Any food teachers around?

[CultureAlienationBoredomandDespair]

I’m starting a PGCE in September and was hoping for some insights from current teachers about what they had found helpful and also the state of the job market. I know that it’s an understaffed subject and jobs seem to hang around for a while but there also don’t seem that many to begin with.

I’m happy to hear about the good and the bad but please not just a sea of “don’t do it. Teachers and leaving in droves” as I’ve taken that on board and made a decision about retraining and now would like some insights into the day to day reality that go a little deeper.

Thank you.

Saying that you don’t want to hear ‘don’t do it’ etc worries me that you somehow think these issues will affect you! You cannot deny that there is a huge recruitment and retention crisis.
The good, well that’s easy! During the final two years the only good things were the some of my colleagues and the holidays!
The bad…
The workload, you will be working a minimum of 50-60 hours a week doing planning, marking etc. A lot of this will be done at home on top of your normal teaching timetable, weekly staff meetings, after school clubs etc. Despite having planning time on your timetable this will often be taken from you at short notice to cover for absent colleagues.
Nothing you do will be good enough and you’ll be criticised constantly. Constant lessons observations and additional work will be required to evidence every single teaching standard. Then we have behaviour! Behaviour has declined in recent years due to bullshit practices like restorative approaches. There are no meaningful consequences for poor behaviour anymore. You are likely to be physically and verbally abused and just getting the class to listen so you can start your lesson can be impossible with some classes. You will be held entirely responsible for their progress regardless of their own effort, actions or attendance. You may be pressurised to ‘help’ them with coursework. When I refused to do this I was called a cunt by a student and had a pair of scissors thrown at me because all her other teachers helped (did) her coursework for her.
Students are also prone to false allegations. It’s their word against yours, they will get their friends to back them up and they will always be believed. Similar situation with parents who can be a nightmare in some settings. If this isn’t enough for you then you have toxic senior leadership teams who will treat you like absolute shit. They will think nothing of screaming at you in front of classes of kids, generally undermining you or lying to save their own arses. I mentioned colleagues as being one of the few good things but for every nice genuine colleague there are around 3 absolute twats. The backstabbing gift to teaching types. I’m not sure why but there is a significantly higher percentage of these types in comparison to other occupations. You are also not allowed to have any opinions or question any SLT decisions. If you do then you’ll find yourself on a so called ‘support plan’ The targets will be ridiculous and completely subjective.
All of this will have a significant impact on your mental health. If none of this bothers you then crack on but I guarantee you that you’ll be back here looking to escape within 5 years!

My daughter has now been teaching for three years. She has experienced none of the negative things that @stiffnewkneedescribes, except that she has occasionally been required to cover for absent colleagues.

Some schools are clearly toxic environments. Some schools are not.

My daughter loves teaching and loves her school. There is the occasional incident, as you would expect, but nothing she wasn’t able to handle. Behaviour is well-managed and she finds the SLT encouraging, appreciative, and supportive.

I can’t really help on the state of the job market, but I think it depends very much on the geographical area.

Good luck.

Thank you both. I appreciate the feedback.

@Stiffnewknee its not that I’m not open to hearing the negatives it’s just that it’s common on here for anyone who has decided (or is just enquiring) about going into teaching to receive slew of one sentence “don’t do it!” style responses, which aren’t very helpful. They also don’t seem to tally with the teachers I know irl ( but I know no food teachers, hence the thread!). I’m very sorry for your experiences, which sound horrendous. What are you planning to do?

@Fifthtimelucky I’m glad your daughter is enjoying it. School environment is so
important. I hope my placenta schools are good places to learn,

Placement schools! Teaches me to try and type with two children on my lap!

@Fifthtimelucky
Firstly, your daughter is definitely in the minority or there wouldn’t be a recruitment crisis. There are lovely schools out there but these are definitely few and far between. Secondly, I’m assuming she might be relatively young and hasn’t had kids yet? These are all relevant factors. I’m not sure how old the OP age but the fact that she mentions a career change I’m guessing she might not be in her early 20s! Ageism is rife in teaching. There are lots of SLT in their late 20s/early 30s who lack the experience to manage staff and do look down on anyone older than them.
@CultureAlienationBoredomandDespair
Love the username by the way!
That’s interesting because I don’t think I know of any teachers who haven’t either left or who are looking to get out. If you’re determined to do it I would keep contacts in your existing career as a back up. There is a reason why so many of us warn others off teaching! I didn’t teach food but the food teachers I know are all expected to teach other subjects such as child development or health and social care. Might be worth considering this as well.
I managed to escape! I left last year and cannot begin to explain how much happier I am in my new role.

