Beyond Adolescence - V

[SpanielsGalore]

New topic for a new thread, inspired by a post about poo bags.

Does your dog's poo smell?

I was under the impression that dog poo only smells bad if the food doesn't suit the dog. Same goes for flatulence.

The only time my dogs' poo smells or they have windy bottoms is if they've eaten something rotten they've found on a walk.

Your boy sounds impressive @Ylvamoon
Temperament wise, sounds like he has a big dog mentality. They do it twice then start to question it and quickly decide it's not worth the effort. Mine are also not food motivated. Both are true Patou from imported parents and I agree that European bloodlines produce a very different dog.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Even a 8.5kg cocker? She's so tiny, I bet you wouldn't even notice she's there.
Glad night times are getting better. P woke for a wee for months and it was a killer. K slept through from day 2, which was much better. Witching hours and Tasmanian devil biting fits are much easier to cope with when you aren't sleep deprived.
Odo is heavier than P now. I can understand why you wouldn't be able to carry him fat for a 'walk'. I night manage to the garden gate and back.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Sorry I missed a birthday. 14 is a great age, though it's never enough. Especially since she's been so healthy and active for all of those years, living life to the full.

LOL at your DMum saddling you with toilet training the puppy, under the guise of a slow introduction to Satan. 😂

K has never caught a furry, but P has caught 4 or 5 leverets and rabbits. She then kills and eats them. I had to hang around for half an hour last time, as she always stays just out of reach until it's all gone.

The dogs I know of with a bite history all did so for a reason. (Resource guarding, tormenting children etc.) So when placed in a suitable home, the need to bite didn't arise again.

@Ylvamoon Welcome to BA and other random chit chat. You don't have to be brave to join us. We are all very pleasant on these threads. It's only the threads about poor breeding practices that get a bit heated at times. Mainly because people don't want to hear their chosen breeder is a thinly disguised puppy farmer.

Your dogs are lovely. Don't think I have ever seen a Tibetan Terrier before and wouldn't have known they aren't really terrers.
Be nice to add a different breed to the chat. We're mostly gundog, with a couple of PMDs and a collie.

And I'll have you know there is nothing undesirable about a cocker spaniel. All of your cockerpoo's bad bits must come from the poodle genes. In the same way all of my sprocker's annoyingness came from the springer ones. 😂

None of my dogs will retrieve anything on a walk. My gundog trainer will say it's because they've had too much freedom to run wild. It took until week 3 or 4 for my youngest to do it in classes. And that took a lot of practising at home. She'd run to the dummy, sniff it and then walk away.

I'd love to do agility with my youngest, but there's nowhere near me that does it. One of the downsides of living in the back end of nowhere.
I used to do it with my 5 year old, but had to stop when she was diagnosed with luxating patellas. That trainer unfortunately switched to hoopers.

Gosh. That's a long post. Sorry. 🙈

Oh. Just remembered. I went there again @CoubousAndTourmaIet . Way down that rabbit hole. K's new food is being delivered today. It's CSJ Tripe. 15 kg for £29.09 + £7.25 delivery. Hopefully she likes it and it suits her, because I really need something cheaper to counter balance P's extortionate diet.

Brie was also a very good sleeper, much like your K @SpanielsGalore , we only had a couple of disturbed nights before she was settling quietly. But this one is a stubborn little bugger. Very different temperament from Brie. Again, that nature v nurture thing...🤔

Interesting about the food, I'm not familiar with that brand, but will keep my fingers crossed that it turns out to be a good discovery for you and, most importantly, that K will like it.
The food switch is working well for us; Odo is now on 50/50 Royal Canin Giant Puppy and Calibra Life Junior Large Breed. The lamb has already done wonders for his poo, it's darker, firmer and he's less whiffy. He also had a puppy tray food in lamb and wolfed that down compared to the previous chicken one, so he's definitely another PMD that will thrive on lamb as the main source of protein.

