Beyond Adolescence - part 2

[SpanielsGalore]

No point banning coffee, as it didn't work last time. 🙄
Haven't had any cake updates from a while. @VanGoSunflowers Have you stopped baking already? You still had 8 cakes to go to make it economical.

@YorkshireFelix Just looked up P's sire and he's fathered 93 litters. He was very busy in 2021and averaged one a week. And that's not including the litters he sired in America.
I know it's come up in discussion before, but I do think there should be restrictions on the sires too. The COI is never going to come down when so many puppies are related.

@brushingboots Congratulations on the book listing. You must be so proud.
Please don't name a dog after a laxative. 🙈 😂

Taper man finished yesterday, so we've had the house to ourselves today, which has been lovely. Colour selection resumes tomorrow. The walls currently look like a rainbow, with pink, orange, green, blue and red paint samples on them. 😂

The weather has been pretty wet here today, with several showers of hailstones. So I haven't walked the arthritic pair and just took the Ninja out.

The vet phoned this evening. None of the local vets are willing to attempt the joint tap. So it will have to be a referral to Aberdeen or Inverness. She said they could sedate P for the journey. But I'd probably need to find someone to look in on the other two. It's a 2.5 hour round trip, plus appointment time.
I'm not sure what to do. Her ligaments have thickened and no one knows why without investigating. I'll talk to the physio on Saturday and see what she thinks.
But her sensitivity to noise has ramped up again and she's doing a lot of lip licking and smacking, so I assume something is bothering her. 🤷‍♀️

@YorkshireFelix no worries, I went off on a bit of a tangent rant (as always)!

It's not unusual for good studs to have sired lots of litters. I think Twatdog's sire is on about 100 but most of them are 2 litters with the same bitch and across Europe (he's based in Italy) and they only use fully health tested bitches with low scores, so they're quite careful. Lots of breeders aren't that careful.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet jeepers! How cold is it where you are? I've had to defrost the car the last few days, but it's not been too icy (yet).

I know what you mean about demonisation. It's hard to know with that story, but I am getting really annoyed with the dog hate and large dog hate more broadly - I think we've both complained about this before. Other than the Doberman, the only dogs to ever attack mine have been Jack Russels, Chis and Pugs.

@brushingboots congrats!!

It's so cold here this morning. Sorry @SpanielsGalore but I did have to get my tripple shot, extra-hot, cappuccino this morning on my way into the office. Yes, I am one of those awful people who wants my coffee undrinkably hot - because for me that's the right temperature for it to be! But @VanGoSunflowers my usual coffee people have upped their prices again, so I am really sad. I know they have no choice as when people begin to worry about finances they start cutting back on non-essentials, like coffee, but I worry they're going to be priced out the market. And I refuse to drink the costa coffee in the work canteen - I want coffee, no battery acid. 😤

It was -4.8 here when we got up @TheHungryHungryLandsharks , currently -3 according to my phone and we have an ice warning in effect until midday.

Totally agree about the demonising breeds - same here exactly - always pugs and Jack Russells that have a go at our lot, I'd also add Dachshunds, Border Terriers and, currently, cockerpoos but that's possibly down to the sheer numbers of them. I'd say roughly 50% of the dogs we meet now are some sort of doodle/poo type thing.

With regard to stud dogs, it also very much depends on breed registration numbers @YorkshireFelix @SpanielsGalore Some breeds have the gene pool for studs to be used dozens of times but others don't. Obviously if your breed has below 100 registrations annually it wouldn't be desirable for the same stud dog to be siring more than one (or max two) litter(s) in a year, even if it was a grand champion. There are many factors, it's not just down to breeders being careful, with certain breeds they have to look at the wider picture and the inbreeding co-efficient, in addition to the health testing.

Sorry that things are so difficult with P currently @SpanielsGalore , it sounds really stressful for both of you 😔 I hope the physio can help with the decision about further investigation...

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I think we've discussed COI before! Lots of people on MN seem to really dislike higher COI. But, to me, as long as it's not astronomically high...i'd rather fully health tested parents, with excellent scores, who are more closely related than fully health tested parents with terrible scores who aren't related!