Just wait until she gets a bit older and she becomes too expensive to the system, and the next young, energetic, cheaper young teacher like your daughter is now, enters the arena. Then all the toxic bullying begins. Just wait until the burnout begins, if and when she has a family and as one gets older one gets more and more tired to cope with the job. Just wait until Ofsted come in one day, and completely destroy the school.

Look at what happened with Ruth Perry RIP. The system, which is still giving one word judgements by the way, is totally unfair. When I was in my fist few years, I was cheap, I received quite a bit of support, then as I became more expensive, things got worse and worse, more and more toxic. There is a recruitment crisis. The NEU recently did a survey about mental health. Teaching has the highest level of reported stress in the country. They found that:
"Teachers feel stressed at work a majority of the time. Almost two thirds (62 per cent) believe that stress affects them more than 60 per cent of the time."

@TeacherPrimaryabc
Totally agree! 3 years is still very early days! The problems start once you get to M6+ and become more expensive.
There is yet another post on the FB exit the classroom (which has 176K members - all looking to get out of teaching) where a poster is actually suicidal over the way she has been treated. The way people are treated in teaching is horrendous and things desperately need to change.

I entirely accept that the way some teachers are treated is horrendous (as are people in other jobs), but I do not accept that that is true for all teachers or for all schools.

Yes, my daughter is young (25) and has no children. But her school has many older teachers - some with young children or teens, some with caring responsibilities for elderly parents.

I have a good friend of 59 who is also a secondary teacher. She moved to a new job last September (in a completely different area from my daughter’s school). No doubt the school could have appointed a cheaper ECT but they were happy to pay her UPS3. Her school doesn’t seem particularly well run but her view is that the SLT is weak rather than toxic.

Ofsted visited my daughter’s school last year. They hadn’t been inspected for years and the head told staff he was expecting a visit in the new few months. He also told them he didn’t want them to worry about any visit, saying that they were all doing a great job and they should just to carry on as usual. The visit happened. My daughter had part of one of her lessons observed, and she also had a chat with one of the inspectors over lunchtime. She said that felt like a genuine conversation rather than a grilling, and she didn’t find either experience particularly stressful.

Obviously there was no single-word overarching judgement but the school was described as outstanding in every category.

In summary, there are some good and happy schools out there. My daughter has been lucky to start her working life in one. Let’s hope that the OP has similar luck.

I am not food tech but I am a practical (music) subject and I love my job.
I love:

• when students engage in music in real life situations (performances).
• when students enjoy my lessons because they like music.
• the funny students who enjoy life and have a laugh.
• my colleagues.
• when lessons go well.
• when children listen to me (I do quite like to feel important).

I have been a teacher for 13 years. I am secondary and haven't experienced any of the toxicity mentioned here. I also have never had any problems securing a job on UPS3. I am currently a professional tutor and work with ECTs and there does seem to be a totally unrealistic view of what it means to be a teacher at the moment. That the students should just behave and they shouldn't have to change what they're doing. But students won't behave unless you teach them to. It's just not going to happen - it's the teachers job to take responsibility. Obviously dramatic things happen and then a HoY should step in and this doesn't always happen as best as it should.

I do actually enjoy working with ECTs - but I am getting frustrated by the lack of effort. And the blame on SLT, HoDs and other middle leaders.

Thank you. It’s interesting to hear another perspective and hopefully I won’t fall into the trap that other ECTs do.

I can only assume that there is perhaps a difference in toxicity between teaching a specialist subject like music, DT, Pe, where SLT wouldn't have the knowledge in these specialist subjects to criticise. I would also say that music and practical subjects help with behaviour as the vast majority enjoy it more than writing an essay about Shakespeare. I would imagine teaching music, pe etc requires less marking than English teachers and therefore less workload. I can imagine being a music teacher could be fin at times. In addition, there is probably a clear difference between teaching in a large secondary school with lots of money, less financial pressures and a small Primary with very little money, where parents are buying the glue sticks and staff being made redundant etc.

