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The tack room

Discuss horse riding and ownership on our Horse forum.

Some advice about potentially buying a pony needed

52 replies

mumontherun14 · 06/04/2018 18:59

Hi all. I have a horse mad DD who is 11. She has been riding for 4 years and spends every spare minute at the local stables rain, wind snow or shine knee deep in mud mucking out, feeding grooming etc. She absolutely loves it and never complains and spends 2 nights a week at the stables and 2 full days at the weekends. I currently pay for a pony loan for her where she gets to look after 2-3 ponies and rides one of them. She is getting really confident and loves jumping and galloping through the fields. She has started to ask me about the possibility of getting her own.A few people have said to me that for what we pay for the loan each month (£160) it might not be that much more for livery & feed once we've paid the upfront cost of the pony. I have said to her that we'd need to wait another year or so to continue to build up her experience and also speak to the owner at the stables to see if they'd have a suitable pony for sale or to come with us to see one which I know they would no problem. Does anyone have any other advice for things to think about? I am thinking of vets costs, shoes, feed etc and what would happen if we were away on holiday etc but on the plus side we know the stables well and the girls there and I know she would be devoted to the pony and she would get to ride whenever she wanted rather than be governed by the loan. Any tips or questions we need to ask or think about? I think she'd be looking for a pony about 15hh, youngish and with a nice nature that likes to jump. Costs from what I've seen online vary a lot and I am a bit worried I am not experienced enough to buy the right one for her so want to do as much research as we can. Thanks xxx

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 11/04/2018 13:02

It can work. It did with dd’s pony because she was a quirky mare and not to everyone’s taste. But as I said, just a suggestion.

LadyLance · 11/04/2018 13:08

It's hard to advise on livery costs, as they vary quite a bit depending on the area of the country you are in. However, for an 11yo/ young teen without experienced parents you would realistically need at least part livery (so there is someone on site able and willing to help if she gets into any difficulties) which may well cost £80+ a week. This may include bedding and hay, but if you want a specific type of bedding (e.g. dust free) this will usually cost extra.

Other regular costs:

Shoes: £60-80 every 6-8 weeks (some ponies won't need to be shod behind which will halve this cost, but most will need shoes in front if she's riding on the road).
Worming: This can vary a lot depending on how you/your yard decide to worm, but I would budget at least £20 per quarter for this.
Vaccinations: Say around £80 a year (£50 for vaccinations, plus vet call out fee. You may be able to reduce this slightly if you are able to share a call out with others on the yard)
Insurance against vet fees: £50 a month (this can be lower or a lot higher depending on the horse's medical history). Obviously this is not compulsory but vet fees can quickly grow into the thousands so it's a good idea for less experienced owners.

So as a rough estimate you are probably looking at about £350 a month just in regular costs, not including any tuition, entry fees or fun stuff. Keeping a horse can be done cheaper than this, but probably not by a teen with an inexperienced family.

On top of this you will have occasional/one off costs such as:
Horse purchase: I would budget at least £3500 for something safe and sane with a bit of experience in the things your daughter would want to do, plus transport to your yard and a vetting. You might be lucky and find something cheaper but cheap horses/ponies are often cheap for a reason.
Tack: Obviously some ponies/horses are sold with their tack but this will add to the purchase price- tack may also wear out and need replacing or mending. I'd budget at least £500 just for the basics.
Rugs: Again some ponies will come with a full wardrobe, but this is pretty rare, so I'd expect to spend at least £100-150 on rugs in the first year and again, these do break so may need fixing and occasionally replacing.
Other stuff: Depending on what the yard supplies and your daughter already has, I'd expect to spend at least £100 on miscellaneous "stuff" like feed buckets, grooming kit, yard tools etc etc.

£50 for 4 lessons a week and learning a lot about stable management is not a bad deal, and as your DD gets older she may well be able to exchange her labour for rides in other settings. When she is a bit older you could also look for a more formal share or part loan- maybe building up to a full loan when she is say 14.

Do bear in mind there are downsides to horse ownership- what if, for example, her pony goes lame and she has nothing to ride all summer? What if you buy something unsuitable that scares her and/or is unsafe? What happens if you, as a family, want to go on holiday? What if you have a sudden change in circumstances and can no longer afford the pony?

