Crate v pen v sofa

[Lostearrings]

More advice, please, on the puppy we’re getting in a couple of weeks as I can’t get my head around this.
We want to crate train our puppy with a view to him sleeping in their overnight and going in there when we’re out for short periods during the day. Our downstairs is largely open plan so I had thought of putting the crate in a pen so that, if I need to do a work call or we have a tradesman around or something, the puppy (and eventually the dog!) can be in a confined area which we know is safe but which isn’t as restrictive as just being in his pen. We also know that he will end up being on the sofa with us when we’re on the sofa (and no doubt when we’re not too!).
How do we manage all of this? Do we start off with him just being in his crate and, once we’ve had him a few months and, hopefully, have him well trained introduce the pen? Or can we do that from day one?
Will letting him nap on the sofa from the start undermine attempts to get him in the crate?
I can ask our puppy trainer eventually but we’ll have had him for almost three weeks before we start going to sessions.
Thanks!

https://themuttyprofessor.co.uk/blog/to-crate-or-not-to-crate-your-dog/

Dogs are polyphasic sleepers. This means they sleep in short periods, like to get up and move around, and change positions. Changing surfaces that they sleep on also helps them regulate their temperature. Therefore, crating dogs goes against their natural way of sleeping and removes all options of them fulfilling this instinctive behaviour.

imagine someone caging you into your double bed for several hours, and not being able to walk around, move to a cooler spot, get up and go to the bathroom…

I won't comment on crates as it's a very divisive subject (mine are crate trained but absolutely do not sleep in crates as I think it's bad for growth development in a large breed), but puppies should not be on the sofa.

I've known puppies jump off them and break their legs. Their joints are too fragile to risk it. Please don't have your puppy on the sofa, just sit on the floor with them 😊

All of my puppies were crate trained. Two of my dogs saw crates as their safe spaces and continued to use them for their whole lives.
My latest two slept in them overnight until they were 5 ish months old. Now one sleeps in a bed beside my bed and the other one sleeps on my bed.

I think crate training has its uses. My 4 year old is currently on crate rest following an operation and it helps that she is used to being in one. I do use big crates, so they have plenty of room to move around and stretch out.

I think using a pen depends on what breed you are getting. Larger breeds may be able to knock it over or climb over it. And I think a tiny puppy could squeeze through the bars of mine.

All of my puppies have slept on my lap or the sofa during the day 🙈, but still been happy being crated overnight.

My dog is crate trained. He doesn't sleep in there at night and he very rarely goes in there when I go out but he does go in for an hour after every walk because he cannot self settle.

He slept in there at night when he was younger andy went in there when I went out when he was younger and couldn't be trusted.

i think it's a really useful skill for dogs to have.If you need to put them away, if you have someone working at the house.If you have your child's friend round who is scared of dogs.If they have to go in a crate at the vets for any reason

I don't think you need to think prescriptively about it.Just do what works for you and your dog when it arrives x

Your dog will have no trouble learning the rules - in the crate when you say, on the sofa when you allow. Use the crate for all times you can’t supervise, unless you want all your stuff chewed, so nights, work calls, when you go out. Allow on the sofa with you, but not without, or pup will either leap off and injure himself, or chew the cushions to bits. The rest of the time I assume pup will potter around with you getting in the way. We used baby gates to close off non access areas. Puppy pens are only good while pup is v small and after that fall over.
ETA most dogs can be trusted after 2yo without the crate. Use till then.

Our puppy is crate trained, he is a16 week old minature poodle. We are mainly open plan downstairs.

When I am WFH or if we have a visitor who doesnt like dogs I have a gate at the end of the breakfast bar dividing the kitchen so he spends time in there (essentially like a pen), his crate is in there so he usually lays in crate (door open) but doesn't object to being shut in crate if we chose to.

In an evening we often lift him on our lap on sofa, he sometimes snuggles but other times won't settle so we lift him down and he will either lay on floor or wander off to his crate.

So, in short... he alternates floor/sofa/crate quite happily and had done that combination since we got him 😊

Ours was crate trained by the breeder and we continued it for approx 4 years, which was probably too long but we had an elderly cat and I wanted to protect both the cat and the dog from it. It was initially her safe space away from the kids if she needed it. Any small visitors were told if she is in there you leave her alone.
We trained ours to get off the sofa when told so that never became an issue.
She had her own bed in the living room, and in our bedroom which she would sleep in until the sun came up and then front legs up on my side, tail wagging and hitting the wardrobe for me to say up or when older help her up, when she would snuggle in with us.
I would gate off your stairs to help prevent injuries and damaging young joints

i’d put the crate in the pen, and close the crate when you want him to sleep, and put the puppy in the pen with the crate door open when you don’t.

Our Dog is three years old and still chooses to sleep in his crate most days at some point, although the door is kept open. However, if we go out , he’ll happily stay in there (with door closed).

Crate trained 11 week old puppy here. They are really useful in terms of getting them settled and feeling like they have a safe space. Ours sleeps in there at night. We don’t have a pen, but I can see the benefit of it if you are working at home for example. Puppies sleep a lot! We found as PP said they like to move around to temperature regulate so under the situation where you are needing to work etc I would use a pen too and just close the cage at night.

And yes watch the sofa situation with their legs. Ours is not allowed upstairs out of print but puppies should not be using stairs either.

When mine was a pup we cordoned off a quarter of the living room with tall panels and he slept and ate in there. He would also stay in there when were out or had workmen round. In the evening we sat on the floor with him for a few weeks, but by the time he was around 4-5 months he could get on and off the sofa himself. We did away with the panels at a year old and now he sleeps on the floor or sofa. Luckily he's never been a destructive dog.

Our dogs are crate trained, dog1 always takes himself to sleep in his crate ddog2 prefers the comfort of our sofa.