrups. She said it improved her seat enormously and in 10 years she has never fallen off a horse (which is pretty insane - I don't know any rider who has never fallen off a horse). This makes me think there are great benefits to no stirrups. My own daughter rides without stirrups/bareback very often

In the old days of the pony club it was acceptable to tell a child to stop crying and just f*king jump it, but now it is not. All coaches are trained to be positive as it is now accepted that positive reinforcement works better than criticism. That isn’t to say faults shouldn’t be corrected but better to encourage than discourage.

Your instructor is a dinosaur and clearly has had no instruction herself recently. Find someone who you enjoy working with and you feel good about your lesson after, it’s supposed to be fun after all.

A lot of riding instruction over seas is much slower than here - months and months in walk for example! Wouldn’t wash here I’d not think.

This makes me think there are great benefits to no stirrups

There are huge benefits to working without stirrups, nobody has said there aren’t.

The issue is putting an adult beginner on a riding school horse and taking away stirrups at trot, when they’ve barely done any trot, is only going to lead to them using the reins to balance, therefor damaging the horses mouth, or banging around on the horses back, which again is no good for the horse. It’s also going to shake any confidence the rider has.

Kids are lighter and don’t have the weight to hang off a mouth or bang around on a back the same way.

If I had my way as an instructor, beginners would learn in walk, for weeks and months. Learn without stirrups, learn how to make the horse go forward. Trot and canter on a lunge, no reins, no stirrups. Neck straps at all times if needed- the school I taught at put neckstraps on all lesson horses, even relatively advanced.

You do have to balance that against the fact that for most beginner recreational riders walking feels boring, and they feel that progression is going faster. So you have to keep some excitement and feeling of achievement. Same as any sport, those doing it for fun don’t need to spend the hours refining technique and practicing basics that those intending a career or a future.

sitting trot no stirrups is a really good way to improve your seat and get a feel for the horse, but ideally get a half hour lunge lesson. That way you're not concentrating on also guiding the horse and the horse is guided by the person lunging. Your instructor sounds diabolical though, definitely move

That sounds really positive - I hope it goes well!

Well done OP!

I also would hate for someone to shout at me and definitely wouldn't respond well to being constantly told off. Maybe it's an age thing, as my daughter's favourite instructor is pretty harsh. His reaction to a recent fall was "Did I tell you to come off?!? Get back on!" She found it hilarious and said she prefers it to the "nicer" instructors who would make more of a fuss. Masochistic I tell you

"Did I tell you to come off?!? Get back on!"

Haha, flashback to childhood lessons! My first instructor was in his 80s and had ridden in the army so was pretty strict

Yes, your instructor is a bully. From east London I would try heading out to yards in Essex. However, Park Lane Stables, formerly based in Teddington, do have a lovely ethos. They're currently in Richmond and accessible by tube or train. Alternatively, see if you can get out for an intensive riding holiday somewhere like Wellington Riding in Hampshire. Not sure about public transport to get there but for a one-off holiday I expect you could work round that.

I wouldn’t use an instructor who did loads or indeed any no stirrup work with novices. All it does is make people tense, and it’s shit for the horses as they just have their mouths hung off and backs bounced in. It’s not a method I rate at all except for very balanced riders and in short bursts.

It's standard and for very good reason as it's one of the best ways of deepening your seat. However, it needs to be taught properly and preferably without reins at all. Any bouncing and you need to come back down to walk, rebalance yourself and start again. It's better on the lunge rather than in a group situation. Or better still, on a mechanical horse.

I also would hate for someone to shout at me and definitely wouldn't respond well to being constantly told off. Maybe it's an age thing, as my daughter's favourite instructor is pretty harsh. His reaction to a recent fall was "Did I tell you to come off?!? Get back on!

It does depend. You can shout (especially in a dressage arena where sometimes volume is needed) and say things like that but if it’s done with humour it can be very different than if it’s meant nastily. I’d find that funny if said in the right way.

My dd doesn’t like “nice” instructors. She wants to be told how to improve and given corrections. There’s a massive difference between a bully and a teacher who can make things fun but still hold high standards.

I started riding again after a huge long break at 54. I noticed the difference in my body and muscle memory from when I had last ridden a couple of times in my 40’s. We do take longer to learn new things and of course there are confidence issues, that’s normal we don’t bounce very well! I found riding 16+ hand horses so different to a 14.2 for example. I live in France and so many school teachers etc shout but not once in the 2 different riding centre’s that I go to, have I ever encountered any riding instructor like you have. I am so sorry. It must be awful for you to be treated like this whilst trying to do something you love. How bloody dare she in fact! You are a paying client and deserve some respect. I’d speak to her and ask her why she feels she can talk to you this way. If you don’t get any joy I’d complain to the owner. This is not normal nor acceptable. It sounds like you are doing really well; after all you stayed on when your horse went into an unplanned canter!

Something I found that really helped was watching you tube videos like my riding success with Natasha Althoff, Horse class, Horse and Country TV, and so many more. They explain movements etc that quite often the instructors don’t necessarily have time to explain in a full class of pupils. Maybe think about having private lessons as you’ll learn so much more when it’s just you.

"Did I tell you to come off?!? Get back on!"

I've definitely said that to students But nobody could ride with me without getting on with my twisted sense of humour. Tone is everything, too, that could be quite mean, or it could be funny depending on how it's said.