Eris's COI is above average (only by 2ish%), but then I expect the rest of her scores to be as good as Pen's are...can never be certain, but I am reasonably confident. But lots of people on MN would swerve her future litters for that and then buy a puppy from parents with terrible scores

I think that really, there just needs to be tougher regulation on breeding and sadly the KC need to be a part of that as they are part of the problem. Someone breeding a dog with 2/2 elbow scores? No. No registration for them. And then people would know that the KC thing actually meant something.

It says it's 6 in London, but it doesn't feel like it!

@SpanielsGalore I didn't see you post about P! That's rotten that it'll have to be a long car journey for her, but I suppose better than risking a vet who isn't confident doing the surgery doing it? Let us know how P gets on at the physio?

The reaction to Boo in Europe was generally really positive @TheHungryHungryLandsharks He was very popular in German service stations weirdly. Italy is one of those places that comes at the top of being dog friendly, and I think that's a lot to do with the fact they generally see dogs as dogs. Boo decided to bark while we were sitting outside a restaurant. I was mortified as he doesn't generally bark much outside, but the owner shrugged and said "just a dog being a dog, they are less trouble than some people". There are lots of handbag type dogs in some of the smarter cities, but outside that there are lots of working dogs. They obviously have some of the bigger breeds too, and so I don't think generally they saw Boo as a particularly 'threatening' breed. We get less 'staffy/bully hate' generally though I think. That might be because he's clearly very friendly, although he's muscly he's sleek and 'ripped' rather than bulky and tbh we probably don't look like typical staffy owners - awful as that sounds.
We completely avoided France @CoubousAndTourmaIet based on the legislation. I'd managed to convince myself that he'd be gunned downed by an over-officious gendarme. I found the difficulty trying to work out the rules in different parts of the same country. We muzzle trained and carried a muzzle just in case, but we were fine.

Congratulations on the book @brushingboots

Very glad my DP didn't think of the F1 naming, or Boo might have had his name changed to Nigel.

@SpanielsGalore that is a long trip to the vets. Do you have someone who can look after the other two? I’d ask the physio too and see what she thinks. I know I keep saying this but poor P 😭 I feel so bad for her.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks it’s so tough with pricing. We’ve been talking to other independents around here and everyone is struggling, but then there’s a fine balance between upping prices and essentially pricing yourself out. At the restaurant our turnover this year has been the best yet (we are in year 4) but profit has been non-existent. The past few months we’ve been putting 1k a week into the business from our day jobs just to cover costs and stay afloat. The cost of everything (bills, ingredients etc) has shot up so much it’s unreal. One of our friends runs a very popular coffee shop and said they survived Covid lockdowns and everything else that has been going on the past few years but the current climate is the worst yet. Our lease is up for renewal at the start of 2027 and we will be happily handing the keys back and calling it a day!!

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks@CoubousAndTourmaIet@SpanielsGalore Also interesting re stud dogs. I have no idea about any of this. I counted and he’s on 111 so far since mid-2019. I find it funny that V has so many half siblings in the world. I was doing some research on him last night and he seems very high regarded in the trialling world and has produced lots of champions…. and then there’s Vinny 😂

Thank you all! It is a much needed boost.

2 degrees here and the mud is melting. Had to take the truck for a convoluted drive before the walk this morning to charge the battery as otherwise it will die and might do anyway, so drove around the fast but well gritted roads for half an hour wasting fuel (ugh) vaguely en route to a walk before the plumber rang to say he would early had to abort, go home and let him in and then go on a walk on foot. But at least the car has been for its walk 🤨

Really appreciating my dry robe dupe as only my face is cold! It's really come into its own this week.

And I didn't know the other non-F1 reference! Off the list!

@BackToLurk that makes sense. When DH and I lived in Italy (a very long time ago), we found that every apartment block was dog friendly. Friends who work there now all have dogs in flats and there's no issue with moving dogs through at all. So I'm not surprised Europe more broadly is pretty sensible- although that being said, I wouldn't have been unsurprised if they weren't as people seem to have gone a bit nutty about dogs in recent years!