Yup, sorry but I'm another one inwardly chuckling at the idea of @TheHungryHungryLandsharks mummy conveniently deciding that Satan will be ready to cohabit with puppy after the toilet training and nasty needle teeth phase is done...😆We are being very cruel and clearly it is a case of having confidence that pup will be well brought up with valuable input from the several canine matriarchs of the family...😉

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I looked at it before, as it's recommended by the nutritionist as a decent food for those on a budget. For some reason, I couldn't bring myself to 1 - only feed tripe and 2 - go as low as £29.
But needs must. The Green Pantry is around £70 for 10 kg, so it balances the cost of that out a bit. And I'm not sure keeping K on a low fat diet, for convenience for me, is good for her.
I know we discounted AADF, but it scores 60% on there. Which makes me feel better, even though I don't rate their scoring system. 🙈 Damn my silly brain. 😂

Fingers crossed she likes it @SpanielsGalore - mine won't touch tripe. Once wasted nearly a tenner on some expensive green and wilds tripe chews at a national trust place and had to give them away. (I can't say I blame them tbh!)

It does look to be a decent food @SpanielsGalore at a sensible price, which is important with multiple dogs who need different foods. That's a factor for us now also.

I tried Brie on Green Pantry in the summer, a lamb one. DP rated it, he thought she was good on it, so maybe we'll do an occasional bag as a treat to supplement her Calibra.

I know exactly what you mean about AADF - I was on there about a week ago showing DP that while the Royal Canin Giant puppy only scores 35%, the Calibra Life Junior is 62%. I'm also a sceptic, but in some ways it does have relevance.

@tizwozliz Mine all eat tripe sticks, so I am hopeful that K will like it. They have all given the bag a good sniff anyway.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet P does well on the GP White Fish, but it's so expensive.

ETA Just threw a cup full of the new Tripe food on the lawn and all three are eating it, so that looks promising. Got to pray for solid poos now and a shiny coat. 🤞

I only bought a 5kg bag of the Green Pantry @SpanielsGalore , it was the Joint Support one, lamb with turmeric. It was about £36 I think, so weight for weight it is costly.

That does sound hopeful about the tripe food. I hope it's a success.

@Silverbirchleaf - fantastic... another one hooked on Agility! Yeh course walking is interesting. I do Agility with both dogs, but because they are soo different, I have to run them very differently. Then you have to consider your own preferences and the dogs strength and weaknesses. And don't get me started on the notorious tunnel traps! I am slowly moving over to more distance handling which should make things easier- at least in theory. My boy is a bit like WTF, you better come with me and the girl looks at me like yeah I know you are slow, but just standing around isn't cutting it.

@SpanielsGalore oh I know all about Spaniels! From my armchair I have observed them and decided that they are crazy dogs. I know, most people think Tibetans are terriers, but I can reassure you, they have a very low prey drive and no terrier traits. It's something that attracted me to thr breed. If you Google Tibetan Terrier, you should be able to see them in full coat. My boy is only short because he hates being brushed. But there is nothing like a Tibetan in full coat!

@Ylvamoon maybe not then, although I will say they are a beautiful breed.

I very much rely on 'food' as a reward! One of my friends has a Mali (I've mentioned before on these threads so you might already know) and honestly its idea of 'reward' appears to be leaving her in bruises. Not sure what I would do if I had a dog that didn't consider food a reward. Cry? Run away?😂I think I could work with a ball though...maybe.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet glad to hear the second witching hour didn't happen! Bless Brie & her face planting. I meant to ask, how is her lead ragging these days? Is she still doing it? Or is she calming down?

@SpanielsGalore Satan is only 10ishkg...and I notice her. A lot. 😫

I'm sure you've said before that P is a little killer...but I just don't see it when I look at her face. It's too sweet.

I'm feeling a bit hurt that everyone is laughing at me being saddled with toilet training. 😫But it is my fault. I really didn't think about it, because I don't really 'toilet train' mine...they just watch the adults and learn from them. Perhaps puppy will be smart and do the same?

I'm currently trying to talk my mum down from naming it 'Fortuna'...Satan has a Roman goddess name and it appears she wants to stick with the trend. But Fortuna!? Poor thing will be bullied by all the other dogs.

I met a Golden Retriever puppy (okay, 14 months but a puppy by Golden growth) this morning. It was smaller than any of my girls. Ohhh to have a Golden that small. That beinhg said, it was even more of a twat that Twatdog, and that's saying something. Was running around mine like a loon. Didn't even seem to want to play with them...just run around 😳Then it tripped over it's own paws and face planted into a muddy puddle.

