Defeating the teachers

[KB2021]

I teach Year 5 and have a group of 3 children (2 girls and one boy) who have been overheard saying they want to defeat the teachers because it gives them strength. They are constantly talking and giggling when I’m teaching and will argue the toss if you call them on it. They like to make pass comment on things, e.g. groaning loudly when I say it’s assembly or saying “this is so interesting” in a mocking tone. They also like to make a big deal out of things I say e.g. giggling hilariously when I said we were going to look at our work the next day with a fresh pair of eyes. They put their hands up to answer a question and then say things like “I forgot now” or “I’ll leave it til the end” when they’re clearly stalling to avoid doing any work but then if they have their hand up and don’t get picked, they loudly complain that I’m not choosing them. Sending them out or to the head is a victory in their eyes because they’ve then ‘defeated’ me and moved onto the ‘next level’... I can see them egging each other on across the classroom.

Any tips? Reading this now, it seems quite extreme! It’s only really a recent thing but I’m keen to nip it in the bud before it escalates. Have tried parents and not making much difference. I’m not long back from maternity leave (in a job share) so I feel a bit on the back foot with them at the moment...

Use the school behaviour policy to the letter and report every instance of this behaviour to your behaviour lead. This will not have come out of fresh air and they will have 'form' for it. It's disruptive for the other children and for your teaching and should not be tolerated. Make sure your job share partner is dealing with them in exactly the same way too. It really is disgusting behaviour for 10 year old children. Make sure you're rewarding the others who aren't joining in and let them know exactly why they aren't being included in the rewards.

Since you know what they're up to I would be pulling them in individually and letting them know that you know about the "defeat the teacher" thing and won't be tolerating it.

Outline consequences and rewards missed out on and stick to them like glue.

Also, keep them separated as much as possible, get one or two doing jobs or joining clubs in breaks, arrange tables so that they're away from each other. Divide and conquer.

This all sounds like a lot of silliness because you're a new face to them and they're trying it on.

If only there was a clear behaviour policy... As for a behaviour lead, that doesn’t exist. With COVID bubbles, it seems to be every man for himself 😔

I like the jobs in break time idea. Alas no clubs running currently. They’re as split up as I can make them in the classroom...

I’m concerned if I call them on it, it’s going to become a “you won’t beat me” situation and then is it more of a challenge?

That's a shame!
I wouldn't say "you won't beat me" though I'd say you can do this if you wish but x, y, z will be consequences. Or, you can choose to drop it then you'll be in on x,y, z fun activities...... make the rest of the year hard on yourself if you really must. Sort of approach.

There's no fun in it if you act a bit "been there, done that, dealt with 20 like you before" sort of approach.

Document everything. Especially because it's all low level. Yes to the individual tap on the shoulder and consequences. Let the parents know what's going on, in writing. If it doesn't stop, call the parents in.

With three in a class you should be able to step on this. I had six in a class of twenty this year: very difficult.

Sarcasm and aloofness works for me, although I appreciate this is a bit of a flippant answer, plus I'm a secondary school teacher, not sure how effective this is on year 5. Do you have a rewards policy? Maybe really over promote this to all the students who have to put up with this behaviour.

I'd speak to them separately, call them out on it straight away. Explain that if they disrupt your lessons for other children, then they will be given the work and sent to the H's office to do it.

That would scare mine enough.

I think you are likely to have a lot of the other children on your side and the occasional "here we go again, year 1 is that way" with eye roll and smirk to rest of the class. At all other times just cultivate a very bored, too grown up for this face and explicit praise for maturity and grown up behaviour in the other children. Otherwise split them at all times keep them busy at break / lunch so they don't have a chance to hold court, and use the fact that there are three to your advantage by occasionally giving two of them a benefit or advantage which puts them back into your team. Then do same with a different two! Yep, it's blatant manipulation but sometimes it's what you have to do.