Is this unfair of me? Loaning related.

[Flexibilityisaghost]

I am lucky enough to have a lovely horse on loan. Initially it was agreed it would only be for a year and no more. However, things have gone well, and for personal reasons his owner is not currently in a position to have him back. Its been about 18 months now, and I am looking at keeping him for the next 3 years or so if things continue to go well.

The issue is, his owner has now asked me if I want to keep him permanently. I felt I had to say no, as he is 18, and while he is still in good health, he is likely to need to start taking things easier over the next few years. If I had plenty of money, and could afford to give him a good retirement when the time comes, and still have another horse to compete, I wouldn't hesitate.

I feel really unfair, saying I won't keep him, as effectively, I am likely to get the last of his best years, and then send him back for her to look after in old age. I just don't want to be in the position when all I have to look forward to is him starting to slow down, and be able to do less and less. I know there are horses that carry on competing into their late 20's but they seem to be very much in the minority. I'd imagine the reality is that within 5 years or so he will be restricted to just hacking. Any thoughts?

Send him back now so the owner can find a permanent home for him with someone who wants the whole package not just the best years

I don't think that is a great solution given she currently has nowhere to keep him and no time to look after him. I think that would be very unfair of me!

I got my horse at 18. She is wonderful and just what i wanted- if anything i am slowing down before her. She doesnt seem to know her age and even though she wasnt competed for years before i got her she is still a real go getter!

Ok, I can see your point BUT what happens when you have decided the isn't up to the job you want him for and decided to send him back in a few years?

Is his owner going to be in a position then to have him? Or will she be forced to have him back despite not being able too? What happens to the horse? Will he have to move?

I personally think the best things you can do is help her find him a permanent home (if she can't have him back) now that he can happily spend the rest of his days rather than have all the stress of moving/new owner/routine etc when he is older which is likely to be hard for him!

Think about it from the horses point of view.
If it doesn't work out that the best for him works for you too then do the best you can for him in making sure he is happy and well cared for with preferably a permanent loving home for him to live out his days :)

I agree that what is best for him is the most important thing. When I took him on the plan was obviously that he would go back. I don't know what her situation will be down the line though.

My concern with selling him on would be that you can't guarantee any home would be permanent. Not that it is my decision to make as he is ultimately not my horse. Should I therefore insist she has him back or sells him, rather than let things carry on as they are?

FWIW, I don't think you're being mean but you are thinking ahead and being realistic.

There's nothing wrong with the owner asking if you want to take over ownership of the horse, but at the same time, the horse is not your responsibility and you have every right to say no thanks if this would not suit you. Keep to your loan agreement notice period and you are fine.

The owner needs to take responsibility for her own animal. If she can't care for the horse over the long term, she needs to sell it to someone who can.

I was once in a similar situation as you OP. I had a loaner for 5 years, organised through my then-instructor, to loan a school master eventer who belonged to a friend of hers. After 5 years of board, many, many lessons with said instructor, she decided that she wanted me gone, but wanted me to take her friend's horse with me, so that her friend no longer had the financial burden of taking care of an older horse. Even though the initial stipulation of me taking on the horse was that I had to board it with this instructor .

As much as I wanted to, I spoke to the owner who was more than happy to take the horse back, which is what we did. The 'instructor' was always a piece of work, who was always looking for ways that she could take advantage of people.

Have a really good look at this situation, and be careful that this in not happening to you. There are many, many lovely people involved with horses, but as many of us know, there are also some really unscrupulous arseholes as well.

Don't feel bad. That's part of the deal with loaning. You take the risk that the owner could ask for him back at any time and the owner pretty much accepts that if the horse gets injured it will come back. As long as you are honest with the owner then she can decide if she wants to sell or rehome him now.
You did not take him on expecting to keep him forever and the owner knew that.
I have a horse I need to rehome or loan. I want to do that because he has particular issues and if he ended up with the wrong person I don't want him sold on and ending up in a dealers yard. I can't afford to keep him and I would love to find him a forever home. Loaning him I risk getting him back if he get injured or too old but at least I still have control what happens to him.

It is a really hard one, and I was in a similar situation with a share I had....he became injured and I kept on paying my share for about 10 weeks...at the end of the day, as much as I liked the owner I disagreed with the owners choices with regards to treatment, and he was still unrideable and I didn't see that changing.
It was a very hard decision, but at the end of the day if I had gone out and bought a horse, I wouldn't choose to buy one at that advanced years, and my agreement with the allows be to give notice.....but of sharing and loaning is that recognition that it is not a lifetime commitment.

What I do think is that you need to be honest with your DHorses owner. Not only make to clear that you won't be taking him on permanently, but that part of the loan agreement is that you can give notice at any time. If this does not sit well with the owner and she feels the need to find a more permanent arrangement for DHorses, that you would respect her decision to do so. Then she knows where she stand, and there is no mis understandings

Thanks all, lots of food for thought. Zazzles, that sounds like a horrible situation, I am glad it all worked out OK in the end. I am as sure as I can be that his owner is genuine. She had good reasons for putting him on loan in the first place, and she has been completely honest and upfront throughout.

mrsl I think you are spot on. I initially wanted a horse on loan, because I was not able to commit to buying yet, and that has not changed. My long term plan is to buy, and I would be looking for something younger, that will get to retirement age, at around the same time I will, so we can slow down together all being well.

I have been honest with his owner. It has occurred to me she could be on MN, and see this. I am fairly sure there is nothing I have said here that she will not be aware of, or have considered herself. At the moment my official loan agreement ends in a few months. I think maybe it would be good to discuss the long term future then, and check she is happy with having him back when the time comes. I don't want to give him up, as he is lovely and exactly what I need at the moment. He has a good home with me, and will continue to have for a while yet. If she did decide to sell him on though, to ensure he had a forever home, I would fully understand, and do whatever I could to help.

Lots of good points being made and I think you are clearly trying to look at things from both sides.

If you keep him for the next 3 years then send him back, you may indeed have had his last good years and be sending back a horse which is not an attractive proposition for a loan home.

His owner may be in no better position to have him back then, than she is now, and at 21 or 22 ... if she cannot afford to retire him or find a new loan home for him, she might have no other option than to put him down.

If she were going to sell him, I think it has been a mistake to loan him at all. It's often far easier to sell a 16 year old, than an 18 year old. I think something like Bonkey's suggestion offers the best solution, in that you and his owner work together to find him a good permanent home to which he can be gifted now, not when he's older (after all the usual checks).

As Bonkey says "Think about it from the horses point of view. If it doesn't work out that the best for him works for you too, then do the best you can for him in making sure he is happy and well cared for with preferably a permanent loving home for him to live out his days"