So, Odilon's witching hour is now established and is always when I'm cooking dinner and we are settling down to eat. And of course DP, being male, cannot multitask sufficiently to keep puppy occupied and out of my way 🙄

Yes @TheHungryHungryLandsharks , Brie is still lead ragging, and no, not calming down at all. I don't think she ever will. Complete total hooligan when she gets on that big field. I'm just thankful that her pavement walking is so good. But I'm like your friend with the Mali, covered in bruises and scratches.
Training with food just doesn't work for me and now Odilon is, if anything, even less food orientated than Brie. He hardly eats and it's a mystery how he is so heavy. Zero interest in any sort of treat even the "high value" ones like sausage or cheese.
And though Brie loves a spiny ball to chase, the boy was bored with that after two days. Two days! I mean, what do you do? Kong? Nope. Puzzle thing we were given? Nope. Gave him a cardboard box with some treats in and he plunked it straight into his water bowl and walked away. So I haven't yet found what motivates him aside from cuddles and talk.

Hmmm. Fortuna. So would it be Tuna for short? Not that I can really criticise anyone else's name choice when my neighbour said of the boy "you can't call it that, it sounds like dildo..."😳So yeah, Fortuna sounds absolutely fine.

Thinking about training without food. Partly motivated by what @Ylvamoon and @TheHungryHungryLandsharks said earlier, partly because Odo isn't a foodie and walks start in 10 days time. Just looking on YouTube out of curiosity and every video about training without food seems to focus on teaching or encouraging your non food orientated dog to learn to be food motivated. WTF? I mean what if you actually prefer to train without food? There's no training videos that properly cover it. It's a bit of a weird one.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I thought the options were food, a favourite toy or verbal praise and a fuss.
Mine are happy with a fuss as an occasional alternative, but food is the winner. They couldn't give a toss about toys outside of the house.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Can you tell DMum we've vetoed Tuna?

I met a very small GR a few months ago. I'd say she was springer sized. I thought she was a puppy, but she was 3 years old. They're breeding her next year.

@Ylvamoon I googled Tibetans. They must take a lot of grooming when in full coat. I think yours looks much better.

I took all of the dogs down to the field by the sea front at lunchtime. Three women came into the field with at least 6 spaniels. One of the gold cockers came racing across the field towards K. Just before it reached her, P shot across from the right. She ran straight across in front of him, and body blocked him. Nudging his chest with her shoulder. He got the messge. Stopped dead in his tracks and went nowhere near K.
Never seen her do anything like it before. She's usually the most submissive (for want of a better word) dog out there. I know you'll all be shocked when I say K is much fiestier. 😂

@CoubousAndTourmaIet maybe he's just so excited by the smell of your cooking it makes him witchy? 😁If so, quite the compliment!!!

Do you think her lead ragging is just happiness? If she only does it in particular places (i.e. not on pavements), it well could be?

The only way I can think to make a non food orientated dog actually food orientated would be to withhold all food? Which seems rather...odd.

Honestly, I quite like Fortuna...the more I say it, the more I like it. 😳Although what sounds like dildo!? Neither Brie nor Odilon sound like dildo. Perhaps your neighbour is hard of hearing?

@SpanielsGalore Ohh a teeny tiny Golden! I do sometimes look at mine and wish they were a bit smaller. Cuddles are particularly...difficult. I end up squashed.

Ohhh bless P! What a good (and gentle and mannered) girl. Why do you think she did it?!

Oh gosh, that was weird with P blocking a dog from her little "sister" @SpanielsGalore I wonder what went through her mind. His body language must have told her something threatening, presumably, but that is intriguing...

Yes, @TheHungryHungryLandsharks , the lead ragging is definitely playful exuberance because she's in her happy place on the far end of the big meadow. She does this funny little backwards hop and head shake thing. It cracks me up, although DP is not amused at either of us 🙄Although she's generally quiet, she has a very cheeky sense of fun. She loves to "ambush" me when I'm pegging laundry on the line. She's very playful for a LGD.

