Duchy of Lancaster Theft

[Roussette]

Just when I thought I could not be more taken aback at some of the practices undertaken by our Monarchy, and the sheer greed.

I then read this article. Bottom line.... anyone who dies intestate in Lancashire, and parts of Merseyside, Grtr Manchester, Cheshire and Cumbria... their assets are scooped up by the Duchy of Lancaster who has collected more than £60M over the last 10 years. Not charity as is the norm.. but into the pocket of our King You need to read the article to see what he actually does with it and how it benefits his personal income.

The article explains it well and will answer any questions and queries about it.

Someone yesterday accused me of 'despising' the RF. I disagreed but I am beginning to wonder if that poster was right. Especially when I read something like this.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/nov/23/revealed-king-charles-secretly-profiting-from-the-assets-of-dead-citizens?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

@Iwantcakeeveryday I have already provided an explanation of why the charities had to purchase the properties and not be given them by the Duchy. The process ensured that no laws were broken in the process of transferring property to the charity.

I am genuinely puzzled why you think this is so wrong. What did you expect the charities to do other than use funds donated in accordance with their objectives?

Obviously the Duchy sold the properties prior to their renovation and may have invested the proceeds of sale. If this was invested in stocks of some sort, they would no doubt generate an income return, probably roughly equivalent to rents on the property sold. Therefore there would have been no gain in terms of income for the monarch.

it is a private estate for the benefit of the monarch but it is definitely not owned outright by the King himself!

We all understand there is deliberate blurred lines around tis ownership, but being held in trust for each monarch doesn't change the fact it is their private estate, all of the income is theirs. Right? It doesn't go to the treasury.

Yes it was stolen and then created as a private estate for each monarch, which would be handed down etc we have been over this, and I just posted a timeline of 'ownership'. None of that changes the fact it's a private estate. The properties are managed by the DoL, not the crown estate, he keeps the money, not us. None of what you posted invalidates my post you replied to, at all.

I have already provided an explanation of why the charities had to purchase the properties and not be given them by the Duchy

what does that change? this is about BV money, which was used to buy them.

I am genuinely puzzled why you think this is so wrong. What did you expect the charities to do other than use funds donated in accordance with their objectives?

I think I and others, have explained it really well, over and over again in fact. I am puzzled why you think he should keep the Bv for his own private benefit and then lie that its all given to 'charity' when most of it is used on his own private property. Tbf the former Queen lied about it, and he is so far, carrying it on. the jubilee trust is just there to maintain his private properties, mostly the chapel at savoy. He doesn't need to create a charity for that, he can pay for it all himself. The BV money should have all gone to the benevolent fund, preferably none should go to them at all.

probably roughly equivalent to rents on the property sold.

So you don't know do you. That is deliberate. The whole point of the articles is to try and pry open the secrecy involving the duchies and the way they are run and who the money belongs to.

Here is a list of the heritage property that BV monies are spent on:

https://www.duchyoflancaster.co.uk/properties-and-estates/historic-properties/

and I have attached an extract from the last published accounts showing how the BV money is spent - please point me precisely to the private benefit.

I am not going to go round in circles with you. Any BV money used for Duchy of Lancaster assets, is a private benefit, because it's a private estate. I think you're confused by them being 'heritage/historic' properties. Did you read the articles and all the discussion from this thread? Because I am being asked to repeat the same things already discussed. Both the Jubilee and Housing trusts, benefit duchy properties. Thats all you need to know. You may decide you don't mind a billionaire getting this money and using it for his own private property, but plenty of people mind, and always have. Do read the last article I posted showing that.

@Iwantcakeeveryday Yes you are going in circles as obviously you can't point to misappropriation of funds it as there isn't any.

Most of those heritage properties are open to the public (I haven't checked the entire list so it may be all of them) and many are managed by English Heritage etc. but presumably you don't care about that or our national heritage. The Duchy has a duty to spend BV funds on maintaining that heritage property - that is laid out in the old charters, that is its raison d'etre! I guess you just want the whole Duchy abolished.

I think the fact that the King and before him the Queen cared a lot about preserving heritage property for the nation out of their 'own' trust funds speaks volumes and some republicans trying to find fault with this is laughable.

Most of those heritage properties are open to the public

Really not. The point is they are not all 'heritage properties' ! Unless you rent it off of AirbnB or something! Agricultural buildings bought up, petrol station, commercial premises etc.

The Savoy Chapel is open for a few hours a day as I understand it.

'Republican' is not an insult you know. There is nothing wrong with questioning the current Monarchy and its practices.

By the way, did you read the link to the history of the Duchies... maybe you might feel different reading that...

I have pointed to it, and so has The Guardian. You have refused to accept those facts because you believe that this buildings are not private due to their heritage or historic status. You're wrong. Other privately owned heritage or historic buildings are not maintained by BV money, private owners have to maintain them themselves, and can be legally forced to pay for it if they allow them to fall into disrepair.