As a parent, I do think you also have to take some responsibility, learning about horse welfare, common medical problems and other issues (e.g. saddle fit)- if you are paying the bills, it will be you who gets asked, for example, "Should the horse have colic surgery or should it be put down?" and have to make that decision and justify it to your daughter.

Anyway, I hope this helps at least a bit. I was like your daughter and never had a pony of my own as a child. I still ride and have worked with horses and have been able to own as an adult when it fitted my lifestyle.

LadyLance · 11/04/2018 13:13

Sorry, the thread has moved on a bit since I wrote that post!

Re working livery- I've seen this from both sides. It can work well for people who need the support of full livery but can't afford it or a half-way step towards independent horse ownership. It works best if you have a really strict contract about how many hours the horse is used for and for what standard of rider, plus who is responsible for vet bills etc if the horse gains an injury in a specific circumstance.

There's no reason for it to be underfed, as the owner would still be in charge of the feed regime etc, and often working liveries tend not to be used for complete beginners.

That said, I do agree, a proper share would be ideal, but most share owners are reluctant to share with teens, let alone an 11yo!

DullAndOld · 11/04/2018 13:31

I know of a rather well marketed riding venue in the south east where the RSPCA came about the feeding regime of the ponies.
One Livery horses hoof fell off from standing in shit.
riding school ponies were not brushed before tacking up.
I am mentioning no names obviously.
Just take any riding school owner and their spiel with a massive pinch of salt.
I have worked in several and so has my daughter.

kingjofferyworksintescos · 11/04/2018 13:52

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet as I have only skimmed though the thread , but there are riding schools and riding schools , they vary enormously in standards as do Instructors with the same qualifications, £50 per week for 4 lessons plus lots of hands on experience sounds like a bargain in this day and age (not to mention 2 full days of child care ) if she's happy and has made friends why change ? At 11 she should be enjoying her lessons, learning whilst having safe fun.

LadyLance · 11/04/2018 14:26

DullandOld I do agree that you get welfare issues in all sorts of yards, including riding schools, and that particular case sounds awful. However, it is not the norm, and obviously people should check any yard where they are going to be leaving a horse in the care of others (working, part or full livery). I have also worked in yards including a riding school, so I am aware of potential issues- however I would say the majority of riding schools don't have welfare issues like the kind you describe.

Equally, I am aware of a yard (technically not a riding school as they were running without a license) where there were welfare and safety issues- ultimately resulting in a horrible injury to someone I knew. However I don't think it's fair to tar all riding schools with the brush of the worst yard I know!

I also agree with kingjoffery that at 11, part of the £50 is going towards childcare/supervision during the time she is up at the yard.

poddige · 11/04/2018 14:48

OP I used to work at the yard to pay for my pony when I was a teen - not pay for the privilege!

I worked every weekend, after school and in the holidays and got my livery free. I also helped in the riding school with the lead reign ponies, and up at the kennels & cattery that was part of the same business when they were short.

Same as your DD, we had a great friendship group up there and we did it for years and years, but I definitely didn't shell out £50 a week as well!

DullAndOld · 11/04/2018 14:49

hum yes it's true - I was a 'helper' and if we did two days, we got a free ride. No cash exchange at all. The 'helpers' ride' was a right laugh as well.

MissMarplesKnitting · 11/04/2018 14:58

I'd hang fire yet.

I was pony mad, and continued to be during my teenage years, getting my first pony at 15. He was everything and even came to uni with me until I got a job that needed travel and I have non horsey parents so he was sold and I think my heart broke.

However, definitely consider a share or part ownership or even a loan pony. Something about 14hh and sensible. Probably 8-10 years old, and great in box and on the road. They are like gold dust. Maybe a Connemara cross if she likes jumping. Connie's are good doers and tend to be enthusiastic about jumping too. Most I've met are sane and sensible too.

mumontherun14 · 11/04/2018 15:01

Thanks for the replies. I think from reading all the replies we are both too inexperienced at the moment for ownership. She does have a real passion but needs to learn more and build her experience.

I feel that the riding school she is at is more of a farmlike set up, family run and when I compare the costs for what she gets to do there and how much time she spends there -it is still cheaper than the other local yard but it is more professional. My head would like to move her to the new yard for her own development (but they currently have Strangles so may not be the right time to go between the two yards???) but her heart is definitely with the ponies she looks after and I know it would be a wrench to leave them. So I am hoping to be able to do a combination of both for her.

