Puppy survival thread! All welcome!

[VanGoSunflowers]

Running on from our last one…

I won’t tag people because I will forget someone and then feel awful 😂

Personally, @VanGoSunflowers I would 100% avoid. I’ve heard ‘he’s snappy but he’d never hurt a fly’ too many times. It’s usually closely followed by ‘oh he’s never done that before!’

Socialisation is good for puppies, but not large numbers of dogs (on leads) that puppies don’t know. It can go very wrong, very quickly. Particularly if you have a large puppy who is a bit bouncy!

And if you are even marginally uncomfortable, don’t do it. Your instincts are there for a reason.

Better you let Pablo meet other dogs 1-2-1 first rather than a big group who are all close.

@LandSharksAnonymous thank you, I guess at least now I know the times they go so I can avoid!

Pablo regularly sees two dogs at the min, one is my friend’s greyhound whom I have known for nearly a decade (so I know she is very placid and tolerant but will give a little growl if she’s not happy) and the other is Ruby who’s energetic and playful and they get on beautifully. I think that’s enough for now. I don’t fancy standing around with them all for an hour anyway, that’s not enjoyable to me!

@VanGoSunflowers There’s a group of dog ‘walkers’ that congregate in the middle of the field near me. Most of the time they are too busy chatting that they don’t notice when their dogs have had a crap. I end up calling over from the other side of the field to let them know.
Most of the dogs are off lead and get balls thrown for them, or they mooch around by their owners. A young Vizsla was attacked a couple of months ago by the dogs. They took objection to him going over and chased him down as a pack, mauling him badly. I avoid these dogs!

@VanGoSunflowers I'd avoid too. For one, I would be bored shitless standing in the middle of a field for an hour. For two, I don't think Pablo is going to get much out of socialising with dogs all on leads. Especially if one is snappy and another is obsessed. For three, how much actual exercise are the dogs getting? No running or sniffing or exploring.

ETA - P would hate it. She doesn't like meeting groups of dogs. She's fine with one or two, but five would overwhelm her and she'd come and ask Mummy to pick her up.

Thanks @Nella68 and @SpanielsGalore
I don’t to be too judgemental obvs, and I’ve never watched them for the whole hour or anything so maybe they do actually do a ‘walk’ but I have never seen it!
It does make me wonder what people mean by socialisation when they say it - I thought that all happened prior to 16 weeks where you’re just introducing them to new sounds, smells, under paw textures and yes, dogs and people and other animals. After 16 weeks, I’m sure it’s a nice thing for a dog to have a run around with a mate, but maybe not strictly necessary? After all, part of what I am trying to do with P is to get him to walk past people and dogs and ignore them?

@VanGoSunflowers people seem to think dogs need friends, and they really don’t.

I also think a lot of people misunderstand socialisation - even experienced dog owners. They think socialisation is your dog having a huge game with lots of others all the time.

Yes, you want your dog to be friendly and not fearful. But you also don’t want you dog bothering everyone. It’s not so much socialisation as acclimation.

It goes back to that ‘people want different things from their dogs.’ Personally, I’d rather eat glass than stand in a field for an hour with my dog on a leash or chasing a ball. Honestly, I think it’s lazy dog ownership. Why get a dog if you don’t put any effort into walking it or training it? But to others it’s their ideal style of ownership - little engagement or interaction or effort going into their dog or its walks. As you can tell, I am incredibly judgemental 😂

It goes back to that ‘people want different things from their dogs.’ Personally, I’d rather eat glass than stand in a field for an hour with my dog on a leash or chasing a ball. Honestly, I think it’s lazy dog ownership. Why get a dog if you don’t put any effort into walking it or training it? But to others it’s their ideal style of ownership - little engagement or interaction or effort going into their dog or its walks. As you can tell, I am incredibly judgemental

Maybe I’m not judgemental enough 😂
In all seriousness though, I completely agree. I’ve said on here loads of times that one of my favourite thing to do with Pabs is walking somewhere new and/or stunning, him off lead and just taking it all in. Those walks we do we hardly ever see another soul. I want to spend time with him, not with a bunch of strangers chatting mundane shit in a field while we ignore our dogs.
I also really enjoy the walks we do over those fields as that’s where we do a bit of training and we focus on each other and it’s lovely. I’ve had some of my best moments over there when it’s been just us two!

