Poorly kitten with cat flu.

[ToffeeWhirl]

Our six-month-old Balinese kitten has a recurrence of cat flu again . He first had it a month ago. This time, he has a high temperature, an eye infection, the sneezes and is sleeping all the time. He is still eating and drinking, thank goodness, but he is very underweight.

If he gets another recurrence, the vet will check for other diseases.

I have come away from the vet with a bagful of medicines and a much depleted bank account.

The vet did reassure me that this wasn't life threatening. We are all besotted with this kitten, particularly my oldest son. The other day, DS1 fell asleep during the day and I found him and the kitten tucked up under the duvet, both heads on the pillow .

Has anyone else had a cat with cat flu? If so, did it keep coming back? Any tips?

Also, any tips on telling the breeder would be welcome. I chickened out of telling her the first time round, but I really feel I should this time. However, I don't know what to say without sounding as if I'm asking for a refund or blaming her in some way. Also, I'm not sure what she can do about it if her cats are carriers. Does it mean that she shouldn't be selling kittens, or is this just a risk you take when you buy a cat from a breeder?

Incidentally, the only reason we bought a pedigree was because I am allergic to cats and this was one of the few breeds that don't trigger my allergies. Am not particularly bothered whether I have a moggie or a pedigree, just don't want to spend my days sneezing and wheezing.

I would be pleased to help.

Yes with that too I didn't like to say

You have had a bad ride toffee,I've had 4/6 of ours from kittens with no problems like this, one had mild flu but nothing a fortnight with mum couldn't sort out.

I hate the thought that there are other kittens from this breeder who may well have it too.

Am hoping the breeder is simply on holiday, as you say, cozie.

I will bear in mind that we've simply been unlucky this time, Fluffy.

Diary, I hope the breeder is fair, but, if not, I'd be grateful for your advice.

DS1 insisted on sleeping downstairs again tonight - because of the kitten, he said. I think moving back up to his room will be an acknowledgement that our kitten is gone and he's not ready to do that yet.

I can't face another night on the mattress down here, so I am going back to my own bed tonight. At least I stayed down here till DS1 fell asleep.

Well done. Poor lad.

I was reading a bit more last night, 'they' say it can affect one kitten out of 6 and no more then in other cases 5 out of 6 kittens.

recent thread with breeders discussing fip

I'm still reading just now, I will be around for any advice needed. Its kitten season so would be surprised if she is on holiday but will give her the benefit of the doubt.

Did you sign any contract at all? Some don't have them.

Yep. I've never had one with a breeder - although to be fair, it's some years since I acquired a kitten as opposed to an adult. Equally, they were the sort of breeders who pretty well gave me a blow by blow account of the kittens from birth onwards and then phoned up afterwards to find out how things were going.

I can only imagine that if one of those breeders had given me a kitten with FIP, they would have been quite beside themselves with worry for the kitten - leaving aside any financial or other compensation - and would probably have closed down their breeding directly. I hope that gives you some perspective, Toffee. Good Siamese (Balinese) breeders care desperately for their animals and they certainly don't expect to make money out of it. Maybe cover some of their costs if they're very lucky.

first post on here shows you can sue for this

Should she not do the right thing.

She should do it without threat of court action and out of love for her animals - although I grant you that some people can be 'helped' into a correct stance by fear of litigation.

She might still reply, though. Toffee should give it a couple of days at least.

Yes I would give her at least a week, maybe even 2 with it being the holidays but not long enough so she think your have forgotten and gone away.

I wasn't suggesting toffee threaten her with that I was just showing that it is something most breeders should know and think about FIP.

Thanks for the links, Diary. I have read those and been reading round the subject myself too. Apparently, FIP is sometimes called the 'purring disease' because cats with FIP seem to be particularly affectionate and purr a lot. Unfortunately, this seems to be down to feeling ill and feverish, rather than feeling happy . This fits perfectly with ToffeeKitten, who couldn't leave me alone during his last week of life. I had to wrap him up in a fleece blanket and carry him around with me. I like to think that was also to do with wanting to be near me, not just because I was a giant hot-water bottle.

I notice, too, from reading the threads, that someone else's kitten seemed well, apart from odd infections, then declined rapidly over one to two hours and couldn't even walk - just like our kitten. It stunned me how our kitten went from seeming to be well to suddenly lying on his blanket, unable to move. I worry we should have had him put to sleep before he reached that stage, but then we would have tormented ourselves about putting him down too early. We did our best.

Am also troubled that I didn't stay with him when he was PTS. He was so attached to me and I left him. I would have stayed if DH hadn't been so adamant that I should go because I was crying uncontrollably. I feel I let ToffeeKitten down now.

Still no word from the breeder. Maybe she's on holiday or maybe she doesn't want to engage. I am not going to sue her if she doesn't refund the money. It will take forever and simply add to all the stress. I hope she will do the decent thing though.

By the way, I remembered, whilst browsing through cozie's link to the Siamese and Balinese website, that the breeder was recommended by a member on that website, although the breeder herself isn't a member, as far as I can see. The woman who recommended her said she uses her cats to breed.

DH and I have managed to combine all our photos of ToffeeKitten (or 'Baby' as we usually called him, as no other name ever fitted him). I have just had an email through from Boots announcing 30% off their canvas prints and photobooks, so I'm going to order a canvas print to put up on our wall, plus two books - one for me and DH and one for DS1.

