Any English teachers around? Re mandatory GCSE requirements.

[BonnesVacances]

DD is off school long term sick and we're trying to find out if she can just take the English language GCSE. Her school have said that she needs to do English Lit as well as English Language won't count on its own (in terms of it being mandatory).

When we spoke to the college before, they said that if DD comes to them in Sept with no GCSES (due to chronic illness) she can do English and Maths in Y1 then A levels in Y2 & Y3. They only offer English Language GCSE, not English Lit as well.

So I'm a bit confused. Is it a case that for English Language to "count" from secondary school it has to be taken with English Lit, but if they do it at college, it's ok on its own? The college course definitely says GCSE English Language - it's not a combined language & literature GCSE.

Can I also mention that (obviously I don't know what your DD's illness is) if she is good at English as you say, she stands a decent chance of doing quite well in Lit with little formal teaching if she can read the books and poems herself, watch YouTube tutorials, read study guides, practise essays. If she was in my class (long term absent or not) I would more than happily mark work done at home and offer feedback.

Has the school not set up any Medical Needs tuition? I have a few students like this and we have tutors who work with them, and have done the speaking component with them , too!

Thank you!

I've had a reply back from AQA and they say "It is our understanding that a student only has to achieve one of the English subjects at a grade 4 and the spoken language endorsement pass isn't a mandatory requirement."

But then go on to say that the +16 rules are set by the DfE and I should contact them for further clarity.

DD has ME/CFS. She's not had any tuition in that time but we are looking at maybe getting some for English soon as she has been able to start reading some early reader books in the last couple of weeks.

We initially asked the school if it was too late to start thinking about the English GCSEs and in all honesty I think they were horrified. So they told us it would be extremely difficult for her to pass Lit now and besides she needs to sit that in order to do Language. Their responses have been quite negative. Their latest email has raised the speaking component as another reason why DD can't do it.

The English dept at DH's school said that a bright student should still be able to get a pass in both, but that because Lit wasn't as necessary, maybe DD would be better off focussing on Language so as to not overload her.

So we're getting one story from DD's school and another from DH's school.

Well, this is news to me about the Spoken English! Not sure who ahs been lying to who know!

I will take this up at my own school tomorrow...!

I do hope your DD will be on the road to recovery soon.

sorry : terrible typing there!!

I don't think the school are intentionally misleading you. Like piggy I am also surprised by AQA's response as we were told in no uncertain terms that GCSE Eng Lang could not be awarded to our students unless we conducted the Spoken Language component and fully participated in the the board's moderation processes (filming a sample of kids and submitting video files to the board - an incredibly time-consuming operation which counts precisely nothing to their final grade).

I think they are probably freaking out that a high-achieving student is not likely to achieve her targets. Certainly in our LA you would have had support from the Ill Health Team and your DD would probably be receiving tuition. I'd be inclined to ask about this.

I don't think AQA are saying teachers don't need to do the speaking component. Just that if it hasn't been done because of 'candidate absence' it won't affect whether or not the GCSE is awarded, which was the question I asked them.

Would the Head of English and Assistant Head seriously not know if the requirements have changed? Especially after a direct question and one they said they have gone away and looked into before responding. Also is it not part of the Head of English job to know the changes?

It just makes me feel now that they haven't bothered to look into it properly. I would have hoped if they'd identified an obstacle they'd have looked into whether there was a way round it. Whereas instead they've just thrown up obstacles that aren't even real ones.

Yes, they seriously would not know because that really is NOT what the exam board have told schools, which is that everyone including long term absentees needs a spoken English result otherwise their GCSE Language cannot be accredited. Daft but true.

Your DH is a teacher, isn't he? He will know exactly why any other teacher might have lost the plot a bot in terms of Exam board/ Ofqual and government changes over the last few years! Notably the grade 4/ 5 back pedal last year!

What the exam board have told you contradicts what my understanding is (and Yippies) so I can only conclude it is the exam board who are playing silly buggers....

Would the Head of English and Assistant Head seriously not know if the requirements have changed?

As the information that AQA have given you directly contradicts the explicit guidance that we have been given as a centre, yes.

Cross-post with piggy!

I have just read the spec and it really says nothing very helpful, other than it is 'compulsory' but it does say (as Is aid upthread) that a grade of Not Classified must be awarded to anyone who doesn't attempt it. In other words, your DD can get an NC grade. This will appear on her GCSE results print out.

This version of Spoken English was completely new last year. Your DD's school may not have come across this issue before so we all learn as we go along.

I honestly think the main thing you need to tackle them on is appropriate medical needs provision for your DD.

Thanks. It is getting a little derailed by the spoken part of the exam. They have also told us that DD has to sit English Lit too which I think all Heads of English depts know is not the case?

DH is not a good person to ask as he knows the Science changes inside and out and expects the Head of English at DD's school to know her own subject just as well, especially after having looked into it (it being the English language/ Lit question]

But going back to the spoken component. What is your understanding then if a student isn't able to do it because they weren't in school that day and gets a Not classified result? Have you been told that the student would have effectively failed the GCSE? Because yet, that does contradict what they've told me.

No, the spoken English is the Non Examined Assessment part of language but - unlike every other qualification!- the NEA does not contribute any marks to the actual GCSE. It is standalone. So they have failed the NEA.

To be fair to heads of English, it has probably been the biggest political football of them all and your HOD is probably parroting what she was told by the exam board at exam board training...

If they weren't in school for one day that is different form long term absence. the school doesn't have to do it on a set day and would be expected to catch the student up. So, I guess they may be trying to say there is still time for her to do it.

For example, my head of English didn't know that a NC result could be submitted. I found that out for myself after my student stood mute for 2 minutes and then said one sentence.

The exam board didn't foresee these problems!

Notwithstanding, your DD's school should have contacted the board for advice .