I do know what you mean about 'looking like' particular breed type owners! People do judge even without meaning to. I try not to do it as one of my friends is (in her words) a 'bit rough' and has a Mali - and I know people would judge her based on her appearance and the dog, even though the dog is immaculately trained and friendly - but it can be hard not to IYSWIM.

@YorkshireFelix I'm sorry you're finding things hard. As you say, it's that tricky point of finding the right price to still be viable without pricing yourself out. I think people don't really appreciate how expensive owning a business is either and that everything they are feeling pinched by (rising food costs, bills, insurance) businesses feel and more as they also have NI increases etc.

The only thing that makes me even remotely happy is that in my local town, everyone is swerving the bigger stores and starting to go to independent ones but that's likely due to the customer service being better (family owned businesses just care more) and the prices still being cheaper than their high-street brand competitors.

'And then there's Vinny.' Poor Vinny being so unfairly maligned 😀I think for the less popular breeds, as @CoubousAndTourmaIet says, the breeders tend to be careful as they can't afford for anything to go wrong. Whereas with the bigger breeds, there's just more unscrupulous breeders...

@brushingboots I know nothing about cars, so how does driving help the battery? Sorry if that's a stupid question!

I've been debating my own dry-robe dupe, but I don't want to give MIL or DMum any ideas (although as I said I think DMum is already wise to me).

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks The 'surgery' is sticking a needle into her knee and drawing out fluid. Because her ligaments are swollen/thickened, they are frightened of hitting something and causing more damage. I thought one of the vets had done it for N, but actually I think she said she would do it, but then didn't.

@YorkshireFelix This is part of the problem. I don't have any one to mind the others. Previously DS has been around, so he'd be at home and I'd spend the day in the big city. Even with to-ing and fro-ing, they'd be on their own for at least 3 hours in the morning and again in the afternoon. I know they'd survive. It's just not ideal.

V's sire puts P's to shame. His 93 are spread over 8 years. Mind you. That includes a couple of years being out of the country, sowing his oats.

Sorry your business is struggling. It must be so disheartening for you both.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet It's difficult to know the numbers of registrations for cocker spaniels, since working and show strain are lumped in together. (I think.)

@BackToLurk Where I lived in England, most of the staffies were walked by youths in shell suits, wearing gold chains and drinking cans of Stella. I can only think of one owned by a female. Fortunately I think times have changed since then.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Driving it charges it up – in theory at least. I think I have an issue whereby the car isn't charging the battery properly – if I left it in these temperatures a day without driving it fast somewhere to charge it, I think it is very likely that it would kill the battery totally and I'd need a new one. I kissed the steering wheel this morning when it turned on! I've had several mornings in winters past of it not turning on at all.

Highs of 8 tomorrow though and rain forecast so hopefully I will be off car walking duty again for a few days.

@brushingboots Perhaps you need a new battery. They do have a shelf life. I thought it was 8 years, but Google says 3 - 5.

@SpanielsGalore I've had a new battery every year for the last three or four years – I'm sure it's the car killing the batteries! This one is only 11 months old so there's no way it can be caput, yet the car flashed its battery warning message this morning when it turned on. They're always still in warranty when they're swapped but it doesn't make it any less irritating to deal with.

😱😱 In that case, I agree. You have a charging problem. Sounds like a right pain TBH. Cars are great whilst they work and shite when they don't.

@SpanielsGalore They are and it is! We pay for mega RAC cover (for the older truck which, ironically, doesn't ever have battery trouble) so I can always get sorted but it's just inconvenient and invariably something I end up having to do on my own which makes me feel like a pathetic woman with no skillset. Which isn't true, I'm just not a mechanic.

Could you put it on a trickle charge @brushingboots?

Have you got parasitic battery drain @brushingboots ? It's a curse. Our Octavia keeps dying - we've had 3 batteries to alternate and now bought a charger.
Congrats on the success of your book, that's brilliant!
Oh yes, me too with Senna as a name. Senna pods 😝Spose you could go with Sienna as an alternative?

