Retraining as a teacher with young children

[Livelifefortoday]

Has anyone retrained with young children? I'm looking at a pgce (part or full time) or school direct. A teacher friend advised me to wait until dc are at least in reception class due to workload. This is another 3 years away.

I currently work part time in an unrelated profession and I'm just looking for some ideas. I also volunteer one day per week in a school.

I looked into level 1 TA roles but this would require a huge pay cut and level 3 would mean going to college for a year.

Is retraining realistic with young children?

To follow up on what pippi said above, I am (I think) a good teacher and a good manager, but that is solely because I had significant management experience outside teaching before joining. Schools seem to put teachers (sometimes really young ones) into management roles without any training whatever. Unsurprisingly, things go wrong!

I am just warning you OP, as you might find the training tough but ok and then in your NQT year come under pressure to be head of this or manager of that, if you are any good. The teacher training will not mention or acknowledge any of this, by the way.

I think Phiney has a good point, the training is tough but you get through because of a desire to be a good teacher.

Then you start a job and the definition of a good teacher is a constantly moving goalpost. You are not a good teacher unless you have shown on your planning in green the assessment questioning you are going to be asking (despite OFSTED saying they won't be looking at planning), or double backed the work on display, or displayed your success criteria for each lesson on a special board, or whatever passing bandwagon of an idea has been latched onto this week.

I don't think any teacher would mind the hours so much if it actually helped the children. But it doesn't.

It is more important now to show that you have done something than to actually do it, everything has to be evidenced and if it can't be evidenced it doesn't count. Areas that make a huge difference to children's learning such as building self esteem and independence don't seem to matter.

I think what I'm trying to say OP is that I don't think it's even the hours necessarily that is the cause of teachers leaving, it's the hours of pointless nonsense. You can put up with long hours if you can see a point to it, otherwise it just makes you resentful for the time you are missing with your family and friends.

Well said jellyfrizz. Sadly in a way, because the pointless nonsense is just irrelevant to the kids' education, rather than dramatically harming it, nobody cares that the teachers are being driven into the ground for nothing. Of course it is now beginning to have a real effect in the kids' education because teachers are actually finally leaving in droves rather than just staying and putting up with it all.

Did my pgce when youngest was in reception, looking back i still regret the times i had to fob them off so i could concentrate on the screen. Also that other people had to take them on days out while i completed some essay or other. Few years in and always have a to do list at the back of my head and feel nothing i do in work is ever good enough, career choice where there is always room for improvement! Have worked many other jobs, nothing like it. Daily thoughts of how to get out!!!! Hindrance of 2-3mnths notice not helping.

I love teaching. But I worked 7 days a week for my PGCE and NQT year. I now work 4 days a week and a couple of hours at the weekend and it is great with a toddler. I don't think I would have coped with doing a PGCE with little ones, but if you are going in with your eyes open and you think you can cope then go for it. It also depends on your subject. I teach drama so can never leave before 5 as I have rehearsals, English you might be able to leave earlier and work once kids are in bed.

I think it's never feeling good enough or like a job is complete that I struggle with as much as anything.

Some things that might help are

1. You will never have experienced before the administration/pressure was so bad so you won't have a golden age to compare it to.

2. I think things will have to get easier because there will be such a shortage of teachers

3. you could work abroad, work part time, work as supply

4. you could choose to work in a supposedly poor school where there is less pressure for results

5. Having holidays with your children is a huge bonus especially if you family around to help

I was a primary teacher (up to SLT level), teaching infants and early years. My life is hugely easier and more enjoyable since I left. I had worked in another professional role before teaching, so had other contexts to compare it to.

The problem with the out of hours work is that it almost always has to be done to a short deadline - marking is for the next day, making resources might often be for the next day, weekend planning is for the following week. So it has to be done - it is not just a bit of extra work to catch up or get ahead.

If you do, go part-time as soon as your NQT year is over.

I had a different career before retraining as a teacher a few years ago. I didn't retrain before as I knew (from teacher friends) that it would be incompatible with my own DC - much more flexibility on the private sector.
Every teacher I knew, primary and secondary, warned me not to do it - they were all looking for a way out. Even a Uni friend who had had a brilliant career and HoD is an amazing school in a fantastic location.After I did retrain (dire SD course, secondary ) I decided not to do an NQT year but to do supply instead. I really like supply as I get as much work as I want ( 5 days week), but can take days off if I feel like it, get all advance bookings and pick and choose schools. Does not pay well, but better than I would get as an NQT for massively fewer hours and no stress. Leave every day at 3.15, and then have the evenings and weekends to do nothing/see my own Dc/see friends etc. I will never take an FT teaching job - the most I would possibly considering taking on would be PT in an indie school.

Is there a limit as to how long you van do supply without the nqt year?

Only in LA schools.
Where I live is all academies, free schools and indies, so does not apply.