Having observed many lessons and taught other subjects too - behaviour is actually far easier in a written lesson... Where the expectations of what they need to do is clear cut. I used to love the respite of teaching a maths lesson once a fortnight and previously I've taught English too. No drums for students to walk by and bash, no keyboards for them to unplug and play out loud. I am very good at behaviour management, I think you need to be in practical subjects - and the OP will need this more than ever where students have access to knives.

I did have one toxic line manager who had no experience of music - in one school I worked at. He did make me cry several times - and then ultimately I just left.

Ah, so you have experienced some of the toxicity mentioned if a manager made you cry!

@TeacherPrimaryabc Exactly! I literally don’t know any teachers who haven’t and it’s important that the OP knows that what we’ve experienced is far more common than the ‘wonderful happy schools’ being discussed here. Maybe they do exist but certainly not where I live!

Talking of behaviour, another school on strike due to bad leadership, and increasing violence in schools. Dated yesterday. There are quite a few others.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxepq0594xo.amp

Interesting perspective.

My English teacher friend says the opposite. Yes many pupils enjoy PE, music or other practical subjects, but some hate them and would like to give them up but aren’t allowed to at KS3, so they mess around and are disruptive. The same is true with other subjects that pupils intended to give up or didn’t see the point of, like languages and RE.

In contrast, all the pupils knew that English and maths were important subjects that they had to continue with and take exams in. They therefore behaved better.

@Fifthtimelucky
I taught a core subject and this did not result in students having improved behaviour. They seemed to resent being ‘forced’ to study the subject! In general I witnessed an increasing number of students over my final 4 years who didn’t give a shit about school and learning in general. Pretty demoralising to teach kids like this who’d rather be looking at TikTok and were completely disinterested in learning full stop.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/articles/c784ezdmnp4o.amp

Behavior has never been so bad. Record levels of suspensions, exclusions and violent behaviour in schools. Again, this is a report on the BBC news headlines page, dated today.

Pe, Music or English, behaviour has never been so bad. What a state education is in. There are huge problems. Not enough SEN resources, discipline is disastrous and many schools in chaos. I wouldnt be entering the profession at this time, if I were you! The articles are there, current and reflect my experiences.

@TeacherPrimaryabc
Totally agree! You could not pay me enough to teach again in the current climate! Unfortunately people only hear what they want to hear and seem to think these experiences won’t happen to them. I also feel that people assume all of us who have quit must not have been up to the job. I had a very successful career until all of a sudden a new line manager decided they didn’t like me. The problem is that senior management always back the bullies and teachers are judged on lesson observations which are one person’s opinion. You could teach the best lesson but if the observer doesn’t like you then they will judge it to suit their narrative. This is not the case in most other occupations where you are judged by productivity etc.
I met someone whose daughter was working in my old school. I was told that she was absolutely loving it (3 years in) I’ve since discovered that she’s now looking to get out 2 years later after experiencing all of the usual. Nobody is immune to bullying, all it takes is a change in leadership.

I hear you! Managers can be bast@@ds. I've met a few good ones, but most love the power, they're usually the loud, confident ones whose face fits, desperately trying to prove their worth / role.

I've been teaching nearly 15 years, mosly successful, but have been driven mad by the book looks, micromanagement, increasing poor behaviour, ridiculous workload, constant lesson observations with managers nitpicking about things that they don't do themselves. And you know what's dam annoying, is being picked up on something by a manager, just to prove their worth, and they DON'T do it themselves! "Two of your children didn't underline their dates in your lesson today. Please make sure you lap the room to check". Yes, I will fly around the room like a tornado! Then I sneakily looked at their books in their class, and what do I find, some dates not underlined!! I just can't stand the unfairness.

You're right, it's too easy for one manager to form an opinion. It's too easy for a manager to force their opinion on you about how to teach a unit of work and how to plan it. So many great ideas I have had about how to teach an English unit, only for a a manager to step in and change it for what they want. They are all sheep in schools, all following each other. You're lucky, if your face fits. Otherwise, schools are generally very unpleasant places to be, staff trying to outdo each other, each trying to impress the boss at the expense of someone else. Then there's the lack of money for SEN, the lack of resources and so on.

I've had enough. I'm getting out and will be part of those awful statistics of so many teachers leaving the profession.