@YorkshireFelix That's such a shame about your lovely business not being viable long term, but completely understandable that you would have to make that decision, given how costs of everything are rising.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Obviously you are far, far more clued up on COI and genetic testing/hip & elbow scoring than I will ever be!!!
I know there's a lot more to it than just looking up scores and COI. Truthfully I'm probably talking bollocks most of the time 😁I should 🤐and leave it to the experts.
However, I will say that FWIW, Algy & Brie both came from parents with low hip and elbow scores, both low COI and probably overall the soundest dogs we've had.

@BackToLurk
That's interesting. Do you encounter more hostility in the UK? I'm never sure if the level of big dog hate on social media and mn in particular is representative of reality. As you and @TheHungryHungryLandsharks say, your own type can also make a massive difference to how you are perceived though. I haven't fared too badly overall.

@SpanielsGalore oh that is rotten. I am sorry ❤How is P doing today?

@brushingboots is your car electric? Or am I being really really thick and just not understanding how cars work. I have to confess, my car understanding is limited to adding screen wash and petrol...

I think mine is one that if you brake, it charges something? But I am not sure. I just nodded along when it was explained to me.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I think it is really different when you have a rarer breed as more care is taken - breeders breed for the love of the breed because there's not as much money in it (i.e. they could churn out litters all they want, in theory, but if there's no buyers why bother and that lack of buyers keeps the greeders away)! And don't leave it to the 'experts' I'm hardly one - I only know about Goldies (and a bit about labs just by nature of so many of the issues being the same...and a bit on Cockers due to all the research we did when Satan arrived).

Speaking of Satan, DMum took her to the vets today and texted me at lunch to confirm that Satan is going blind. We knew her eyesight wasn't great as she's been walking into things for a while, but we hadn't really grasped just how blind she was. She lost DMum on a walk the other day...even though DMum was stood about 2ft away and yelling for her, Satan sprinted off in the other direction and got quite distressed as she got further away - probably because DMums voice got fainter and she couldn't work out where DMum was. It was only when I rushed after and grabbed her that she calm down. She clung to us the entire walk after that - literally walking against our legs.

She's lost her sight completely in one eye, the vet thinks, and it's almost gone in the other eye. It was slightly expected (given her very problematic background), but I am gutted for Satan as it feels like another thing she has to suffer through.

Oh poor little Satan @TheHungryHungryLandsharks . How old is she? I can't remember if you've said... That's going to be so hard for her - and for your mum.

We just ended up staying local today and going onto the big meadow field, because the pavements and footpaths were still so icy at 3pm. We had two people separately chase after us to give Brie a cuddle. I think she must somehow look more appealing in wintry weather - like a baby Polar Bear.

Fire is lit now and we're settling down for the evening.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet It's hard to know as she's a rescue. She'd had at least two litters, they think, before she was found by Spaniel Aid so she was at least 3/4 then, and she's been Satan-ing away with my mum for about 8 years. So best guess is around 11ish and the vets seem to think that's about right. She'll be okay, I know that...but still, it's just rotten for her.

Can we have a Brie pic? 😊I don't blame them for chasing you, I bet cuddling such a fluffy dog in this weather is just lovely. I can't believe how icy it is near you. We've had frozen cars but no frozen pavements or roads yet (thankfully).

Meanwhile, I am finally heading home. It's bitterly chilly in London tonight. But I have sausage casserole (my comfort meal) and dog cuddles to look forward to. Then tomorrow, dog walking with Satan - so lots of cuddles on the agenda for her whether she likes it or not - and it's mostly not. She puts up with cuddles from me, but she's a mummy's girl at heart.

Aww poor Satan, that is sad. I thought she was much younger than that. I had 8 in my head but it must be because you’ve said in the past your mum has had her 8 years.

@CoubousAndTourmaIetBrie is the ultimate winter babe. I think I’d be running after you to give her a cuddle too. Not sure V would be best pleased!

Thanks @YorkshireFelix

TBF other than the grey on her face she still looks very young and she’s still doing huge walks every day. I was looking at photos of her last night and I am quite surprised by how I didn’t notice the PRA before - it’s so evident in’ photos.