What is laughable is the idea they took public money and used it to maintain, and indeed improve their own properties, is somehow caring about preservation. Its a sneaky way to get put of using their own billions to pay for their own maintenance. Using BV money to upgrade a farmhouse to a luxury let they collect rental for, oh what a kind caring Queen to do that for us!

"A leaked internal duchy policy from 2020 gave officials at the king’s estate licence to use bona vacantia funds on a broad array of its profit-generating portfolio. Codenamed “SA9”, the policy acknowledges spending the money in this way could result in an “incidental” benefit to the privy purse, the king’s personal income.
Properties identified in other leaked documents as eligible for use of the funds include town houses, holiday lets, rural cottages, agricultural buildings, a former petrol station and barns, including one used to facilitate pheasant and partridge shoots in Yorkshire.
Upgrades include new roofs, double-glazing windows, boiler installations and replacements of doors and lintels. One document references the renovation of an old farmhouse in Yorkshire, helping transform it into a high-end residential let. Another upgrade is helping turn a farm building into commercial offices.'

"A leaked internal duchy policy from 2020 gave officials at the king’s estate licence to use bona vacantia funds on a broad array of its profit-generating portfolio. Codenamed “SA9”, the policy acknowledges spending the money in this way could result in an “incidental” benefit to the privy purse, the king’s personal income.
Properties identified in other leaked documents as eligible for use of the funds include town houses, holiday lets, rural cottages, agricultural buildings, a former petrol station and barns, including one used to facilitate pheasant and partridge shoots in Yorkshire.
Upgrades include new roofs, double-glazing windows, boiler installations and replacements of doors and lintels. One document references the renovation of an old farmhouse in Yorkshire, helping transform it into a high-end residential let. Another upgrade is helping turn a farm building into commercial offices.'

Please can you tell me where this inaccurate quote comes from. We didn't have a King in 2020!

its now the kings estate though! I thought you said you had read the articles, including the one in the Op?????? thats where its from and what this discussion is about.

Yep @Iwantcakeeveryday

Round here there have been barn conversions, there is one going on at the moment which I can see on my walk. And we have a lot of AirbnB's. So this barn will either be sold at great profit, let out or used as rental income. A barn is hardly a historical property is it... I doubt they'd get planning permission if so.

Are people so royally brainwashed that they wouldn't look, question, and discuss? I don't get it. Just because it's been like this for centuries doesn't make it right, as the article on the History of the Duchies shows.

Taken from that article...
The duchies were arguably private but public at the same time – an ambiguity that succeeding monarchs would work hard to preserve.

Time and time again over a century, the Duchies and how they operate has been questioned. Time and time again, the Monarchy bats it away. The current arrangement dates from the 14thcentury

No wonder they hang on to it for all it's worth. At least they've stopped investing millions from it in offshore tax havens (Bermuda based friend of Charles the Paradise Papers revealed)

I assume you are referring to the queries answered by the Duchy and reported in the Guardian here :

"On Thursday, the Guardian revealed some of the funds were secretly being used to renovate properties that are owned by the king and rented out for profit by his estate. The duchy conceded that some bona vacantia revenues are financing the restoration of what it calls “public and historic properties”.

Again - "public and historic properties".

But they're not public, as they say repeatedly, The Duchy of Lancaster is a private estate! Did we get money from the rentals of these properties? No. He does. They think allowing us mere mortals to walk around a couple of them every now and then deems them public, they're not. Same with historical or heritage terms, doesn't change the fact they're a private asset. We don't own them. We don't collect money from them, we can;t sell them, we don't manage them. It's really simple@Gettingcolder regardless of them bring historical, if they are part of the DoL, they're private. Do you accept he is collecting rental monies from some of these? Surely that indicates to you they're private assets. Its odd you are still trying to claim any part of the DoL is public. I'd like some of the £26 million he got firm the DoL into the treasury if thats the case!

Thats the current endless argument here isn't it? They're Public! but ah... held in trust so.... but also private so we can't have any of the income.... but public when it comes to maintenance cos, you know, history.... and also part of a charity....

Which is it?? The ambiguity is deliberate. They say both don't they, depending on what they're being asked. Why is he keeping the income? Its' a private estate. Why is Bona Vacantia paying for upgrades and maintenance? They're public historical buildings! Generation after generation our elected politicians let us down by not making this clear, or even better, taking the duchies back again- has happened before. They were stolen form the public, so lets give take it all back!

Always taking from people with less resources then they have, always asking for more. Never giving any of their own money then disguise fully funded socialising as work.

Have not read the whole thread but isn't it the same with the Duchy of Cornwall? I did not know about Lancaster. Do they put it back to charity by any chance?

Please at least read the OP! gosh.

😅 thanks for the advice. Will follow