I have phoned the new yard (I think I said that further up) and they are keen to see her and have a space for her at their Pony club. So I think I will take her up for a visit.

And randomly the current school are actually getting a new Highland pony on Monday - he is 12 and a previous riding school pony. I think the problem is that they have 60 ponies/horses in total but only 6 of them are riding school ponies and of that 6 -2 of them are older now mid 20's and are due to be retired and then they have a lot of younger less trained ponies or peoples own livery horses. They keep saying they are going to train some of the younger ones up for the riding school but I think for various reasons some of them are not suitable. For the lessons my DD rides the more established riding school ponies but some of the ones she looks (feeds/grooms) after are the younger ones if that makes sense? They have never let her ride on her own on a green pony - just to be clear. She has had a brief shot on 2 of them as she was dying to but has been led & supervised.

She has enjoyed this set up for the past few years but just recently has been saying she wants to do more and has been asking about getting her own pony but I know from all the replies here she is not ready and needs more experience and I am not 100% we would be able to afford it. But I am also now wondering whether she will get the experience she wants at this current yard. Hope that all makes sense? Thanks for the advice/replies.

OP posts:
mumontherun14 · 11/04/2018 15:32

What would be rough costs for a part loan and then also a full loan? I have seen a few advertised locally but again would take her away from her current stable but may be something to consider for the future. I take it a part loan would be 2-3 days a week and a full loan for the full week? Does the owner cover livery and feed costs etc and she would pay part and then ride/groom/muck out etc? Thanks x

OP posts:
DullAndOld · 11/04/2018 15:34

i think loan agreements vary wildly tbh.
Also, where you are in the country is going to make it vary as well.
Have a good look at a few before you decide.

mumontherun14 · 11/04/2018 15:41

Sorry I sound as if I am obsessed with the costs but am very wary of promising my DD something I haven't fully costed or can properly afford....For her current set up this week has been the Easter school hols and last week and we have still been charged the normal £50 per week for 7 days each week....she is dedicated -she's been there every day bar one when they were away at a competiton....In return she is helping with kids that are coming for holiday rides and leading them round...so they do know that she helps out a lot and is a hard worker x

OP posts:
mumontherun14 · 11/04/2018 15:41

We are in Scotland x

OP posts:
DullAndOld · 11/04/2018 15:44

but for that £50 she gets 4 lessons?
That is not bad when you factor that in, plus she is getting good (?) experience, plus she has somewhere to be....
i think you would need double that to maintain a pony, plus the lessons. So many parents think that their child wont need lessons once they have a pony...
HOnestly if i were you, i would go for a part loan to start with.

BertrandRussell · 11/04/2018 15:44

I don’t think there’s a standard loan agreement- there are too many variables. For example, when my dd was caught up in A levels, she made an arrangement with a woman in the yard who rode her pony in exchange for “doing” her on school days. No money involved- just time.

DullAndOld · 11/04/2018 15:44

*double that as a minimum

MissMarplesKnitting · 11/04/2018 15:46

I needed more lessons after I got mine cos he was a stubborn, clever thing who I needed lots of time to work with. Bear in mind I was riding at county shows etc for other people before I got him so I was a decent rider.

mumontherun14 · 11/04/2018 15:50

Yes and this week it has been 5 lessons out of 7 days as it's been the holidays. I asked her what they do as I don't always get to see the lessons and she says each time they are working on one thing - e/g position. It is mainly 2 older girls who teach the lessons them rather than the owner . I recently saw them jumping and they were working on different heights and concentrating on jumping a clear round. I am no expert but she does seem to be coming on...

DullAndOld - I hear what you are saying about the costs and at the moment at that level would be prohibitive for us so it doesn't seem feasible. But I've got lots of good ideas here and I've explained it to her and she'd be happy with joining the Pony Club and working towards a part or full loan in the future x

OP posts:
RatherBeRiding · 11/04/2018 15:58

Costs of loans vary enormously. I currently have a young pony loaned out on a part-time basis. However he's young and needs a competent confident rider so I was so delighted we found someone who fitted the bill and is small and light enough to ride him, doesn't mind his baby tantrums, mucks out like a pro, that I don't take a penny from her unless we go out competing when she pays her entry fees and chips in for fuel.

