How to manage a forward going pony with no manners

[pmtcangotohell]

Hey guys. Have recently been riding a 12:1 pony who was sold as child's pony. At this current point she is not for a child.

She is very forward going. Will literally jog the entire ride if you let her, will eventually slow down to a walk for a bit but not long.

Will not turn if she really doesn't want too. Took her out today and she would not go down a certain way. Point blanked refused if you try and turn her she just goes off on one and will try and go the direction she wants to go to the point I have to her off and lead her.

First time we tried to canter her, she had me off within 5 mins. Thank god she's small.

Lunges like a dream though.

Any ideas on how we can improve her manners and selective hearing and her her to turn the way I want her to do without the drama.

Sorry she's 13:1

If she lunges but isn't keen on being ridden are there pain or tack issues?
Is she ok in the school? Is it just the excitement of the hack out?
Feet and teeth check?

Feet and teeth check fine, she's only ok in the school being lunged if I'm not on her. She wanted me off yesterday but after 10 minutes of no rider lunging and a bit of drama she settled down. Hack wise it may just be excitement,it's not nasty but when she doesn't want to do something (always turning) she just will not do it. But the constant jogging is getting tiresome

She will also at times just not stop, which can also be problematic for obvious reasons

I wouldn’t canter a jogging horse when out hacking until it learns to walk properly. Don’t excite her try and get her to walk everywhere until stops. Lunge her and get her really responsive to your voice, when mine gets excited (I’ve spent years riding excitable horses with jogging tendencies see my user name) I say “slow” “walk” in a very long quiet drawn out voice and rub his withers, I ride everywhere on a very long rein and avoid shortening the reins if they try and jog (I know it’s a natural instinct to shorten the reins) just sit calmly and talk to them and am a very chilled rider.
If she won’t go somewhere never give in, (assuming you’re not in traffic) sit there, keep her looking at where you wants her to go, if she tries turns away turn her in a very tight circle three or four times and end up facing the way you want to go, be firm and positive but not aggressive, use your voice, make looking where you want her to go and then going that way more comfortable that’s turning away. I know it’s easy to get off and lead her but this should be a last resort.

Is she getting enough work? Friend's Welsh really benefits from a blast along the gallops every week.

Schooling will help too. Lots of changes of pace/transitions/school figures to get her listening to the aids.

Carry a whip too and use it to back up your aids.

Reacting to turning makes me think pain.
Saddlery and vet check.

Pain. Get the physio out.

Thanks for all the reply's, am not going to canter whilst out as she does need to start listening. We are lunging her to make her think and she generally does really well. I am riding her very loosed rein. Will get her checked for anything that maybe causing her pain. But I do think it's just stubbornness

Not turning to one side is never just stubbornness. Ours needed lots of physio and is now much looser and his behaviour has improved hugely.

I agree - get physio out for a full check. Once that's resolved get saddle checked.

Once that's sorted - is she on 24/7 turnout? Getting too much feed? Not enough work?

Once you've stripped everything back to basics, it might be worth investing in some schooling livery. Some ponies do learn that they can get away with murder.

"Some ponies do learn that they can get away with murder."
Assuming no health problems I wonder of this is part of the cause of your problems.
My ex race horse started napping a bit, like you I've only been riding him for a short time. Race horse don't do anything on their own, always with others so you are completely going against everything they've ever learnt. I mainly hack out alone, and I think he slightly lost his confidence, we were going somewhere new nearly every time I hacked him out and I think it was starting to worry him I could feel he was getting anxious, he hadn't quite developed enough trust in me to be sure that when I say everything is fine, that wheely bin isn't going to eat you I was right. But also having now settled down with me I think he was partly testing me out as well, because they're were times when he didn't feel anxious and I felt he was thinking what can I get away with here? Do I really have to leave my mates out on all that lovely grass and go out on my own? I just kept going out, every day I never gave in and I avoided places and things that I know particularly worry him, a house with a really weird gate, a particular turning that's opposite the field where his mates live so he was going way from them, a lane with a drain cover that for some weird reason scared him 1/2 to death! It lasted a week and a half, now he's stopped this he morning happily hacked out walked past the dreaded drain cover, didn't even hesitate and is also less jumpy in general.

