Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

The staffroom

Whether you're a permanent teacher, supply teacher or student teacher, you'll find others in the same situation on our Staffroom forum.

PGCE worries again - any mentors around?

37 replies

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 13:12

Is it common to feel completely out of your depth and like you'll never make it at this early stage? I know I'm 'consciously incompetent' but i just can't get the hang of planning. I thought i could do the course and i would managet. But I'm not sure now. I think if I gave I'd honestly hate myself but I also don't want to be the 'uselss student' .
How do you know when to call time? As a mentor what would you be seeing after 3 weeks in school that would suggest your student won't make it?

OP posts:
olivo · 26/10/2020 14:09

I remember feeling orally overwhelmed a few weeks in. Now ,as an experienced teacher and subject mentor, I would reassure you that it is probably normal and too early to call time. Do you get on well with your mentor? Are they helping with/ guiding your planning? You are likely to be exhausted, now is the time even very experienced teachers do. Can you get some rest over half term?

olivo · 26/10/2020 14:09

Orally? Totally!

MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 14:14

What can't you get the hang of about planning?
After 3 weeks, a trainee who obviously couldn't care less would be on my hit list. That's about all

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 14:36

Oh I absolutely care. I do. I'm trying to plan but need much more info in my form, down to the questions I'd like the TA to ask. So I'll take that on board.

I haven't been shown how to plan, or seen anything planned in the way that uni require it. I can't seem to make the jump between the lesson title and getting it on paper.

We have a uni planning workshop after half term so it might become clearer then. I'm also going to listen in to a twinkl webchat on weds for trainees. I really want to be able to do it.

Have my first essay to finish and despite writing most of the day i don't seem to be getting and further 😮

OP posts:
MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 14:50

I can tell you care from the fact you're asking!
I'd forget the title of the lesson because that's just bollocks and start from what they need to be able to do at the end. And work back.
So my year 10 need to be able to write an essay by the end.
What do they need to be able to do that?

  • know what they're being assessed for
  • know what it's got to look like
  • know the text
  • know how to work out what to write about

Objective - to be able to write an analysis of text

First I gave them a short quotation and a few minutes (literally 3 on a timer) and told them to analyse it. We've done this loads but I got them to tell me what that means.
They did it and we discussed it, then I got them to find their own which linked and repeat the task.
Next the question - asked them what the AOs are, which they know. Modelled annotating the question. Modelled how to effectively read and annotate an extract.
Set them off to find at least 3 new things in the extract.
Discussion and modelling of annotation.
Model opening paragraph, explaining choices as I go and using a colour code to help (which they're encouraged to do to)
Back to the question. What do we have to do? Discussion of range of ideas we could include.
Timed writing (10 mins) then peer assessment based on the assessment objectives AGAIN, then independent writing for homework.
My lesson plan said none of that but that's what we did. If you work backwards, it's more likely to make sense.
Is that of any use at all?

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 15:14

Yes! Anything is of use because I literally go round in circles and then fear stops me in my tracks. I nearly called my scitt director an hour or so ago. Feeling very down about it as i was a competent ta so people (wrongly) assume I know more than I do. I have a weekly timetable but yet to see a lesson plan for eg geography. I have asked that hopefully we can find time to do this next term.

OP posts:
Hercwasonaroll · 26/10/2020 15:24

I think planning gets better with time. I've been teaching 10+ years and I look at lessons I planned even 4 years ago and now think they were crap!

You can't be expected to know everything 3 weeks in. You're a teacher baby and just learning how to be in a classroom.

You definitely care because you're here asking about it.

I'm assuming you're Primary by the way you're talking. I know planning can look different to secondary. I tend to think about exactly what I want students to know, and then work out how they're going to get there. I'm secondary maths so lots of modelling and examples then some work for them, then sometimes an exit question.

MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 15:33

I once was that SCITT director. Please call them - they'll be glad to help you!
Being a TA is not at all the same. I'm working with a TA at the moment who is teaching unqualified and the skills are surprisingly different, so don't feel bad about that.

ValancyRedfern · 26/10/2020 16:27

3 weeks in I was utterly hopeless! Don't despair. The only purpose of planning is to ensure the children learn what you want them to learn. All the rest is box ticking. I find it much easier to plan 'freestyle' handwriting into a notebook and then transfer to a pro-forma if one is needed. Also, make sure you get some downtime over half term. It's impossible to think and be creative when you are exhausted and stressed.

noblegiraffe · 26/10/2020 17:25

As a mentor what would you be seeing after 3 weeks in school that would suggest your student won't make it?

I’ve seen some truly dreadful students pass (dire shortage of maths teachers) so I’m not convinced there’s anything that means you would fail.

The thing that would concern me about you becoming a good teacher would be if you didn’t respond to feedback and change what you were doing. Like there was a student I had who kept giving the kids worksheets from TES that they’d just googled and didn’t actually match what they’d just taught so as soon as the kids were set off on the task they got confused and hands went up and no work got done. Kept pointing it out, they kept doing it.

What feedback are you getting?