I don't know if my thoughts count because, as you already know, I'm socially anxious and Brie is always on the lead, but I'm totally in agreement with @LandSharksAnonymous

I don't really understand the concept of dogs needing friends. Yes, they are pack animals but that only includes other dogs they live with. I know we've had the friends discussion before when Bupster was here - she has the opposite view and feels that Bill benefits from having friends. Which is fair enough. All pups are different and require different levels of stimulus. Just like humans.

We've had too many bad experiences of our PMD being attacked by dogs and the owners all too often excuse it on size grounds. So I'd be almost certain to end up coming into conflict - or, more likely - end up running away and never being able to walk that route again. It's not a risk I'm willing to take just so I can feel I'm socialising Brie. She is very sensitive and really hates dogs that bark at her, and I don't want to put her or myself through stress, so I avoid the groups of dog people that congregate on the meadow with their ball flingers. There are a couple of local dogs that she meets every so often and she gets along with, so we're happy with that.

I think Pablo is very content with his life with you and your son. He has his two doggy friends and that is probably enough for now.
But really, just trust your instincts on this. Only commit if you're sure, otherwise a friendly wave and hello is fine.

I'm judgemental and proud. 😂 Mostly only regards how people treat their dogs though. I judged someone registering their puppy at the vets last week for not knowing its DoB or colour. And the man wanting to rehome his 8 month old spaniel because it had chewed his sofa when left home alone.

We very rarely meet other people and dogs on walks. And if we do, the dogs usually say a quick hello and move on or ignore them totally. They don't play or run with strange dogs. I know they have each other, so it might be slightly different, but P was an only dog for nearly a year and she still wasn't interested in other dogs.

See I do like Rory to have doggy friends and I think it’s important that they learn how to greet other dogs nicely and wait to be given permission to do so. And that some dogs want to play, some want polite sniffs and some don’t want to be bothered at all. But standing in a field with a bunch of people and dogs on leads does not sound fun to me. If they keep asking if you, just say you’re not able to commit to a set time.

@VanGoSunflowers I’d probably feel the same as you but then I’m antisocial too. There use to be a group like that where I use to live when my last dog was a puppy. It seemed more about chatting and just wasn’t my thing but as mentioned, maybe that’s me being unfair. However I’ve always met up monthly with my breed specific walking group so once we’re fully vaccinated we’ll head up to that even though we can’t do the full walk whilst so small.

Another one saying listen to your instincts here! We accidentally joined up with a few people who regularly walked at the same time and it got difficult to manage with the mix of sizes, ages and personalities in the end (the dogs but also the owners haha!).

Luckily I found it was easier to get to a much better walking spot than I thought it was and we're tramping round woods and fields now, meeting others much more naturally and learning on / off lead greetings and recalls.

@VanGoSunflowers i know what you mean about the best walks being when it’s you and the dog and no one else! My best dog memories are the ones where I have taken mine out individually - there’s nothing quite like it.

I must say I’m glad it’s not just me who thinks standing around in a field for an hour sounds like their idea of hell!

Eris has just been returned. Apparently her and Satan had a delightful time digging up my parents flowerbeds 😁DMum was weeding, so digging weeds up, and they were following along behind her digging up the things - I.e plants - she left behind. Twatdog and the girls enjoyed a puppy free day but were still very excited to see her, but let’s see how long that lasts.

@LandSharksAnonymous Sounds like Eris had a lovely time with Satan. Not so sure about your Mum though.

@widewomanofthevillage That's exactly how we've done it. I haven't gone out of my way to meet other dogs, but learnt from greeting those we have met whilst out tramping around woods and fields. When she was little, I always asked if the dogs were alright with puppes and if K could say hello first. She's 11 months old and much more polite now, so I leave her to it. Unless it's an on lead dog and then I call her away.

@Idstillratherbepaddleboarding I agree it's important for dogs to learn to greet other dogs politely. And that they can't greet every dog they meet. But I think it depends on the dog as to whether or not they need a friend. P likes to say hello, but has never played with dogs on walks. She plays with K (but not N), but was also happy as an only dog. In fact, only 2 of my 6 dogs have ever played with dogs they don't live with. Perhaps I have taught them to be antisocial like me. 😂

Having said earlier we rarely meet other dogs on walks, we've just met 8. 3 labs, 2 JR, a cockerpoo and a little fluffy thing, who were all greeted politely and we moved on. The 8th dog was the most gorgeous, 5 month old GR. 💖 P politely said hello, but K had a whale of a time running round in big circles with him. He was almost fast enough to keep up with her.