Odilon/Dill/Odo/dildo's "Witching Hour" was awful this evening. I swear half the neighbourhood must have been able to hear it 😱 PMD puppies are never this vocal and it does worry me slightly at this point, but hopefully he'll calm down. If not, I think we'll be ostracised and have to go and live on a tiny island somewhere with no neighbours for 50 miles 😬

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks and @CoubousAndTourmaIet

I have no idea why P reacted the way she did. She's always approached other dogs slowly, lying down and crawling towards them. And she'll ask to be picked up before getting involved in any untoward behaviour.
The dog didn't look threatening to me. Just an exuberant youngster, running at full pelt. Perhaps she thought he was a young whipper snapper who needed putting in his place. Who knows what goes through that dog's head?!

Interestingly, she also happily mingled with all the dogs for a few minutes afterwards. She usually doesn't cope with large groups and asks to be picked up if there's more than three other dogs present.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I hope Odo finds his volume control button soon. Does he have a big deep bark for a little pup? Or is it high pitched and yappy?
I hope things are going well other than that and Brie is beginning to like him a little.

You're probably right that P was just putting a cocky young dog in his place and it sounds good that they interacted afterwards @SpanielsGalore

Nope, sadly still a horribly piercing yappy puppy bark and we'll be very thankful when his voice deepens, although our neighbours may not necessarily feel the same...😟

10 weeks old today and he was dry through the night, so we're pretty happy with that! My theory about PMD boys being quicker to toilet train than girls still stands.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Hope the witching hour wasn’t too bad this evening.

Confession time, I’ve had a dog-free week. Been in the south-west for a holiday with dh and (young adult) dc and had a lovely time. As Dog doesn’t travel, he’s been at a home boarders. Had a lovely week, good weather, visited lots of lovely places, nice walks and good pub food.

Collected Dog yesterday. He was a bit hyper on the walk home then calmed down. However, he’s been a little subdued since. I keep telling myself he’s tired after all the excitement of other dogs, toys to play with, a huge garden to explore etc, and he’s just overtired and decompressing. It must be like going on a PGA outward bound holiday for him and now he’s come home to his boring house…

@SpanielsGalore P must have seen or felt something then (Which sounds a bit 'woo' but you know what I mean)! Or perhaps she was being possessive over K?

@CoubousAndTourmaIet that's so lovely that it's just playful and happy. It must be nice to know she has her 'happy place'. Pretty sure for mine their happy place is their food bowl...

Oh gosh. What was he doing that was so bad? Do you think maybe he's barking for her attention? Twatdog used to do that to Satan (never went down well). He only learned not to after we just let her go for it one day (obviously he was fine and she has no teeth).

@Silverbirchleaf did you miss him a lot?! Did you go out for walks without him? Tbf as much as I love my dogs, it can be quite draining often having to take them everywhere with you - so going out for meals etc without him must have been lovely!

Separately, I hope my DDs when they're young adults will still come on holiday with me! I love full family holidays.

I'm trying out a new coffee shop today. DH went yesterday and claimed that the pastry was poison so he couldn't save half for me.

Glad you had a lovely week away @Silverbirchleaf Hopefully Dog will settle back into his normal routine now you're back home.

It's just normal manic puppy zoomies @TheHungryHungryLandsharks but he's very vocal and Brie has never been fond of barky dogs, so she's finding it hard.

We had another bad night, he had us awake at 2.30 and took an hour to settle 😫Never had a pup like this before, they've all been pretty easy after the first couple of nights. Now we need to figure out how to avoid our most difficult/demanding puppy turning into our most difficult adult...😨As far as training goes, there is little out there focused on training giants (aside from an Irish Wolfhound guy on YouTube). Whatever any of the big name dog trainers have to say on giants is mostly derogatory, which is a pity. General puppy advice is not working thus far. I'm dumping the Royal Canin in the bin and we'll see if that helps to calm him.

The little tyrant has just been intently listening to next doors dog doing growly play (it's a ball focused border collie). They were away last week so our little one has only just clocked that there's a dog next door and he was all big eyed and looking to me as if "is this okay, mummy?". Only one more week until he gets to see dogs out and about so that'll be interesting.

