If behaviour is good in your school...how?

[MissMelanieH]

Hi, I work in a primary school that has always had what you would politely describe as "character"
Lots of high needs families and pupils with SEND.
But despite that it was a lovely school to work in, nurturing, warm, family feel.

Now though, we have a new head who came from a leafy suburb school and implemented a Paul Dix style behaviour policy in her second week and now has run out of ideas. The behaviour is dire, multiple children in every class running around school in crisis, "gangs" fighting, swearing, children think nothing of telling teachers to fuck off, even the good kids.

So, if you work in a school where behaviour is, on the whole, good...what do you put it down to?

I'm fairly senior, new head is out of her depth so I'm desperate to make a difference and get the school on track again.
Thanks!

@Mutters123 I agree and it's common sense. You're right, it's the fine that makes everyone slow down approaching the speed camera and then they zoom off when they're clear of it. Behaviour is appalling in many schools and as you say many teachers are leaving because of it.

Behaviour is appalling on the streets too, few officers on our streets, people stealing alcohol from supermarkets because they can get away with it, knife crime is worse than ever, selfish parents without any sense of right and wrong and so on. We aren't getting a grip on any of it. Burying our head in the sand, having chats blah blah blah. It isn't working. Yes more mental health support is needed, but there still needs to be consequences (i.e the fine for speeding), otherwise you're right, people would speed! It's a lot more simple than all these minds have made it!

Exactly! Don’t get me wrong, I think increased awareness of ALN, mental health and trauma etc is a good thing but the problem is these approaches being applied universally. The majority of kids in schools don’t have these issues. I remember we had to complete a questionnaire on ACEs in a staff meeting. Myself and a few others had a high number. I remember a colleague saying that she was glad it wasn’t something practised when she was in school because if she had been allowed to in her words ‘act like a dick and get away with it’ then she may not have done as well at school as she had done. Everyone needs boundaries and consequences regardless of any issues they may have and this needs to be learnt in childhood. Of course approaches have to be different in some situations but the complete misuse and misinterpretation of restorative approaches has been detrimental to many schools and the profession as a whole.

Agree with previous poster who said that they tell kids off and insist that expectations are high. I wouldn't say behaviour is brilliant where I work but it has definitely improved since we adopted a stricter, less wishy washy approach. We have a clear system and we follow through. We don't let kids call the shots. We don't waste lesson time or breaktimes having long restorative conversations about why calling out constantly is not ideal. Most kids know very well that what they are doing is disruptive. They don't need it to be explained. If kids are not in the right frame of mind due to issues outside the classroom they get pastoral support outside the room so everyone else can get on and learn.

I actually agree with a lot of the Paul Dix/nurture approach but it can often feel to is and to kids as if the children do awful things and there's no consequences

And due to this, our tiny village school is about to lose 6 children - two families who feel that poor behaviour is being swept under the carpet, despite showing them the school behaviour policy, created with parental input and student voice, where behaviour is banded and much of the consequence for that particular band of behaviour is behind the scenes rather than obvious to the other children.

They just want really visible "bad behaviour = highly visible punishment."

Behaviour is excellent in my school. There are a few demographic reasons, like being a girls' school and having students who are highly motivated second generation immigrants whose parents value education above all else. But there other local schools with similar demographics and much worse behaviour. The key difference is that we are strict. It's not rocket science and Pivotal et al have done untold damage trying to sell us the idea that it is (our school dabbled in Pivotal for a while, behaviour went to pot and we've thankfully brough it back). We have clear sanctions and rewards and extremely high expectations and the students, in the main, live up to them.

Where I teach I feel the nurture is high, everyone is very kind and caring, there is a break out room which is fully staffed. The focus is very much on happiness and being listened to etc.

BUT I feel the expectations of the children are quite low in many ways.

I previously worked at an inner city very ambitious school where kids came from all backgrounds but learning was absolutely the priority. I found the behaviour more challenging there but it was more rewarding for me as a teaching because the whole school focussed on learning.

This place where I am now is really kind and nice but I actually think the children ar being let down by not expecting more from them. Their educational attainment is so much lower.

@Animatedapple this sounds similar to the school I work in.

I have enjoyed reading this thread.

I am currently in the process of leaving a school where behaviour is appalling and a huge barrier to learning (I leave at the end of Spring Term). I'll be moving to another local school with similar SEND/PP numbers (only slightly lower), but much less behaviour issues.