5pm-6pm = puppy witching hour here! Exhausted & menopausal nerves totally frazzled by 6.05pm! Thinking I should have got a goldfish! 😩😂

Am I confusing you with someone else or are you a one breed person with Basset Hounds?
Our puppy witching hour was usually 9pm - 10pm...

Yes I’m the mad insane Basset Hound person. We’ve gone from being a Basset nursing home (geriatrics) to a toddler nursery. Bit of a gear change!! 😬 I’ve only ever had Bassets and grew up with them. Once grown up, they’re quite laid back which suits me! As a puppy, not so much! 😩

Aah. We bonded over a shared lifelong love of a single breed on a thread a few months back. I'm Pyrenean woman. I think I was CoubousAndTourmaIet then but I've had a few names 🙄
I'm very pleased you have your pup now.

I remember! 😊 yes she’s arrived. Forgot how full on the first few weeks are whilst awaiting second vaccination. It’s happening this week so we’re on the countdown. It’s felt like blooming lockdown again!! Although we have been going out for daily car rides and she’s a good little traveller so that’s good.

Bet she's gorgeously squishy @Houndymumma ❤

Oh the waiting to get them out is a pain, I know. But you're on the home straight now, it won't be long before she's out and about.

I could say I'm here under false pretences really, because Brie is 17 months, but emotionally she's still very much a puppy so it's all relevant.

IMHO learning to greet other dogs is a skill but yes, 'friends' are those they live with/regularly see. Our last dog spent a lot of time with my Mums dog (sadly both dogs gone now) but they both ignored any other dog they met when out, no aggression etc just carried on walking/ chasing their ball.

I feel Bert's biting has been a bit better today. I've started telling him to sit (because its the only thing he knows 😂) when he's biting then bending down to reward and play once he's sitting nicely. If he tries to bite again I stand up & get bitten but ignore him. I'm hoping it's reinforcing that he only gets my attention when he's not hanging off my arm or ankle.

Tomorrow I am back working so I will need to be stricter on his naps and start getting him to self settle in his crate. He sleeps well in there at night downstairs on his own without crying but does whimper when he's in there when we're eating, once he's finished his own meal and cries when we first go out but it stops as soon as we're out the door. His foster had him crate trained but I'm working on training him to take himself there on command.

Need to remember he's only been here 8 days....

@SpanielsGalore My parents had very different reactions! DMum was very annoyed. Apparently she kept saying ‘no’ and Eris would look guilty and lay down looking sad, and then two minutes later be digging again! My dad thought it was hilarious.

Golden Retrievers are surprisingly quick, even as young puppies! I keep a house line on mine so if I can’t grab the puppy I can grab the line 😂

@Houndymumma can we have a photo? 😍Bassets are one of those dogs I so rarely see, but love! Them and Pharaoh hounds! You and @cazinge have my sympathy though! The bite stage is awful. I’m just glad I have four other dogs and two DDs to sacrifice to the little piranha.

Been a while since I have posted, but I have been reading everyone’s updates.

Lavender pup was very bitey but that has improved a lot now she’s 4.5 months. As you all said, much better once those sharp baby teeth start to go, She doesn’t draw blood every day now 🤣

Very timely that you all posted about how your dogs behaved when you are eating. Pup has been in a pen when we eat because of the biting, but she now can potter around the kitchen . I was eating lunch and she was leaping up to get at my food. Obviously need to persist with doing that.

Morning - I have a question about cheese!

A bit of grated cheese is a firm favourite over here and I’ll put some in a slightly loosened fist if I’m brushing for example.

I read to you need to give in moderation - but is it okay to have a some every day? At the puppy training we did people were using squeezy cheese but haven’t done that - just a bit of cheddar….

We use some dog treats too - chicken/yoghurt ones and Millie’s WH fish ones - which tend to be more for training. Cheese is always the favourite though!

Any other good treat recommendations?

Cheese is fine @Flowerfusion I don't grate it, I slice it about half a centimetre thick, then cube the slices. We find that easier because the cubes can just go in a sandwich bag and it's less messy than grated.

We did try a tube of Primula, but Brie wasn't keen, although apparently most dogs love it. She just loves Cheddar. All our dogs have been cheese fiends, if ever they've been poorly and off their food, cheese on toast was always the solution for us.

We use the MW training treats too, both fish and turkey, also Core training treats in lamb with apple.

Our first trainer suggested cocktail sausages cut up but Brie preferred the cheese. To be truthful I was worried about additives in the sausages so I was glad she went for the cheese.