Calculating daily rate - summer school

[cherrypiepie]

I'm working summer school this week and have been told I will "be paid to scale on a daily rate".

Would you take the annual salary and divide by 195?

I know there are many ways of calculating this as when I've had unpaid leave (strike and a term time holiday- weird circs) it was calculated at 1/365! So this would be a massive difference.

How would you calculate it?

I know the only way to find out is to ask HR so this is really a straw poll!

1/365 surely?

I would expect it to be 1/365

It will be 1/365, as you are (presumably) already being paid for the holidays. 1/195 is the daily rate if your contract does not include holiday pay.

Thanks everyone.

Teachers are contracted (mostly anyway under a document called STPCD) to work 195 days a year so our annual salary is for those days only (190) teaching day plus five inset days. So therefore we are not paid for the holidays.

I'll just keep hoping it 1/195!

It should be 1/365

Essentially, to make certain that (full time, non-supply) teachers have a steady income stream throughout the year, rather than a 6 week gap in pay over the summer, their pay is worked out (crudely) like this:

Teachers are paid to work a number of directed hours per year - let's call that 195 days of work within the 365. That pay is then divided into 12 equal packets and paid over the course of a year, so while you are not paid for the holidays, you are paid during the holidays.

If you work an extra day, you have now worked 196 days instead of 195, so your 'extra' pay is 196/365 x your total pay - 195/365 x your total pay = 1x your normal pay / 365.

We are being paid a flat rate- £150 day for teachers

@Nonamenoplacetogo that what we did at my last school and much easier all round.

The staff I have spoke to are expecting 1/195 as their daily rate.

£150 per day flat rate.

Daily rate is salary /195 (we are not paid for holidays people)

@watingroom2

Daily rate is salary /195 (we are not paid for holidays people)

But your pay is spread evenly over 365 days so that you get a monthly salary. A day’s pay is therefore 1/365

The guidance to the school teachers pay and conditions document says this

^Out-of-school hours learning activities
69. Relevant bodies should decide whether to make payments to teachers who agree to participate in out-of-school hours learning. The level of payment should be covered by the school's pay policy. Payments to classroom teachers should only be made in respect of those activities undertaken outside of either the1265 hours of directed time for full-time teachers or the appropriate proportion of the 1265 hours of directed time for part-time teachers. All agreements and payments to be made should be documented. All such activities should require the exercise of the teacher’s professional skills or judgement.^

So the answer should be in each school's pay policy.

I'd assume schools would be internally consistent, so if they deduct 1/365 if teachers go on strike it would be inconsistent to expect them to pay 1/195 if teachers do an extra day.

I find this whole debate around whether or not teachers get paid for the holidays which keeps coming up time and time again fascinating. I think it exacerbated during the strike when people were having a bit of a squabble online about whether or not they felt teachers pay was enough. People who felt it wasn't were saying that teachers only get paid for 195 days per year and that the rest is done out of the goodness of their hearts, essentially. Those who felt they were perceived them to be paid for the holidays, but possibly didn't appreciate that they will do some non directed hours during the "holidays".

In my place of work (finance in a school so doing payroll as well) we ended up having to talk some teachers through their contracts when explaining how they would be docked for the strikes (which we were doing at 1/365). HR were adamant that teachers get a yearly salary over 12 months, which is not pro rata like many support staff. One of the teachers querying it was saying that because they don't get paid EXTRA for the holidays, they don't get paid at all. But really they do, though it would be naive to assume that teachers salaries are what they are because they come with quite a lot of time away from the classroom by way of half term, summer break etc, where there is no directed time.

It derails from the real issue which is are you happy taking home the pay you get each month for the work you do each month (which will vary slightly depending on the time of year). Are you happy with the lifestyle you can achieve from the amount of effort you have to make. Many of course are not, but it always seems to veer off into a discussion about holidays.

Naive not to assume teachers salaries are what they are due time time away from the classroom, that should have read.

I,m interested to know why you think it will be the higher rate if you were getting 1/365 on strike days, for example? Surely it will be the same rate for both?

@TattyDevine Our contracts are based on 195 working days though, hence OP was paid extra for going over this- and teachers getting paid extra or given days in lieu in some circumstances if they work a weekend or holiday day.

We are paid a salary in 12 instalments, based on 195 working days. Teachers cannot be directed to work in the holidays or on weekend days.

If the government wanted to increase our working days, then people would expect a pay increase based on the days.

This is why people say teachers are not paid for the holidays.

You are doing it at 1/365 because of a court case which says this is the maximum possible deduction, not because teachers are paid for every day of the year.

It's ridiculous to resurrect a 2 year old thread to talk about how teachers apparently don't understand their pay, when you clearly don't fully understand the situation either.

I imagine the OP has completed the summer school seeing as the thread is almost 2 years old!

Just in case anyone is wondering about additional hours though, contracted hours are divided by /365 and paid across the entire year in 12 equal instalments. You are however only being paid for 195 days work - we are not paid for the holidays!
Therefore any additional non contracted days worked should be paid at the 1/195 rate. This is because they are not being paid across the year.
It's important to be aware of this if you work extra hours or days. I spent ages looking into this as despite it being stated in the stpcd I was wrongly paid at my contracted hourly rate (which is £10 an hour less) by my school for supply hours. Got it all back though fortunately.

Op here.

I got paid an hour rate of MPS 6 which was very annoying as I was UPS3. It was fun though!

It should be 1/195.

Hi, can I ask where you found the evidence that the pay should be divided by 195, I'm currently having this battle with payroll as I was paid a lot less for 9 days work as they have put my daily rate into 260 days 😭

Thank you

@MissAtomicBomb1 I've sent you a message x