Hope everyone has lovely weekend plans! It’s lovely here - freezing winds but no rain, which means no one to be seen on the morning walk 😊

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Poor little Satan. 💔 I hate to see them panic when they think they've lost you. When N arrived, she did it for months if she lost sight of me in the garden. Yesterday she lost me in the woods and instead of panicking, she stood and looked around for me. It's a small thing, but I'm taking it as a massive win. I like to think it means she's now confident that I'm not going to abandon her. But I could be talking shit. 🤷‍♀️ 😂

Had an interesting zoom chat with the nutritionist last night. She thinks the thickened ligaments are caused by a bacterial infection. Which has then caused the pancreatitis and the pyometra. She says the anal glands issues are because of the restricted movement in the leg and hip. As she's stiff and sore, she can't squat properly, so is doing small poos instead of healthy big ones. (That explains why N's are in sections too. I was only thinking last week, K is the only one how does long poos.)
She also agreed the behavioural issues around food, noise and travel are all connected to her pain. She thinks P possibly over stretched for the initial piece of toast and pain shot down her back. And that has escalated to me and all food I offer her being the root of all evil.
So we have a cocktail of supplements to give her. Some to be made into a special soup, which her meals will be soaked in. Others in tablet form. Some things are to restore gut health and soothe the pancreas. Some to help the anal glands. And some for healthy joints to help the knee.
So my Amazon basket is full and my bank account is empty. 😢 But hopefully it will help P be happier and healthier. 🤞
Because if her knee doesn't get better and the ligaments snap in her 'good' leg, it will more than likely be the end of the road. A life on wheels may suit some dogs, but I don't believe it's a good quality life for a working cocker.

Off to physio. Hope you all have lovely days. 😊

Oh bless her @TheHungryHungryLandsharks , she's very cute even if she is a devil in disguise. I love her Claudia W fringe 😆

Wow! That was a pretty in-depth consultation by the sound of it @SpanielsGalore and it probably all makes a lot of sense. Let's hope the supplements help, because she's still such a young dog, with her whole life ahead of her and the other possibility just doesn't bear thinking about 😔 I hope her physio session goes well.

It's much milder here this morning, which, inevitably for the Pennines, means drizzle. We were out for a few minutes before 7 but Milady de Winter got very wet and is unimpressed, so she ate her breakfast and went back to sleep. We'll get out for a proper walk later. The cows have been moved from the top fields so that gives us a lot more scope for walks from home.

@SpanielsGalore Considering getting a physio to look at Dog, for similar anxiety and car travels. However, he’s more than happy doing dog agility, so not convinced, but it was suggested to us.

@SpanielsGalore I think you're 100% right, with N and Satan is sounds like they just feel more confident with their humans and that they won't be left (at least until the other day with Satan). It is a massive win when that bond forms and you realise they trust that you wouldn't leave them.

I am feeling very sorry for Satan, but even more guilty that none of us picked up on it sooner when we knew she was bumping into things - honestly we just thought she was spaniel-ing and nose down not watching where she was going. She gave me lovely cuddles this morning though when I saw DMum (at least until she decided she had had enough cuddles and threw herself out of my arms). And by lovely cuddles I mean a whole 10 seconds of cuddles. But that's Satan for you - my mum can cuddle her for hours but the rest of us, even my dad, are lucky if we get 10 seconds.

As C&T says, it sounds like a really detailed and good call! Fingers crossed all these tablets etc do make P better! Dogs cost so much money but they really are 100% worth it, aren't they? I know what you mean about it not being a good life for her though, but let's hope it doesn't come to that❤Let us know how physio goes!

@CoubousAndTourmaIet people always wonder what breed she is because of her fur-cut! The longer fringe does a very good job of hiding the warts on her head. I do hate how when dogs get older so many get warts as I often find myself kissing Satan or Hen's warts instead of their head. Bleugh.

Does it take Brie long to dry out if she gets wet? Also, does she get wet dog smell? I've been wondering about this because retrievers and Satan seem to stink when they get wet, but I wonder if a dog bred for a more 'out-door' type life has the same sort of coat/whatever it is that makes others so