PumpkinPie2016 · 26/10/2020 17:32

At 3 weeks in, you are still very much in the early stages of learning. As someone who has mentored trainees and now an NQT, the fact that you are struggling with planning wouldn't be a problem for me as long as you were asking for and listening to advice.

Has your mentor done any co-planning with you? If not, ask him/her to plan a lesson with you. That way, you can discuss together exactly what needs to be planned and why. Then, you will have a model to follow.

As a trainee (and indeed later on) planning can be an opportunity to find out what works and what doesn't so don't worry if not every lesson plan goes perfectly.

You can do it! Ask for help from your mentor and keep at itHalloween Grin

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 17:43

Exhausted - check. Stressed - check.
I think the issue may be that I'm not actually that creative.

OP posts:
MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 17:52

You don't need to be creative. I'm as creative as a spoon - you need to know what works and do it :)

SquashedFlyBiscuits · 26/10/2020 17:55

You don't have to be super creative. You develop banks of ideas over the years and you can just redo stuff. It doesn't have to all be the most creative and exciting stuff.

Are you primary?

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 18:15

Well i have asked if i could watch her plan / we could plan together so that I can see the steps. Hopefully soon. It's annoying that ppa is my uni day.

Feedback on my first lesson on wk 2 was mostly about timings (i rushed the input) and behaviour management and not setting clear expectations. All of which i tried to address in my next task (a starter). I'd like to think that I listen to feedback, I'm certainly going to redo my plans and send later this week.

@noblegiraffe maybe i should have gone for secondary maths instead Grin

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 26/10/2020 18:23

You’ll be fine, honestly. I was terrible when I started, if everyone was good from the off we wouldn’t need training!

We also all have our own strengths as teachers. I’m not creative in the slightest, but luckily other people are and I just steal their stuff.

MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 20:06

If timing is an issue I highly recommend a kitchen timer. I have a terrible habit of setting a quick task and losing track of time - my timer keeps me in line!!

spanieleyes · 26/10/2020 20:37

I could never start from a blank piece of paper, it would stay blank for ever if I did! I used to find a published or previous plan for the objective I wanted to teach and start amending it. Top group- mine needed more stretching than that so change the task, middle group- would be ok but swap round, lower group- not a cat in hells chance they could do that, change it. By the time I had swapped and moved things around it didn't bear much resemblance to what I had started with but it matched the needs of my class and the objective I wanted to meet. Much easier than starting from scratch!

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 20:46

No I hate the blank piece of paper.. I'm given a title eg light and then that's all. Are there any good websites for lesson planning? I've found STEM. Anything worth paying for? I'm doing remembrance as well next term but lots of the activities are art based, not history based

OP posts:
MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 20:49

Light? You're expected to plan from that?! Good god. That's insane!!
Do you have access to the schemes of work the school uses?

Hercwasonaroll · 26/10/2020 21:08

What, how do you plan from the word light?

What is the teacher expecting the class to learn?

Have you chosen art based activities or been told that's what you are doing?

noblegiraffe · 26/10/2020 21:21

I'm given a title eg light and then that's all.

You’re not shit at planning, your mentor is shit.

There should be medium term plans? A scheme of learning? How do the teachers there plan because they sure as hell aren’t starting from scratch every lesson.

namechangedyetagain · 26/10/2020 21:33

I am going to check in the morning but i don't think I've been given a scheme of work. I've been looking at the NC for outcomes and trying to work from there.

I did say I'm rather worried about getting it all wrong. I need to try and switch off from it tonight and come back to it in the morning. This worry*(and the essay I'm ploughing through) has taken up my whole half term so far. Feels like I'm wading through treacle.

OP posts:
MrsHamlet · 26/10/2020 21:44

My rule of thumb is that you should spend no more than twice the length of the lesson you're going to teach on planning it. By the end, nowhere near that long!
I feel you need a physicist!

Scarby9 · 26/10/2020 23:28

Three weeks in I would expect you to be teaching some lessons from your class teacher's planning, maybe adapting the planning to change an activity or two, keeping in line with the learning objectives.

I might ask you to plan a section of a lesson, giving you a very clear learning outcome for that section.

Noone should be planning to the title 'Light'.

We have had the problem of (unmoveable because of othet timetabling) PPA being on uni day for some trainees. For some we suggest working on other aspects first (eg. behaviour management, teaching to the teacher's planning, marking to the learning objective etc) first, then becoming an apprentice planner when the placement full weeks start. For some other trainees, the class teacher has found another time in the week to discuss planning with the trainee.

It may be that, because you were a capable TA, your class teacher and mentor(s) assume you actually know it all, and the training year is largely a formality for you.
Speak up and tell them what you need support with at your next mentor meeting, or before.

Ask for the long or medium term plan for science and/ or which objectives should be covred over what time period. Ask what the children's previous experience of the 'light' topic has been and what their recent experience of science has been eg. Did they do any during lockdown?

These are all essential questions to ask before you - or any experienced teacher- could plan effectively for this class.

Unconscious incompetence is 100% normal at this stage - and a good sign. Don't let it cripple you, but ask for help.