As I see it, I am getting my pony exercised and brought on for free. However, a lot of owners will charge varying amounts for a loan - depends on whether the pony in question is a school-master and suitable for a novice I would think. Part loan you might get for £25 a week for 3 days, but it varies so much - the only way to find out is maybe to place an ad on a local equestrian site.

My yard also has the benefit of on-site lessons from the yard manager who only charges us liveries £15/hour.

noitsnotteatimeyet · 11/04/2018 16:03

My dd is 15 and has been working at her current riding school for the last two years - she gets paid for this and gets a free lesson each week plus time exercising the ponies. However for the previous two years she was volunteering at her first riding school, doing full days mucking out etc for no reward at all. There is a big difference between an 11 year old and a 14/15 year old in terms of how competent they’ll be, how much supervision they need etc.

As well as riding three times a week at her riding school, she also shares a horse at a private livery yard. She pays £25 a week for two days and gets to ride plus muck out, groom, poo pick, feed. Even though she’s been riding for several years and is very confident and competent it still took a long time to find a suitable horse to share as very few owners would consider someone under 16

LadyLance · 12/04/2018 09:46

With a full loan you usually pay all standard costs for the horse as if it is yours. Normally there is some agreement as to who pays vet bills (often the owner but not always). In some cases, the owner may pay some costs e.g. sedation for dentist so they can be sure it is being done. Sometimes you will be allowed to move the horse to another yard, sometimes it will have to stay where it is.

Shares/ part loans vary wildly depending on the arrangement and the amount of work than needs doing. In some cases people short on time but not money won't charge anything as long as you do all the yard jobs on your days. Around here though about £10 per day is fairly standard or £25 for 3 days per week.

With a share there might also be some additional costs- your daughter would need public liability insurance (join the bhs or pony club). She might also need lessons on the new horse. If the yard doesn't have a school she may want to hire one if there is one in hacking distance. I would also expect to replace anything that breaks while she is using it.

If the other yard has strangles it might be best to wait before visiting. As long as you disinfect in between you won't pass it between yards but some horsey people get very funny about it.

BertrandRussell · 12/04/2018 10:22

An unintended consequence of dd getting her own pony was that she discovered she missed riding lots of different ones. She swapped round a bit with other smug pony owners Grin but was very pleased when she started to be asked to ride other people’s horses for them at shows.

kingjofferyworksintescos · 12/04/2018 10:52

If the other yard that has strangles is at all responsible they should be closed to unnecessary visitors to stop spreading it

mrslaughan · 12/04/2018 21:40

Sort of pony - riding a riding school pony - and your own is a very different thing. So you need a been there done that - that ideally your pony club DC can vouch for (i know of the most amazing 13 2 for sale - known him for 2 years - he is truly a mothers dream- but you need that opinion from someone who does not have a vested interest in the sale - horsey people lie - sorry).

I would not recommend at all you buy something from a riding school, or your riding school owner - they have a serious vested interest, and seen many many people screwed over in this situation.

You also will need to man up and not be dictated to by you daughter - about what pony, and where it is kept. Riding is one of the most rewarding sports (I am biased) - but has the potential to go very very wrong both cost wise, and inn terms of your daughter potentially being hurt.

Safety has alway been key when buying my kids ponies, and the harsh reality is - we have made mistakes. Ponies have been wrong for variety of reasons - or simply outgrown...- so they have had to be sold. We are not in a position to be able to keep everyone. On the upside they have all found amazing homes, and we have stayed in touch. Until you are a very good rider - or stopped growing your needs will change and ponies will need to be sold. (This can happen organically - the 13 2 I mentioned above, had got to the point the jockey wanted to do more than he was capable of - she could have stayed competing at that level - but has eventually realised she wants to do more)

If you have not any experience of keeping horses yourself, you will need to be on a yard where you have a lot of support - this will cost more.

And then there's the endless need for tack and rugs.........you also need to budget regular lessons. I am concerned when you talk about your daughter being taught by a couple of girls - do the have any real experience/qualifications?

Sorry to be a tear germ - but I think its important to be realistic, and if you do proceed look for the right thing - a middle aged school master with an amazing temperament - that your daughter can get her legs around (so not too big!!!)

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