Thanks again for all the replies, a bit of an update. We have been working with her quite a lot lunging, hacking etc and there have been massive improvements. The jogging is now under control and will slow down to a walk when asked.

Have lunged with/without me on her and she as been brilliant, when out will now go in the direction you ask her too. But and this is a big but when we are on the return journey home she will suddenly without warning spin and face the way we come and start going back that way. She will not respond to any commands at all, and will just go. She's had me off twice now by doing this. She doesn't spook when out, absolutely nothing bothers her at all. Don't quite know how to deal with this issue as this now as the potential to become dangerous.

Do you use a neck strap even William Fox Pitt uses one and they are a normal part of a race horses tack. It gives you something to hold onto in an emergency.
Is it always in the same place? Has something frightening her you might not even be aware that something has? If yes would another sensible horse help?
If no the moment she spins and tries to go back the way she came turn her in lots and lots of very tight circles the same way she span round if you can with her nose almost touching her tail, it’s almost impossible for a horse to buck or rear doing this, don’t let her go back the way you came, you are meant to be in charge, keep going round and round four or five even six times and end up facing the way you want her to go, ask her firmly to go forward it doesn’t matter what pace as long as she’s going, if necessary give one smack with your stick and use your voice say “walk on” firmly and believe it, look where you want to go, don’t sat go forward with you legs stick body but halt with you reins think about what your hands are asking. If she spins again do the tight circles again and keep doing it until she goes forward, when she does praise her lots, rub her withers/neck horses don’t pat each other in the wild, say “good girl” you have to make going the way you want her to go the easiest option for her.

If this doesn’t work get another rider to give it a go, someone whose riding ability you respect. They may not be the most stylish or elegant or one with the most qualifications or the most rosettes. I used to know a man who specialised in foaming raving lunatics he looked like nothing on a horse, not elegant no wins a top competitions he’d never had a lesson in his life but he could sort out a raving lunatic effortlessly! He took horses from many famous names and rehabilitated then for them. If only I had an 1/8th of his ability.

Yep have a neck strap, physically cannot turn her, she literally just will not turn so she ends up going up the road gathering speed with me getting her in a kind of turn. And she'll then whip straight every time hence I then go. Never ride her out alone she goes out with the most sensible of horses. We put her in front with the other horse blocking her but still will do it. Have thought that maybe something previous may have scares her. But generally she reacts to nothing.

Never rears or bucks, will be getting someone else on her to see. Literally can't work it out. Will also try when we get to a certain point in putting the lead rope on her and then be lead by the other horse past it.

Just to add I turn her from the ground (once I'm off) and lead her for 5 minutes, get back on and she will then normally not try it again,apart from last night but we did eventually get home with no more drama. But it's the determination when she does go and the rate at to which she gathers speed.

Why wont she turn? If you shorten the reins enough physically pull her head round towards your stirrup, and then drive her forward with your legs then she'll have to turn.

I virtually had my hands by her mouth last night, and was trying to her her to turn as hard as I could but she digs in and fights against it, whilst taking off up the road

Whilst trying to move her on with my legs this just seems to infuriate her even more and makes her more determined to go the way she wants

Hmmm difficult it’s a strange thing to do with another horse present. What happens if the other horse carries on walking in the direction you want to go?
Are you on a road? Are you dodging cars as well as trying to get her to behave?
Can someone else try and ride her and see what she does?
Can you go a different route home for a while and concentrate on schooling practice moving her around the school changing the bend and doing different shapes until you’ve got her listening to you and doing what you say and continue with the lunging..
Have you tried a fullmer snaffle it might give you more control of her head.

Agreed it's a very strange thing to do with the other horse there, who's almost rolling her eyes thinking here we go again. It's a very quiet country lane that we ride down. We have literally just got that bit today and will be trying it tomorrow, will also go somewhere new tomorrow and see what happens. I am fast running out of ideas though and cannot think of a single reason as to why she does it.