Right, bitless bridle advice, please.

[seeker]

Dd's pony goes beautifully in her new cross under bitless bridle - better than she has ever gone before. She carries her head better, is more responsive - just generally lovely.

She is on working livery, and does a couple of hours work a day, either going on walk outs or for older children or light adults who can ride a bit - she is sometimes a bit lively off the lead rein, so she's no use for absolute beginners.

My question is, which do people think is more painful/damaging to a horse if a learner accidentally yanks at them, a snaffle bit or the cross under bitless? We can't decide whether she should always wear her bitless now, or whether she should go back to a bit when she's working. ANy opinions?

Snaffle would be worse IMO. A bit is in direct contact with the ponies mouth. Although a cross unders noseband should be quite tight, no part of the bridle should be touching any sensitive areas.

Really glad you're getting on well with the bitless bridle.

I've just had a flamer from my friend who's a dressage judge - bitless work of the Devil - will ruin the pony - will put her completely on her forehand - lazy riders always blame the bit - she will lean on it and never go in an outline again - can't imagine what we're thinking of - and so on for two pages!

Yes well, dressage folk have the philosophy that more is more when it comes to metalwork in the mouth. And just mention rollkur to her next time she starts on. Fro info see here: www.equinescienceupdate.co.uk/rollkur.htm

Also I rode a GP level dressage horse in a hackamore and he went brilliantly in it.

That would be mean. I'll do it!

Because no horse ever leans on it's bit, does it?!

I suppose, to be fair, Pony doesn't, and dressagey friend is convinced that she will be leaning on her bridle by the weekend!

Whatever you do, someone will moan! It's no worse than a drop noseband! Just do what you feel and ignore them. I met a pony club mum the other week, at our first ever rally, and she underhandedly picked holes in our pony, and DDs riding, the whole day! I just smiled sweetly and ignored her!

Don't say that Saggy. DD is desperate to join the VWH pony club next year. We are going to be the scruffy ones in amongst very many expensive, shiny ponies, children and mothers. I'm not really looking forward to it, and the thought of competitive parenting to contend with as well fills me with dread.

Just smile sweetly! Everyone else was lovely and dd had a fantastic time. Her pony caused great interest, the only giant Shetland amongst all the pony club/show ponies! All the little brothers and sisters kept tugging on mums sleeve saying ' look at that one mum, it's got really little legs!' was quite entertaining actually, and dd learned a lot. You'll be fine. X

Anyway, you don't have to be scruffy, you can pick up all sorts of smart stuff at boot sales and auctions for peanuts. Dd's gloves are the most expensive thing she wears, and they were twelve quid, and she can hold her own amid any of your posh kids. I'll see if I can post a picture on my profile to prove it.

My dd has a wonderful beautifully cut hacking jacket that makes her look like an extra from Brideshead Revisited that I bought on ebay for 4.99.

She and her two dressage loving friends have one black jacket and one peair of white gloves between them - they swap them over as each one goes in!

Horses can only lean on something if you give them something to lean on. Bit or bitless, if you let them push on you, or if you keep pressure on them, you are letting them lean. When I brought my horse he was leaning on a waterford snaffle. Because I know how, I removed the bridle, trained him for riding in a rope halter, and hacked him everywhere in that for about a year. Once his mouth had been given a good rest, I reintroduced a bit (a Rockin S snaffle), but we stil ride bitted, or bitless and have also tried a bosal.
Not having the horse lean on your hands is a matter of balance and feel, something that many dressage riders know little about. So, if your pony is being ridden in balance, going bitless should not be a problem. Having a horse light on the forehand has very little to do with what you do to their head and mouth, and a lot to do with how you ask them to balance and work from behind.

My friend is a talented classical rider, who has trained with people like Danny Pevsner, her horse is a delight to watch when ridden in a rope halter, or a bridle. (Never a double, nothing more than a simple snaffle). In fact, I have seen horses ridden beautifully in balance with nothing on their heads at all, but that's another story.

There, that's controversial isn't it? One of the most well known trainers in the UK spent ages on the phone trying to explain how you couldn't have a horse working correctly unless you "engaged the jaw" with a double bridle. It's all bollocks, I've seen the proof first-hand.