I probably won't be able to report back my findings on the differences in approaches but I will keep this thread in mind and perhaps come back here at some point - even if very late!

Please do update @TeacherGuy when/if you can. There's a tendency in schools in a certain type of area to have low expectations of behaviour so I'm interested in how schools buck the trend.
I hope it all works out for you.

I worked in a challenging primary school for a number of years. The children came from difficult backgrounds and some had high level behaviour problems. We had a simple visual traffic light system which was basically a verbal warning, time out of class then sent to HT where they would get told off and miss break time. Lots of positive praise, stickers, team points etc for those following the rules.
Behaviour was generally pretty good.
Fast forward a few years, I went on mat leave, new head...the difference when I got back after a year truly shocked me! It was chaos! Children who hadn't even been on the radar at all were now openly answering staff back, walking out of the classroom, throwing chairs. The consequences? There weren't any. They had a cosy chat with the head and were then sent on their way. Some even got to for cookies and hot chocolate once a week with the inclusion manager. This was seen as a reward for poor behaviour by the other children. I left a term later as things were so lawless thatI actually felt unsafe. The head didn't last long either.
I've worked at several other schools on supply and without exception, the behaviour at the schools using the Paul Dix type approach was awful, to the point that when I started applying for full time posts again I would check the behaviour policy first.

In my limited experience (I have only been teaching for ~3 years, >4 if you count teacher training) I have seen most schools move from a more disciplinarian approach to "trauma informed" and although the theory looks sound the effect seem to be detrimental. For example behaviour charts (an example of which you referred to as a traffic light system) are either being cut down to only include positive (i.e. you can move up the chart/recieve praise, but there are no negatives/ways to move down) or are being eliminated altogether in favour of "reflection clouds" which are not publicly visible in the class.

I've seen consequences of this in my current school (which I am leaving), where children no longer bother to even wear school uniform (they wear whatever they like), the "consequences" include out of lesson hangouts with SLT (treats, etc) and so on.

We've had a big rise in violence both peer-on-peer as well as against adults; two colleagues of mine have been in hospital this year due to physical injuries. We had 8 teachers leave last summer, 7 the summer before (it's a three form entry, so we have 21 teachers total) and support staff turnover is insane (we are permanently recruiting but people are leaving faster than SLT can recruit).

Everyone means well but people have completely lost faith in the headteacher (she has been there 3 years). I really, really tried, but I feel guilty working in a school which I believe is unsafe for children and where they are being exposed to violence and threats on a daily basis.

I think a school being "trauma informed" is incredibly important. As is the need to unpick and meet and SEND needs. However it seems like most schools that prioritise these seem to believe that in order to do it properly you have to be a bit wet and allow all sorts of behaviour.

The best person I've heard talking about this is the SUMO guy who manages tread the fine line well in my opinion.

I'm a big fan of Tom Bennet; his behaviour forums on TES saved me as an NQT who couldn't manage behaviour to save my life. Tom Bennet often gets misrepresented as advocating 'zero tolerance', when in fact what he advocates is strong rules and boundaries with humane flexibility where needed, just like most teachers.

IMHO Paul Dix has done an incredible amount of damage to education in this country.

I wouldn't work in a Pivotal school again if you paid me double (secondary, though).

Where I work now is definitely much more Michaela style "warm strict" although the woman herself would probably think we are soft. We do however make use of RJ techniques, centralised behaviour system which is fabulous, but individual staff are meant to organise RJ conversations if possible as well, and talk to parents. We also make use of hot choc sessions like Dix suggests but these are used to reward academic effort or achievement in the main, sometimes for being a good citizen or linked to extracurricular success. But it's definitely NOT the stereotypical "kids having a treat for being slightly less challenging, at the expense of the kids who are doing everything right" kind of thing.

I don't think I could do full Michaela either but the demographic where we are seems to work really well with clear and simple expectations, consequences and rewards. Wishy washy only leaves the door open to chaos in my experience.

That's the second time this week I've heard the phrase warm-strict...I wonder if it's the next new buzzword? Or maybe a sign to take note of.
To be fair the first person who said it, I really liked the sound of her discipline style.

Warm-strict has been a 'thing' for a long time (I think since the Tiger Teachers book came out but could be wrong) but it definitely dropped out of focus for a while. I think it's what most teachers do or aim to do naturally, to be honest, the balance between high expectations and caring about students too. That's my take anyway, this is a much more considered and professional one 😂teachlikeachampion.org/blog/tlac-3-0-excerpt-warm-strict/