Sorry to hear you had an unsettled night. We had the same although not because we have a squishy puppy to enjoy.

Big pup ripped her dew claw half off yesterday, it didn't seem to be bothering her until bedtime and then she was up and down all night, she was desperate to go into the car so I put her in the boot at 4am. Booked the emergency vet and went there at 8, she managed to dislodge the remaining bit of dew claw on the way, so jumped out at the vets full of beans, got to reception and explained and they said that there wasn't really anything more the vet would do now that there wasn't anything to remove so she got fusses and biscuits from reception and we went home again!

Lead walks only for a while, as it needs to be clean and dry. No idea how long these things take to heal. We're going to go to the shopping outlet for a mooch around and coffee and a pup cup whilst OH takes little one out.

Sympathies on the ripped dewclaw @tizwozliz , it is a pain, even aside from the disruption of emergency vets. The biggest difficulty is trying to keep it clean, particularly in wet weather when there's mud everywhere. Merlin ripped his badly one day, jumping up at a stone wall to greet a neighbour. I still remember blood dripping all over the patio and us rushing him to the vet. I can't remember how long it took to heal though. Sorry.
Obviously your girls are much more active - plus they love water - so she is going to find it rather restricting having to stick to pavement walks. Also the current wet spell won't help much. Hopefully it won't take too long.

The irony for us is that we have a breed with double dewclaws but, aside from forming "iceballs" when walking in snow, it's never those that give any problems, it's always the "thumbs" on the front that get caught, snagged and ripped.

@Silverbirchleaf Glad you had a lovely holiday. Sounds like Dog enjoyed his holiday too. I'm sure you are right and he's decompressing after his busy week.
We used to holiday in the SW a lot when we lived in the Midlands. Looe is one of my favourite places on earth. It makes me sad to think I might not visit again. I'm working on getting my eldest to transfer there for work, so I can visit. (He's currently in Bristol. Not what I'd call a holiday destination.)

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks I do know what you mean. She must have seen something I didn't. Or maybe thought he needed to learn some manners. Approaching another dog head on at 90mph is not the politest of greetings.

When does DMum get Fortuna? Has she found a puppy or is she at the looking stage? I imagine you know which breeders you'd want a puppy from already.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Sorry you are having a rough time with O over night. I'm sorry, but I have no advice to offer either. P woke up for a wee during the night for months and that was bad enough. Fortunately she went straight back to sleep.

I wouldn't worry that difficult puppy = difficult adult though. I truly hated P as a puppy. But she grew into a very well behaved adult. I mean she's a stubborn bugger at times and has ruined my garden. But in terms of meeting people and dogs when out and about, she's brilliant.

@tizwozliz Poor Big Pup. That sounds painful. How strange she wanted to go in the car. But good the remaining bit came off and saved you an OOH vet bill. (I'm assuming they didn't charge, since they didn't do anything.)
I hope it doesn't take too long to heal. I have a roll of that sport tape stuff (looks like vet wrap) for N. Could you use something like that to keep it clean and dry on walks?

I have finally taken the dog cage down from in the living room. I was half tempted to leave it up, as N and P have been sleeping in it in the evenings. But then I realised it's in my Christmas tree corner, so it had to go.

4° here this morning, but at least it's blue skies and sunshine. N and P have spent the last hour outside, trashing the garden. K is curled up asleep on my lap. 😇

@SpanielsGalore - yes, no charge for the vets. We have some vet wrap which I might use if it's wet but it's dry and sunny at the moment so should be fine if we stick to pavements. We also have some long socks/boots just not sure if I'd get one on without hurting her Luckily big pup is excellent on lead so should be ok. Just a bit more awkward if having to take them out separately. We have mantrailing at the tram museum this week and she should still be ok to do that so that will be a bit of variety.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet - rear dew claws freak me out as they're all dangly and unattached!

Thanks for the reassurance @SpanielsGalore , it's a relief to know that difficult pup doesn't always necessarily equate to a demanding adult dog.

The dewclaws aren't really dangly, they're very firmly attached @tizwozliz . They are quite functional on rock or in snow particularly. The puppy ones are very cute.

Dry and bright here too, I have washing out, although I know washing on a Sunday is supposedly unlucky according to many on MN.