When I started teaching (in the 80s) I planned what I was going to do, but the paper planning for the whole week was 2 sides of A4 (handwritten - we didn't have computers then )
I looked round a special school recently. In the Foundation yrs class (7dc in the class, all with autism), my friend who was showing me round, showed me the teacher's planning. For one day she had to produce 5 pages of closely typed planning.
I mentioned it to another friend who is teaching in a mainstream Infant school - they said 'Yup - I have to do 5 plans (differentitation) for every lesson. So that's 25 plans for one day. This doesn't count time actually preparing resources, or setting out the room, or finding things that ought to be in the central stockroom but aren't, or marking work with 3 stars and a wish (or whatever fashion of the day is), or attending moderating meetings or writing a new curriculum for every time they change it (about once every 2 yrs), or looking for Jonny's lost jumper, or meeting a parent who wants to rant, or meeting a parent who is genuinely needing time for an actual concern, or doing playground duty, or parents evening, or writing reports, or writing interim reports, or looking at the 'data' senior management collate and justifying why Tommy has only made 3/4 of the progress he should have made this term, or inputting data, or planning assembly or the latest display, or attending staff meetings, or going to a child protection conference, etc.etc.
It would be nice to spend time talking with the children, but the time you spend teaching, is a tiny proportion of the time you spend working.
HTH

Great teacher friends told me not to train with 3 dd's, they were 14, 11 and 8. I ignored them and wish I hadn't. Only finished my NQT last year and resigned last week :(, my family need me more.
Good luck with what you decide x

Thanks everyone. Non teachers hear about the stress and workload of teachers, but half the problem is that we don't really know exactly what demands are placed on them. There has been more media coverage recently about the teacher recruitment crisis, so hopefully the root of the problem will be addressed, rather than simply patching things up by enticing new entrants to the profession.

I really doubt it will. Teachers haven't been listened to in forever as education is a political plaything.

There's increasingly less under 45s in schools already. It will just be a job young people do for a few years before being spat out.

I can see QTS being scrapped completely.

Nicky M or some such minister will say that there's no good/available teachers around and admit there's a crisis. This will be in 5 years' time when there really aren't any left. They'll then let anyone be in charge of a class but will pay them a pittance.

Take everything with a pinch of salt. What one person finds really difficult won't be so hats for someone else. I'm not saying it's easy, just that your personality type, attitude towards work and life experience up to know all play a part in how you will find training to be a teacher and also teaching.

I did my PGCE before I had kids. Plenty of people do it with kids. They manage. Some people drop out. But some of them have kids and some don't!

Worth bearing in mind that you can't do the school placements part time. Or at least you couldn't when and where I trained. They are the bits that are hardest and most stressful. The course can be done part time, but the lectures and assignments were not too bad. I would advise against doing it part time personally. Just get it done .

I must admit that my general attitude was to go to lectures and do what I need to 'pass' all the assignments. I got bs and cs. But I worked my socks of on my placements and got a+ both times.

I agree rollon, all the schools will have been forced into being academies by then and so they won't 'need' qualified teachers anymore.

Also agree that QTS will soon be abolished. It's clear to see the the govt's agenda is to devalue the profession, hence the increasing emphasis on 'staff' facilitating or delivering lessons, not actually teaching them.

Oh dear! I have a place to start a secondary PGCE in September but the more I read, the more I am questioning my decision. I already teach (unqualified) in an FE college so I am realistic about the endless paperwork, marking, planning, tracking etc, the increasingly poor behaviour and never ending pressure to get a pass out of kids who put in little to no effort. I am lucky in some ways that the department I work in is very disorganised - I get almost no support but I am left alone to get on with things so I don't have all the new initiatives and negative feedback to deal with. I have good pass rates which is all the HOD cares about. I've just had my first observed lesson after teaching there for 3 years which is crazy as I didn't have any teaching experience when I started.

Despite all of that I love my job but, with funding being cut every year, there just aren't enough hours for me. I was am hoping that secondary teaching will be just as tough but just as enjoyable but that's not what I am hearing online. I do have a number of friends who teach and they have all said that I'll be fine and have encouraged me to go for it. They mostly still seem to enjoy the job although it is getting harder. One is leaving teaching but he's the only one who really isn't enjoying it anymore and even he has encouraged me to train but to look on it as a job I'll only do for 10 years or so and then get out. Do you think it depends on the area or subject you are in? I think science is probably lighter in terms of marking so that might make things easier and there are quite a few nice schools nearby which seem to have good heads/HOD.

I'm lucky that I get a good bursary so I will be better off financially during my training year than I am at the moment (and probably for several years after I qualify) so in some ways I have nothing to lose by trying it out. I have friends teaching in Brunai, Singapore and Australia and there are often jobs available in their schools. We are keen to try living abroad for a few years so that might be an option if the UK school system continues to go downhill. I don't know what the supply situation is locally but that could be an option too. It's just such a shame that the government can't value and support our teachers :(

I think if you are already teaching in FE you will be fine as you are going in with realistic expectations. Teaching is funny in that you can only tell what it is really like when you are at the front of the class - I was a TA for a while before training and although a useful insight into schools, it was utterly useless in terms of telling me whether or not I would like teaching. Mostly because I would go home at 3pm in blissful ignorance while my class teacher went to staff meeting, marked, planned, assessed...

Yes, see it as a short term thing and be very cautious about taking on management roles. I was burned out by 8 years in - but would probably have lasted longer had I limited my ambition for upwards progression and/or stuck with a part-time post (which I had for a couple of years and was the only time I ever cracked the work-life balance).

-look on it as a job I'll only do for 10 years or so

I would hate to go into a job, with the intention of working my way up the pay scale and then just leaving after ten years, (broken and depressed) and then starting all over again in something else at the bottom of the pay scale. I would rather just start with the 'all over again' job at 20/30/40 and focus on that.

rollonthesummer - my worry is the broken bit rather than the short term bit. I worked in research for 11 years and absolutely loved the first 9 but as I got older I found it less satisfying and swapped to tutoring/teaching. I don't regret the time I spent in research and I left at the right time for me. If teaching is the same I'd be happy with that; 10-15 good years then ready for a change. Struggling through 10-15 depressing years and leaving when I can't take any more is different

I like learning something new and retraining - is that odd? Maybe I'll never get very far up the pay scale but I'll be working for a long time and I like a challenge.

Most people I know in teaching are broken, sadly. I worry about trying to get a new job/foot in the door in another career at 45/59/55/60!