Equine passports - worth the paper they are written on?

[Callisto]

As you know, I'm in the process of putting DD's pony on loan and I've come to the conclusion that equine passports are entirely a waste of time.

My evidence to support this is that they in no way prevent a horse being stolen and put into the food chain (as far as I'm aware their main reason for being is to stop chemicals in the form of wormer etc being eaten by anyone on the Continent). Since researching the pitfalls of loaning a pony, I have come across horror story after horror story of loaned ponies and horses being sold on, several without passports, and fake passports being issued. I have no doubt that some of these poor animals ended up on lorries to France. Even the passport lady told me that it is impossible to prevent DD's pony being sold on as whoever does it will just get another passport for him, possible belonging to a different pony.

What do you think? Are passports worth it?

Nope, utterly useless. Why you can't have separate documentation I do not understand. There is however lots you can do to help prevent the worst from happening.

I'm by no means an expert, but pop onto HHO as there is loads of advice on how you can ensure the worst doesn't happen. Look up someone called MHOL (missing horses on loan) for advice.

I'm going to get Pony freezemarked. And will look into HHO and MHOL.

The whole passport system needs to either be really well regulated (in which case we probably need to pay £50 rather than £15) or scrapped entirely.

Depressing.

A DNA database would be quite useful. Some breed societies have them already. It would help when ponies become separated from their papers and their breed registration is lost. We have a lovely sec A on our yard who has no Id. It's a shame because she would show well. The same goes for Dds Shetland. She was discovered abandoned in a field. Freezemarking doesn't really work on white horses, which is a slight problem!

Dpony is freezemarked and she is white.Now she has her winter coat you can barely see it,but the rest of the year it is very clear.

I agree about passports being pointless though.

Passports will be much more useful now that all foals are supposed to be microchipped. If all horses had to be microchipped (as is the case in France for example), then any transaction, e.g. vetting, getting vaccinations done, selling, knackers yard, transport, competitions, etc. could start with checking the microchip. While not foolproof this would avoid a lot of the current problems.

I think for white horses they can leave the freezing irons on a bit longer so they kill the hair follicles completely leaving bald patches rather than white hair. So I've been told anyway, I've never seen it done (didn't have my old appaloosa done as I had enough problems with sunburn without that, but I was told that was how they would do it).

As for passports, I've heard all sorts of reasons why the whole system is a waste of time, for instance that if you buy a horse at a sale and it hasn't got a passport you can get one there and then so that you can legally travel it home . My horse didn't have a passport when I got him but there were no questions asked at all when I got someone out to do one for him. Also that when a shipment of horses leaves the country there is no checking of markings etc, they just count the passports and count the horses' heads. It's all just a way to screw more money out of us if you ask me.

Matching a passport description to a horse is a highly specialised job, I am not sure how many horse owners would get it right, so customs officials haven't got a hope in hell!! The only practical solution is microchips that can be read quickly and easily by anyone with a scaner.

I know you can microchip and get a freezemark to show dhorse is chipped b

I can't believe there is an acronym I know on MN that no-one else does!!

HHO is horse and hound online, the horse and hound forum. Is v useful. MHOL is a user who runs the missing horses online site as far as in aware and has a ton of useful information on loaning etc.

Beware HHO is addictive!!!! I spend half my life on there!

Umm, I'm not responsible for that! Though I agree. Between MN & HHO I'm amazed I ever get any work done

Ah, I guessed H&H. That missing horses online website is chilling. All those sold on horses, and the police don't seem to give a shite either.

Well, some people came today who liked Pony and I'm going to see them tomorrow. I'll get a loan agreement signed and think I will get him freezemarked while he is there. I got a good vibe from them so fingers crossed it will all work out.

A question for you legal eagles - they would like me to deliver him, which is fine. Should I accept diesel money or would it be better for no money to change hands in case they claim that it was payment for Pony?

I would let your passport agency know he's out in loan and the passport isn't to change names, also same for NED just as a precaution.

I personally wouldn't accept any money, but that is the cynic in me! the woman who delivered my foal threw in delivery which I thought was a nice gesture!