Couldn't resist downloading some more of my favourite photos onto my profile page...

You absolutely did not let KS down - and I'll get real angry with you if I ever see that again. Nobody could have done more for that kit than you did Toffee. He would have known your DH and the vet and would likely have been pretty sleepy anyway. If anything, you did the better thing by leaving at that point because your distress might have communicated to him because you were so close.

KS didn't know the vet because our regular vet couldn't do the procedure that day. However, DH said that KS calmed down as soon as the vet held him and the reason DH left was because he didn't want to cry in public the vet was so gentle with him that DH felt he was in safe hands.

I know you're probably right, cozie, and I know that KS would have been put under anaesthetic straight away and drifted off, but I wish I'd had the courage to stay and stroke a paw. I had no idea it was going to be so harrowing beforehand.

Of course you didn't - it's always bad, even when it's the best or only thing to do for them.

He would have been so sleepy, Toffee. And vets (even if it wasn't his normal one) are so very, very gentle.

It was entirely out of your control toffee.

I managed it when I was 15. I sat and stroked my dog's paw whilst he was put to sleep in our garden. It was my first experience of death. I have no idea why I couldn't be as strong this time.

He was sleepy even before the anaesthetic, cozie - I think the illness was making him drift away. I'm not even sure he recognised us anymore, to be honest.

Yes, I suppose it was out of my control, Fluffy.

The dear friend I am meeting today - the one who has always had Siamese cats - said she has never been able to stay when her pets are PTS. She just can't do it. It will be good to meet up with her today, as she really 'gets' how we feel.

At 15 you don't truly realize the impermanence of things, I suspect.

Have a good talk this afternoon. I hope your friend takes you into the sunshine and gives you a glass of vino. I think you deserve one by now.

Yes, maybe that was it, cozie.

We will be sitting on the beach and we will certainly be having vino .

Have had a lovely evening, sitting on the beach, drinking Prosecco and eating fish and chips. Came home to a reply from the breeder who says that she can't find the words to say how sorry she is, but she assures me she won't breed from either parent again and she will also neuter our kitten's sister.

She ends with profuse apologies and promises that she would never have sold our kitten to us if she had had any doubts about his health. She says that none of his siblings have become ill.

Having met her, I have no doubt that she is sincere in her apologies.

No mention of a replacement kitten or a refund.

I'm glad you had a pleasant evening - I think you needed that good break and relax.

I'd discuss the matter of the breeder with Diary if I were you. I know that you weren't minded to pursue the matter very far but I think myself that you need, at the very least, to ensure that there is definitely no other kitten produced with poor KS's problems. Intentions can be well meant at the exact point when they are uttered but then rather fall by the wayside.

I'd personally also go for financial restitution not only because it's a not inconsiderable amount of money but particularly because it underlines the point about breeder responsibility - but that one is your call.

Best of luck whatever you decide.

Lovely pictures Toffee, I don't know what to say about the breeder...

I cannot believe she has only offered an apology, I wonder if only Toffeekitten has been unwell so far as it can come on at any point and it also sheds so some tests can come back negative even if they display a few little signs ....and she is just saying she will neuter the parents.

That's a huge decision to make from one person contacting you saying their kitten has FIP.

Breeding cats costs from £600-£1000 per cat and she is simply having them neutered with no vet visits to try establish the carrier...I'm not sure I can believe that

If you wold like to look into it further I would be happy to help, I'm angry on your behalf that she offers nothing more than an apology, however heartfelt it is

I understand you can not get another kitten for six months. Well then ALL the breeders cats are contaminated.

cozie and diary - I have no idea what to do next with regards to the breeder, to be honest. I haven't replied yet (well, she kept me waiting long enough).

I don't quite follow what you mean, Hansie. Yes, the vet recommends waiting six months before we buy another kitten. Yes, maybe all the breeder's cats are infected with the corona virus, but they are not all infected with FIP, I hope. I understand that corona is a common virus and only dangerous when it mutates into the full-blown FIP disease. This appears to happen in only a small percentage of cats. My understanding is that only cats with a certain genetic make up develop the full-blown disease. The breeder is assuming that the cats that bred my kitten may carry genes that trigger the disease in corona-positive cats, so she is no longer breeding from them.

I suppose the vet is just trying to make sure that we are in a coronavirus-free environment before we introduce another kitten, so that we don't reinfect another kitten. Even though this wouldn't automatically mean the infected kitten developed FIP, it is better to be safe than sorry.

I don't know how we can ensure buying a corona-virus-free kitten next time though. There is a test, but lots of kittens will test positive and never develop FIP. Maybe someone with more understanding can enlighten me. My understanding is only based on recent googling. I have looked at Dr Diane Addie's website and she says FCoV is a relatively fragile virus and you only need to wait a month to introduce a new cat. So why does my vet say six months?

I spent ages today compiling a photo book for DS1 with all our photos of ToffeeKitten. It was very therapeutic. DS1 helped me a little too. I also watched some videos, but that was too heartbreaking, so I haven't looked at any more.

That's what I was saying previously - about the big variation in recommended waiting times.

Are you so sure you want a kitten, Toffee? There are always a bunch of mature pedigree rescues looking for loving new homes. Maybe even a Siamese?